User talk:GW-Ali/Totem Axe Farmer

Favoured:
 * 1) Eddie-slow but steady; build does what it's supposed to.
 * 2) Finished mapping that area and got a few totems out of it in the process, good build --Dazra 13:53, 8 January 2007 (CST)
 * 3) ''Works for what it was designed for. Lojiin 14:19, 8 January 2007 (CST)
 * 4) ''If the Life Pods don't spawn this builds works wonders, I had a Totem axe on 4th kill. --DragonWR12LB 22:16, 19 January 2007 (CST)
 * 5) Works very well... I was easily able to clear most of the area in my first run with the build. I actually used Natural Stride to replace Escape (don't have Escape yet), and had no problems (Natural Stride actually works very well, as you can keep it up while you attack). Now if only I could get a stupid axe to drop... {Jioruji Derako} 05:40, 15 February 2007 (CST)
 * 6) Great build. Even if you don't get Totem Axe, you still get about 2k-3k from loot. Thumbs up! - [[Image:Zealous_Vow.jpg|19px]] (Abedeus) 13:51, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Unfavoured:


 * Ok, i'll clarfity this. Your using two prepartions, your using Intterupts on a Warrior, your using a bow on a Warrior using deflect arrows, you'll be outhealed by the Pods. I'm not even going to bother discussion this, it's absoultely horrible. Solus  [[image:Shield_of_Judgment.jpg|19px]] 23:14, 3 March 2007 (CST)
 * Solus, your edits to your original comment made user Jioruji Derako's responses quite confusing. I don't see quite why you'd want to do that. I went back into the history to find what you'd said originally, and Jioruji has a point. Perhaps you should respond to that, if indeed you can, rather than change your original comments. --Jawn Sno 11:42, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
 * "Totem Axe Boss"? What are you talking about? You get Totem Axes from Root Behemoths. And I can vouch that this build works, I just farmed yet another axe not half an hour ago with this build, never went below 50%hp, and killed half the monsters on the map (and all the Root Behemoths). {Jioruji Derako} 03:03, 2 March 2007 (CST)
 * Allow me to cross examine you here.
 * 1. Totem axe boss?  Try looking up Totem Axe and you'll see it drops from Root Behemoths.
 * 2. No damage preperations.  Hrm...  Lets see... 4 degen is 8 damage a second on top of your normal bow attacks  Kindle Arrows is the other one.  Against life Pods that does a ton of damage.
 * 3. Warrior Boss?  uuhh....  I'll just ignore that.  Last I checked there wasn't any stance removal at all there at all.  And you don't need the stances for fighting anyways.  You use them to get there.
 * 4. Flaws.  Well, I suggest you read the build, its usage notes, and then the discussion page.  Plain and simple this works.  I don't post anything without liberal testing, and experimentation on my part.
 * Edit: 5. You complain about interupts.  While you don't NEED them to kill the life pods, they are a real time saver.Kelvin Greyheart 18:28, 3 March 2007 (CST)
 * In response to the clarification then - please, take the time to read through the build's useage notes. The interrupts aren't for the warriors, the Deflect arrows stance gets canceled the moment they activate it (root behemoths attack at longbow range too), and you use the second preperation to kill the Life Pods (they can't out-heal you if you follow the build's instructions, and I've even disregarded the instructions, aggro'd three or four Pods at once, and still wiped the entire group). If you need further proof, I'll simply record a farming run with FRAPs and post a link. {Jioruji Derako} 23:25, 3 March 2007 (CST)
 * To jioruji: If you have the time please make a recording.  I can't seem to get my system to run any recording software right now without 5 second + lag.  I'm working on it but  To Solus:  Have you even tried this build?   Your first comment made absolutely no sense whatsoever, and it appeared you didn't even read the usage notes.  Allow me to once again cross examine your vote.
 * 1. The interupts are there to prevent the life pods from using any healing skills which makes it very easy to kill them.
 * 2. The poision is there specificly to kill root behemoths and help with wind riders.  You attackt the roots from longbow range, so you dont aggro any life pods.  If your on a hill they can't hit back, which does mean that deflect arrows won't end.  BUT, they are poisioned all the time, and even if you somehow miss a bunch of shots and the poision wears off, they still dont regenerate since you are attacking them.  It is not a fast kill by ANY means, but it is effective nonetheless.
 * 3. Kindle arrows converts all your damage to fire damage, which allows you to do MASSIVE hits on life pods.  I've hit a pod for almost 140 on a crit when you add the bonus damage and the normal bow together.  If you read the usage notes it says to creep forward and slowly aggro one at a time.  This makes killing them easy when combined with the damage, and interupts.
 * 4. If this build is so flawed would you mind making a suggestion as to improvement?  I will demonstrate it for you if you do not belive that it is effective.
 * Edit: Once again I forgot so sign.  Off topic, but is there a way I can set things to automaticaly do that?  Tell me on my user page. Kelvin Greyheart 20:55, 4 March 2007 (CST)

