Talk:Hard Mode/Archive2

/Archive 1 - before hard mode was introduced

/Drop Rate | /Access | /Items | /Monster & NPC Skills, AI, and items = Access-related discussions =

Grouping
= Item-related discussions =

Shing Jea and Istan Greens
I'm wondering what will be of the greens in Istan and Shing Jea in hard mode since the bosses will not be such a low level in it. I will try to get around to it and farm Tahkayun Tsi but I might not be able to do it until later so if anyone finds out later, feel free to post it here if I haven't already. Soultwister 21:53, 19 April 2007 (CDT)

I'm trying right now but it is proving difficult, since the Monitors can heal like crazy (Shield of Regen!) and Tahkayun Tsi is level 27!) Soultwister 22:47, 19 April 2007 (CDT)

I was able to get the Deathkeeper of off Yunlai Deathkeeper in Sunqua Vale last night in Hard Mode. It's stats were exactly the same as the Normal Mode version. Cerebus

Thanks, thats pretty stupid, fighting a level 27 boss only to get a weapon that does not have any use at all, other then being good for newly made characters. Soultwister 18:37, 20 April 2007 (CDT) = NPC/Enemy skill set/behavior related discussions =

Monster Pages
All monster pages will need to be updated with Hard Mode info. If I may suggest a method... My example would be how monsters such as this one are currently displayed.
 * Add a second set of levels below the first set, showing possible levels in hard mode.
 * Add a second list of skills under the first set, showing skills by level in hard mode.

A Bot would probably be best suited to the task of creating these new places to enter data on each Monster Page. --   09:23, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * There's enough horizontal space that I think hard mode data in the article should be a separate column, instead of taking more vertical space. -User:PanSola (talk to the [[Image:follower of Lyssa.png]]) 09:25, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Works for me... Just make sure somebody does it before everybody starts updating each article the way they think looks best, so it's all uniform. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    09:41, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I'm willing to update pages as needed, so far i've just made a note on Suneh Stormbringer at the bottom of the page on the skill setting and made a note of the xp bonus given from Plant Hunt. let me know if its ok or you want it changed.  tyvm  Ferdoc 11:25, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

= Drop rate related discussions =

What?
= Misc discussions =

Bug Tag
There has been a lot of confusion about what you need to do in order to access hard mode on characters that haven't completed a particular chapter. If it's not a bug that you need to log in on a character that has, there should at least be a note mentioning it. Mercurius Ter Maxim 05:24, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * According to GWW it is. That could mean it really is a bug since we know anet wants to use GWW for documentation. Argel 10:11, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

I found that also animals count, such as moa birds

Variation
Would have been more fun with a little more variation in names and such...like: Elder Devourer Elite Charr Ancient Scarab Just some new names to add some variety and a feeling of fighting new monsters :) (Soulflame 06:32, 20 April 2007 (CDT))
 * While that would make the game seem more cool... I don't think they're trying to make it seem a totally new game, just a harder, perhaps more realistic version of normal mode. (How can lvl 5 Ascalonian npcs have foughten the Krytan npcs who are so much stronger than them in the 'Guild Wars'.) With the monsters all more powerful, and the same names, it depicts a more realistic version of the game instead of your little elementalist being able to destroy an entire charr legion by themselves. Alreajk 16:47, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Leprechaun
User Leprechaun copy/pasted 68 times "Changes to normal mode". Someone wanna reverse that and punish that "funny" user? &mdash; Abedeus   09:54, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

= Lock =

Locked Chests
Would someone mind adding a section on the Locked Chests, please? I was wondering what kind of treasure chests Hard Mode had to offer. I had to go to the Lockpick, and then from there search for "Locked Chests" to get my answer. (I'd add it myself, but I haven't even touched Hard Mode yet. ^_^;) Gwen Shadowsound 11:09, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I think we really shouldn't and something here about the locked chests. It should be, imho, a seperate page dealing with the drops.  in case you're wondering, my party of 3 ppl 1 hero in plains of jarin encountered 3 locked chests.  out of the 9 drops from the chests 7 golds 2 grapes.  5 golds were maxed stats w/ non max mods.  2 golds were non maxed w/ non max mods.  the 2 graps were max w/ non max mods.  Lowest req from our run was 10, highest 12.  maybe we should actually work on one of those chest drops pages from the statistic project?  Ferdoc 11:29, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, yeah. Sorry, that's not what I meant. Drop rates should stay on their separate pages. What I meant was that someone should add a little line saying that, for example, "A chest in Hard Mode will always be labeled as a Locked Chest, regardless of the region." But I don't even know if that's true yet, which is why I haven't added it. Gwen Shadowsound 18:54, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Lockpicking
Just a brief voicing of my opinion. I don't care for titles influencing gameplay like this. Luck title is very bad because of the scenseless grinding required to attain it. Treasure hunter is bad because of it being character based, not account based. I also am still not a fan of salvage skill being based on character based titles. It your salvage skill is going to be effected by treasure hunter and wisdom, then treasure hunter and wisdom should be account based. The only title effects I approve of are sunspear and lightbringer. But at the same time I dissaprove of PvE only skills. Just the opinion of a single vocal minority... so I guess it doesn't matter. However, I do like that they consolidated keys into just one type for hard. --Mooseyfate 13:43, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Yeah, it sucks that I have to storage, log out and log in as my monk if I want to salvage valuable items, she is the only character with any sort of high Wisdom, these should be based on my account. I am also not sure I like Sunspear and Lightbringer being per character, I am getting a bit tired of grinding for those titles so I can play my 8th character through game. While on the subject, Skill Hunter should also be per account, there is no sane (outside of wanting the title) reason that any character would need all the Elites from all the professions, I should only need to have each skill once to have the title across my account (though that creates problems if I delete a character). --Heurist 14:57, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Lockpicks vs skill tombs contradiction
I get why they have lockpicks instead of different keys for different areas. I'm a big fan of this fact. However, it would be nice if they followed the same philosophy for skill tombs. It makes sence that rangers drop ranger skill tombs, that's for sure. But it seems like it would be nice to follow the philosophy of not needing a bounch of different (keys) to not needing a bounch of different (tomes). Like I said, it makes less sense for a ranger to drop a monk tomes, but it also makes less sence that soul reaping only triggers every 5 seconds or that loot drop varies based on party size (my point here being sometimes GW favors making sense over gameplay, and sometimes they favor gameplay over making sense). This is really not so much a critique or complaint, more of an observation. --Mooseyfate 13:50, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Uhm, it's "Tome" wtf, noone died, what do books have to do with dead people?


