User talk:Dazra/buildarchive/Build:W/any Flailing Dragon/Archive 1

Rate-a-build
Please note that this is a build in the PVE category before voting.

Favored:
 * 1) Excellent skill synergy, good damage output, and solid self-healing. BigAstro 17:35, 4 December 2006 (CST)
 * 2) Great build, consistently high dps and more than adequate healing -- Hyperion` 21:44, 7 December 2006 (CST)
 * 3) Very similar to what my warrior has been running, and a very fun build it is. Arshay Duskbrow 22:23, 7 December 2006 (CST)

Unfavored:
 * 1) (your vote here)

Discussion
I didn't have a good name for this, so I did the usual thing and just jammed some skill names together. Feel free to suggest one you think is better. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 03:54, 19 November 2006 (CST)
 * Good concept I'd say. The article page is a bit overloaded with information, but I guess that'll get edited before we go tested (or I might do that later). ~ Nilles (chat) 17:18, 19 November 2006 (CST)
 * What needs to be pared down? Equipment? &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 17:25, 19 November 2006 (CST)
 * Yes. Equipment, Usage, maybe even the optionals below the skill bar. I'd also use bullets in the variants section and set the "v" in "PVE" to lower case. ~ Nilles (chat) 18:12, 19 November 2006 (CST)
 * Tweaked it. Not sure what to do about the Usage notes, though, as I think there are some nuances to mixing Flail/Charge that aren't altogether transparent at first glance. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 18:25, 19 November 2006 (CST)
 * That's true. I think it's ok now. ~ Nilles (msg) 18:54, 19 November 2006 (CST)
 * Cool. Care to elaborate a bit more on the concept? Anything in particular that you'd like clarified or that you think needs changing? &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 15:02, 20 November 2006 (CST)

Well, I can try to review the build, I think. ;) The combination of Enraging Charge and Flail is a very good choice with high synergies. The same goes for the combination of Sun&Moon and Dragon Slash. I estimate the damage of both IAS and high adrenal gain to be quite high, too. That makes the build very strong on the offense side. Taking Lion's Comfort as self-heal is a very good choice, too. It's healing about the same amount as healing sig, but activates faster and doesn't have any armor drawbacks. The optional slot leaves an opportunity to improvise without sacrificing any of the advantages. Last but not least it has a res and can possibly make a decent pally, taking Rebirth and Purge Conditions for example. I don't see any big disadvantages, really. The disadvantage you're possibly facing is in deep luxon and deep kurzick areas where ritualists use soothing to a great extend. That can severly cripple both self-healing and damage. I'm reluctant to vote for it for one reason: I can't play-test it. I don't even have gw installed. I'll put this on my notepad though and come back to it eventually. I think I can test it before christmas, that should be soon enough to prevent it from getting deleted due to inactivity. ~ Nilles (msg) 04:19, 21 November 2006 (CST)

I had a chance to test this after I myself figured out the synergy combo of Sun and Moon/Dragon Slash. At first I was using a completely different skill set, but then tested this one out. As with my first build, this has a lot of greatness between Sun and Moon Slash and Dragon Slash. However, using the Enraging / Flail combo is not all its made up to be. It works the first time, and thats about it - subsequent uses seem to be more bother than they're worth. With PvE in mind, I tweaked it to make the following:

This turned out a lot better. You still start off with a big boost in adrenaline by using For Great Justice before you stike with Enraging, but you can also use Plague touch to add a condition to your spike if one is placed on you. Beyond that, having endure pain is good for those times when you NEED health but Lions Comfort just has not charged yet.

I know this is a PvE build, but after testing this here, I took the build to RA and AB. In RA I used the same build to great success, and in AB I switched out Rez for Bulls strike to combo with enraging charge. This kept my adrenaline up, stopped kiting, and did some extra damage. The rest was history.

So if everyone else agrees this tweak ends up working better, I'll cast my vote as favoured, otherwise I'm going to have to say the build as posted now is just too difficult to get around.

P.S. [I can post the proper equipment up here too if this ends up working] Kyu Yasaruka 23:16, 30 November 2006 (CST)


 * No Flail? Don't you see Sun and Moon, FGJ, and Dragon Slash on your skill bar just crying out for IAS? The damage boost is tremendous. You should try to put yourself in the thick of battle with the first Charge, such that even your Flail-impeded movement makes it only take 1-2 seconds to switch to a new foe. Given how melee groups and caster groups both bunch up in PVE, this should rarely be a problem as long as your team isn't causing them to scatter. You can reliably whittle down PVE enemies' frontline or totally rampage through their backline depending on what tactic is best for the situation. I understand that you can find yourslef in situations where you've temporarily crippled yourself, but taking out Flail is shaving off a lot of damage. Part of the trick is knowing when not to reactivate it or when to reactivate it early, too. FGJ and Enraging Charge both recharge in 20 seconds but Flail lasts for just over half that long... if you think you'll be done with all nearby enemies before Enraging Charge recycles, don't hit Flail again. If you're only rushing a group of 2-3 monsters, don't hit Flail at all. When you're waling on a clump of six casters, though, the extra damage and adrenaline gain is really important.
 * Plague Touch is what I usually run in the optional slot.
 * If you're making this into a PVP build, change it more. You really don't want Lion's Comfort on an RA or TA PVP build, since it blots out Res Signet when you use it. Also, the problem with only using Enraging Charge is that you're completely unable to chase with it: once you hit the target once... boom, speeds are equal. Watch out for that, of course.
 * &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 01:44, 1 December 2006 (CST)