Discussion
This Is a build that I came up with for "exploring" The Falls on my ranger. I had heard about the totem axes in there and had an idea. I was having real problems running through all the degen for exploration so I thought. "Why not just kill everything that is proving to be a pain. And get some free axes while I'm at it." The wind riders are a pain that have no counter that I can think of for solo farming, but other than that this has worked for me pretty effectively. This is my first post here so if you have any suggestions for improvement on my post I'm all ears. Kelvin Greyheart 22:46, 3 January 2007 (CST)

Ok figured out the comment system so now it says untested. I'm still new to the formatting here but the help pages are very good. GJ everyone who slaved away on those things. Kelvin Greyheart 23:04, 3 January 2007 (CST)

I've run a build similar to this to farm axes and it works fairly well. I don't see the need for 2 preparations though as you can only have 1 active at a time. Keeping apply poison up and adding another bow attack for damage seems, at least to me, to work out faster. Lojiin 12:24, 4 January 2007 (CST)

The reason for two preperations is a bit of a personal preference. Poison is helfup for hit and run on the wind riders, but if you aggro 2 Life Pods at once they use mend condition on eachother which when stacked with their already decent healing enables two to stalemate you indefinitely unless you can interupt one and finish off the other which is not worth the effort for me. The fire damage also allows you to hit them VERY hard because they are week to fire. It wastes a skill slot but I have found it to be a time saver over other strategies. The poison also lets you mow down groups of scale rather fast by just attacking them once to apply it and moving on to the next in the group, then repeat. Like I said, personal preference, as It really doesn't affect the playing style of the build. Kelvin Greyheart 14:47, 4 January 2007 (CST)

Makes sense I suppose. Personally I don't usually bother to kill the life pods using the speed boosting stances to lose aggro. The only time I've found that to be problematic is if there are 2 behemoths close to each other (i.e. within aggro range of each other) which doesns't happen very often (at least so far for me). Lojiin 15:03, 4 January 2007 (CST)

Youv'e never had the life pods chase you? Even with speed stances and them completely off my minimap they have pursued me forever in the past on several occasions. I haven't done this lately because I'm not exactly craving cash but last 3 times I did it towards the end of the run 3 pods popped up and I could outrun them, but they kept chasing. Had to stop after that because I couldn't kill the roots with them healing. Kelvin Greyheart 15:31, 4 January 2007 (CST)

No, though I don't regularly do this run. There was an AI bug that caused infinite aggro though I don't know if that was related or not. Other than that, no, I hit a speed stance and by the time they finished popping up I was out of aggro and they didn't chase me. Lojiin 15:43, 4 January 2007 (CST)

I haven't tested it yet, but I would presume that just a tiny bit more damage output would be necessary. Would the build be changed to much for the worse if distracting shot were replaced with power shot? Or are two hard interrupts necessary? It would seem like there would be some variations needed, especially if farming somewhere like Marga Coast.--Nog64 15:39, 6 January 2007 (CST)
 * Hi!
 * I am adding here first so.. In my opinion s the build best with little bit practise: Dodge,Zojuns Haste, Kindle arrows, Poison arrow, Dual shot, Distracting shot, Fav. winds, Troll.. with attributes: Markmanship:10+3+1, Expertise 10+1, Wildness Survival 10+1.
 * I tested and played for a few hours.... &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 91.127.57.5 (contribs) 18:05, 6 January 2007.

I've run a very similar build and technique for Totem Axe farming, and it works well. My variation was R/Me, using Storm Chaser instead of one of the shorter dodge/run skills to keep a constant run. The mesmer skills were Hex Breaker and Mantra of Resolve in place of Savage Shot and Kindle Arrows, which allowed for solo'ing of the Wind Riders as well. Zdain 17:05, 6 January 2007 (CST)

Errrr, why not dual shot + forked arrow in stead of zojun's and apply? (I tend to run 14 expertise for my bow R builds though >_>) -Ichigo724 04:45, 7 January 2007 (CST)

Escape is compleatly unnecessary becasue bouth Dodge and Zojun's Haste also evade projectiles so(72% at lvl. 14 expertise) it is very unlikely you will become cripeld and if you do the criple from spiders is very short, not long enough for the trolls to kill you. Personaly i use Dodge, Zojun's Haste, Storm Chasers, Poison Arrow, Kindle arrows, Troll Ungent, Dual Shot, Flurry/Frenzy.---Glass 13:31, 7 January 2007 (CST)

Storm Chaser works, but I prefer Escape simply because it makes the run faster allowing for a nonstop speed boost as well as a permanent dodge chance on projectiles. And also If you get in trouble with some trolls you can activate it and (maybe) get away. I like two interupts becuase if you agro multiple Life Pods you can shut one of them down for a bit with Distracting Shot and then Savage Shot the other one. Damage output isnt really a concern because the Root Behemoths are all easily killed with poision, kindle, or just attacking them, and kindle arrows cuts through life pods very fast. The poision is good for taking down the wind riders. I have used R/Me with great effectivness, but if you aggro several Wind Riders at once you're still going to be reduced to hit and run attacks due to energy management issues. If you want to stick that under variants I'd be for it, though my original idea here was to be R/any. *sigh* No matter what you do the wind riders are going to be a hassle. Even with Melandru's Resilience they will still be able to kill you quite effectively. I've tried swapping out an interupt and escape for melandru's resilience and storm chaser. It makes wind riders more managable, but they are still a pain. Kelvin Greyheart 20:00, 7 January 2007 (CST)

Hmm, how many life pods can this build take btw? -Ichigo724 14:10, 8 January 2007 (CST)

This versus [Build:W/R Melandru's Resilience Totem Axe Farmer|that other one]
Since this build more or less has the same function (farm axes), the decision must be made: which one is better? Which one is easier to use and which one generally clears out a group faster with more survivability? --Mgrinshpon 22:18, 7 January 2007 (CST)


 * Does it really? There are like 3 builds for vermin farming already 'favored', and I'd rather have the 2 to 3 Totem Axes this run nets any day than a Shreader's and some gold. UW farming even worse. There are even 2 for Rajazan's.  As long as the primary classes are different, I see no reason to limit the builds to 'just one per thingie', nor much precedent. In fact, for players that only have one or two characters in a given place (even I haven't brought all 10 of mine through each continent) a build to accomplish a goal for each class wouldn't be a bad thing at all. My only problem with this build as it stands (and the reason I haven't voted for it yet) is I think the formatting is atrocious and I'm not really in the mood to fix it atm. -Zdain 22:46, 7 January 2007 (CST)
 * QFT "As long as the primary classes are different, I see no reason to limit the builds...". I agree, if it works well, and is a different primary and concept, keep it. I'll try to make time to test tonight. -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 10:59, 8 January 2007 (CST)
 * I also agree. While the ultimate goal is the same there are numerous ways to accomplish this.  Pardon me, but I find that equivalent to saying that all 55 builds should be on one page.  Youve got 55 mes, 55 monk, 55 ele.  The list goes on.  All have strenghts and weaknesses, a different playing style, and a different skill set (minus the 55 generic skills). Kelvin Greyheart 18:33, 8 January 2007 (CST)
 * Don't forget that some players doesn't have all 10 primary professions. Some players do but deffinitely not everyone. --- Arthas 23:31, 26 March 2007