 * Good Point, I'll retest in PvE.
 * For RA and TA I never really noticed the Lion's Comfort Blotting out rez, but that IS a big problem. I guess with RA and TA I'd use Healing Signet as opposed to Lions Comfort.
 * For AB, the build as fine as is, because if you use Bull's Strike + Enraging Charge, you catch up and knock them down so it handles kiting pretty well. Also, Plague Touching cripple onto those pesky slowdown Rangers is hella fun.Kyu Yasaruka 08:36, 1 December 2006 (CST)
 * If you go with Healing Sig, try boosting Tactics to 11 and putting Strength at 9. That won't affect the breakpoints very much but will give you another ~15 points of health for every sig use. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 11:20, 1 December 2006 (CST)
 * Looks nice. Will test it when I get Dragon Slash, was thinking of running a similar build. Was stupid enough to use an axe version of this (including the adrenaline buffing skills still) in ABs...adrenaline denial completely destroys it! :D But most definitely excellent for PvE, where as you mentioned adrenaline denial is less common. The speed at which you gain adrenaline means you can heal for over 100hp about every 5 seconds or so, which is way better than Healing Signet as you don't lose the armour while casting it. This build also looks as though it'll deal out a hefty amount of damage. Am looking forward to trying it. -- Hyperion` 20:18, 1 December 2006 (CST)
 * Yup. Dragon Slash is awesome for that. It's a lot faster than 100 hp every 5 seconds if you're healing while using Flail and FGJ, too. Though that's only happening sometimes, so 100 hp every 5 seconds is a good ballpark for the overall rate. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 04:09, 3 December 2006 (CST)

As far as I'm aware, for a build to be vetted the difference between favoured votes and unfavoured votes must be at least +3, which this build has. Therefore it's time this became a tested build. -- Hyperion` 04:43, 8 December 2006 (CST)
 * Correct. I went and uncommented the categories at the bottom of the page, too. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 05:48, 8 December 2006 (CST)

Make it W/N?
90% of the time, Plague Touch is supposed to live in that optional slot. Mending Touch and a bunch of other skills work equally well, though. Should I make this build W/N or leave it W/any? &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 18:12, 4 December 2006 (CST)
 * I would leave it W/Any. I think it's clear enough from your notes that the optional slot is meant to be a good utility skill based on what enemies you'll be facing. BigAstro 19:10, 4 December 2006 (CST)
 * Leave it a W/any. Personally, I'd prefer a monk secondary for the purpose of rebirth. ~ Nilles (msg) 06:57, 5 December 2006 (CST)

Thanks for the input, folks! I'll leave it W/any as suggested. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 07:06, 6 December 2006 (CST)
 * But you could add such a 'GW skill template code' (as W/N with Res signet and Plague Touch) for the lazy users like me ;D --Birchwooda Treehug 23:48, 14 December 2006 (CST)
 * Done! &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 04:22, 17 December 2006 (CST)

A mildly crazy idea.
I just realized that you can get pretty good energy regeneration when you're spamming the two attack skills with this build and a Zealous weapon. As such, I've been playing with what to do with that energy... it's actually pretty awesome. Suffice it to say, you can trade some of the self-sufficiency for massive utility. I'm still toying with concepts (and shopping for a Kaolin Blade... if I'm gonna spend hours refining the build, I want to look cool doing it), so, err, stay tuned... &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 21:45, 10 December 2006 (CST)
 * Okay, I've tested some stuff and come up with a nice configuration... putting it in Build:W/any Flailing Dragon/Warmonger Variant for now. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 04:04, 17 December 2006 (CST)

Variant comments
I separated it into its own page because it's just plain significantly harder to describe than the original build. This is a modification that works really well just about anywhere other than Nightfallen Jahai (where the original build also falls down pretty flat). I'm still having trouble explaining exactly how to use it most effectively, as it's kinda an intuitive thing, but, well, I've been messing with getting it just right for a while and all I can say is that it's really effective if you have some dependable (hero/hench-quality) support. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 04:42, 17 December 2006 (CST)

An impromptu poll:

Keep variant as subpage:
 * 1) (add your reasons)

Fill in variant and split as its own build:
 * 1) (add your reasons)

Trip down variant and merge with main article:
 * 1) Definately do this. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 00:28, 27 December 2006 (CST)