i prefer a build of: Poison Arrow/Savage Shot/Forked Arrow/Kindle Arrows/Troll Unguent/Storm Chaser/Dodge/Zojun's Haste for several reasons: 1) no need to switch from kindle to apply to get poison on your target 2) the running skills are more than enough to get there without the added evasion from escape 3) forked arrow (or dual shot, if no nightfall) followed by savage shot adds a lot of spike dmg with kindle on, enough to take out a life pod in a single combo (even if there is a group of 6) anyway, just my opinion. &mdash; 14:39, 8 January 2007 (CST)


 * I like that as an idea. *note to self:  cap poision shot.  XD*.  Anyways regarging my "atrocious format", this is my first post (or whatever you wish to call it) on guildwiki.  As I said at the beggining of the article, any tips anyone can throw my way regarding I'll listen.  I am on several forums and all are different with regards formatting rules and how to type them in, so I went with something simple that didnt require any advanced knowledge of the formatting tools available here.  I apologize it its not up to standards.  I did the best I could on it at the time.  If someone tells me what they do to fix my post I will be greatly apreciative.  Kelvin Greyheart 18:33, 8 January 2007 (CST)
 * My apologies if I caused offense, as I said, the content is good and it's honestly up to the community (e.g. me or others) who have dabbled with wiki formatting more to fix it. You'll get to do it on other articles later ;) My main issue is it's just hard to read without paragraphs. --Zdain 20:36, 8 January 2007 (CST)

Completed a general reformat of the article in response to clean-up tag. Added links. Added reference to Fiery bow string. Removed tag. --Ali 15:14, 10 January 2007 (CST)

Apparently I was not signed in when I saved the edited article. I know I did sign in earlier - the system must have logged me off when I went to have lunch. --Ali 15:29, 10 January 2007 (CST)

Poision Shot
I have done what I deem full testing using poision shot. Swap out escape for storm chaser and add poision shot instead of apply poision. I'll agree that it works and can be more effective when taking out wind riders. I still prefer escape though, probably just out of habbit. I know I'm late on this, but I thought I'd give a pat on the back to whoever suggested that. Never would have crossed my mind. Kelvin Greyheart 00:41, 20 January 2007 (CST)

Ignite vs. Kinddle
I would just like to point out that ingite arrows doesnt do as much damage Kindle. The whole reason I bring ignite is to take out the Life Pods. Since deflect arrows doesn't last particularly long and most of the damage done to the Root Behomoths is through poison. I fail to see why ignite is superior here. I'm sticking it back. If you disagree please tell us, give reasons, and give us a chance to support or refute your statement before changing it. Kelvin Greyheart 10:14, 23 January 2007 (CST)
 * I changed Kindle to Ignite for the following reason: Ignite arrows does damage to the Roots even if they block your arrows, Kindle Arrows requires that the arrows actually hit. So Ignite has a higer DPS than Kindle. I have tried both and Ignite is much more efficient as it still does damage if the arrow misses. Also if you fight a group of bogs it can damage them all with one shot. Also the difference in damage is only one point so I do not see a reason to bring Kindle. --DragonWR12LB 01:46, 24 January 2007 (CST)
 * I have not done this run in a while so I may be wrong here due to recent patches, AI changes, etc. The reason I always used kindle is because you don't need the fire bow string.  Also (and this has not been completely and successfuly verified in my experience) it seems that with ignite I sometimes get the dreaded AOE scatter effect.  Against Life Pods this is a real pain because they usually run away and then you have to chase them, causing the others to pop up and start healing.  I'll do some runs over the next week or so (have to wait till after the drop weekends over), but as far as I know the AOE problem with Ignite still causes problems occasionally.  I have never run across this problem with Kindle. One final note.  Unless you have a bow with fire damage, Ignite will end up doing dramaticly less damage than Kindle because it doesnt change the damage your arrows do themselves. Kelvin Greyheart 20:10, 25 January 2007 (CST)
 * Ignite will cause scatter Kindle won't therefore Kindle would be better here. --Heurist 15:51, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Ignite is VERY useful against bunched up enemys like Scales and life pods when you use it together with Forked Arrow or Dual Shot since ignite hit twice on all enemys. While fighting Root's you will use kindle. --- Arthas 23:35, 26 March 2007

Natural Stride
just wanted to point out to people who care about this that with a bar of Dodge|Natural Stride|Zojun's Haste you can keep up a 33% run AND have evade continuously. This also free's your elite for something else. Obviously, this isn't going to help with Windriders (hex), but I think the only thing which can hex you on the run are the scarabs. Skales hex as well, but are fairly to kill. -- Oblio (talk) 10:36, 24 January 2007 (CST)
 * Scales hex? Thought that that was just rotting flesh, which gives you disease, which is a condition and not a hex so it shouldnt break the stance.  Am I forgetting something or have they given scales some new skill in the last month? Kelvin Greyheart 20:12, 25 January 2007 (CST)
 * Well, I haven't done this run for a while (which I was doing with a W/R Melandru's runner), but pre-oct25 ai nerf, they were playing with some stuff (concussion shot changes, etc.) around that time, I was getting hexed fighting skales. I don't think it was just Sewp Darktooth, and I know that the wiki doesn't list Jungle Scales as having a hex.  If I have time I'll try it again to verify. -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 01:44, 26 January 2007 (CST)
 * Definitely bad for trying to farm the Wind Riders should you try that route but it's still a nice skill.--[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  07:21, 26 January 2007 (CST)
 * Assuming that I'm right in beliving that scales don't hex. Even against wind riders thats not really an issue.  Your doing hit and run agains them anyways and dodge and zojun's should be way more than enough to break aggro.  If not you have at LEAST 17 seconds to get outside casting range and by then phantasm will have worn off.  natural stride and off you go.  Need to do some testing, but I thought I'd throw this in as my $0.02 so anyone else who wants to fool around with it can try it. Kelvin Greyheart 21:52, 29 January 2007 (CST)
 * The only thing I don't like about Natural Stride is it only has a 50% block rate. That makes it twice as likely to get pinned down. Alinius 12:23, 31 January 2007 (CST)
 * Or poisoned too but as I haven't tried Natural Stride here I don't know how good/bad it really is (and another reason I didn't vote).--[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  08:29, 1 February 2007 (CST)
 * Just my $0.02. You'll be poisioned almost all the time anyways because its duration isn't anything to laugh at.  The only thing that really bothers you with natural stride is that youll be crippled often.  Its still better than storm chaser though. Kelvin Greyheart 14:53, 1 February 2007 (CST)
 * Crippled often? No more then usual, I don't think. You've got at least a 50% block rate for the duration of the run, and that normally does a good job keeping the cripples away (in my experience, at least). It's definately a better choice then Storm Chaser and Whirling Defense, and I think it being a non-Elite makes it pretty much on-par with Escape for this build's purposes (Burning Arrow really speeds the build up, and helps against Life Pods especially). --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jioruji Derako.> 02:52, 18 March 2007 (CDT)
 * You will be crippled during the run if you use natural stride. But hey, we are talking about 3 seconds at most. Not even worth bothering. Its a much better choice than Escape since you free up your elite slot --- Arthas 23:38, 26 March 2007

Random Additions
I used the build as is, and it works fine, but I can't resist the urge to tweak. First, a poisonous recurve bow works best against the Wind Riders due to the way they always move around. Second, if you can make the run with just escape and dodge(or Natural Stride), you can swap Zojin's Haste for Lightning Reflexes to up your DPS. Third, Dropping Marksmanship 1 point, and bumping Wilderness and Expertise up 1 point each yields a little more damage overall. Alinius 12:19, 31 January 2007 (CST)
 * Aye, Recurve works on the riders. But you MUST have a flatbow or a longbow to get at the roots without aggroing the pods unless your on a hill, and thats not always guarenteed.  Its more likely to hit, so if you stand there it will work better but I prefer to attack and get their attention and start moving away so they start are easier to break aggro on and then I hit one of them a few times and make sure it will die then pull a monty python and RUN AWAY RUN AWAY!!, and then heal up, repeat.  I've tried both and as far as I can tell they both work just as well.  As with the escape its what I'm used too so for me its still just a smidge more effective.  If you want to you could add that in somehweres.  I'll not stand in the way, but I won't add it myself because I personaly don't use it. Kelvin Greyheart 16:10, 31 January 2007 (CST)
 * Agreed, the recurve bow is only for the wind riders, firey flatbow for everything else. Even playing hit and run with them, it makes life a lot easier. Alinius 10:35, 2 February 2007 (CST)
 * I use Screaming Shot instead of Savage Shot in order to get two degens on the Wind Riders. I also use Poison Arrow as suggested above, have used Storm Chaser as a substitute for the elite Escape.  Haven't had much trouble with it since the Spiders' Cripple doesn't last very long.  Will have to look closer at Natural Stride.  I've had four axes drop so far, in about 10 tries. &mdash;  Ali ( talk )  14:54, 15 February 2007 (CST)

Armor Of Mist?
It would be possible to use a R/E, with Armor of Mist instead of Escape, thus freeing up the Elite slot for Poison Arrow (which would replace Apply Poison). To keep a constant speed bonus, you would need only 3 water magic, and 12 Expertise (giving your 3 running skills durations of 10 seconds each). As the major damage dealers of this build would use Wilderness Survival, I would recommend the sup rune being placed on that, giving a more powerful kindle arrow, a better heal (Troll Unguent), and longer poison duration. Marksmanship can be kept to the minimum of what your bow requires (9, in my case). Off to test this build now. 83.200.250.242 09:02, 21 February 2007 (CST)
 * Whoops! Completely forgot about that very annoying 2 second casting time.  Oh well. 83.200.250.242 09:20, 21 February 2007 (CST)

Video of the build in Action
Well, I recorded one of my runs... two, actually, but the first time around FRAPs didn't actually turn on, so nothing got recorded. :( Anyway, for some strange reason, Guild Wars seems to know if you're recording, and bumps up the A.I. as a little present. For some reason, I made just about ever single possible mistake while recording, and took twice as long to get past the first half (don't even ask about the second half, I accidentally aggro'd about five groups of Life Pods all at once). I'll either edit the current video for time, because it's so long, or I'll just record my next run. Either way, I think I managed to prove that the build works, no matter the skill level of the user... even managed to beat groups of three Life Pods at once, after absentmindedly aggroing them all at once in the first place. :( -- Jioruji Derako.> 09:16, 5 March 2007 (CST)
 * Alright, I'm not really in the mood to edit out my mistakes from the last video, so I'm going to do another run today. I don't think I'll make as many stupid mistakes this time, I should have something uploaded and linked soon enough. :D --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jioruji Derako.> 10:46, 9 March 2007 (CST)