 * They're trying to encourage hunting parties as opposed to cookie cutter farm teams. The former is more interesting and variable depending on skill, etc. On Jarin Plains, my 3 man team got, in total, 12 golds. gg.


 * This is in favor of gameplay, yes, but what's wrong with that?-Silk Weaker 13:55, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Like Moosey said, it simply an observation. Personally I like the different tome things, simply because a book can only hold so much before it's too heavy to carry. I know, I read a lot. If every tome carried every skill from every profession it would me far too thick. Now split it up into different professions and you get an easier to carry book. Atleast that is my theory on why the different tomes makes sense.[[Image:Horrified.png]]Kilcannon 17:39, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * About the whole size and weight thing, keep in mind, in GW physics, a full suit of plate armor is both large enough for a nearly 7 foot tall 300 pount warrior to wear and provide a large amount of armor, and small enough for the FULL SUIT to fit in a pouch on his belt. And that same warrior can carry 20 two handed heavy hammers in his back pack, and carry 20 more in bags if he wants to. In addition to all that, he can still manage to carry 100k worth of gold pieces on his person as well. And he can carry all this without even slowing down. And best of all, the same stuff can just as easily be carried by the tiny little 5 foot 100 pound monk girl too... DKS01 19:34, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

= Unsorted discussions =

All chests give title
I checked, and I think that all chests in hard mode give a treasure hunting title point, regardless of area. If anyone wants to check and add this, I'd be grateful Smarty100044@msn.com 14:48, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Ripped from redirect page. --Armond Warblade (talk) 15:55, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

The Underworld / FoW
According to Gaile: "Hard mode is available in all areas of the game except for Pre-Searing Ascalon.". Anyone checked the Underworld?
 * Yes, there are some quite lovely level 32 aatxes there. Fred The Second 16:15, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I ran into those myself. Less then friendly, I must say.  And the +50 Speed Boost is not conductive towards Smite only farming.  On the plus side, +50% attack speed = Spiteful Spirit heaven. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    19:35, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Drop Rate
I noticed the big debate up there about farming nerf, but here are some points I thouight of that i didn't see mentioned:
 * 1) It scales with party size. So either:
 * 2) *You get the same amount of loot no matter your party size, or
 * 3) *You actually get more loot with a bigger party. Elite missions, anyone?
 * Also, if you just play hard mode you have a higher drop rate than you used to in normal mode. AND you can get better items in there. STOP COMPLAINING. --Wizardboy777 18:24, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

You get the same amount of loot no matter the party size. Which means you get the same low amount of loot playing by yourself as you would playing in a full 8 player group. And I sure as hell haven't seen any sign of a higher drop rate in hard mode. Let's say they doubled your chances of getting a gold in hard mode...the thing is, if your chance of getting a gold was .05% to begin with, doubled it's still only .1%. As for "better items", that's really subjective isn't it? The only hard mode items I have any interest in are the elite skill tomes, I don't need regular tomes, I don't care about lockpicks, and the only reason I ever had for going to FoW/UW was for farming, since they killed that I have no use for passage scrolls either. The only thing hard mode has that benefits me so far is the ability to get Lightbringer and Sunspear points, which I AM making the most of(running around in hard more Realm of Torment last night I went from ~4200 lightbringer points to ~6100, and that was BEFORE the doubled points thing, I can only imagine how many I'll get tonight, will definitely have the next title level though) DKS01 19:27, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Needs to Be Fixed
The section on tiems need to be fixed, and since i suck at Wiki HTML, someone do it, please. Kurzspear 18:27, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * the  [edit] [edit] [edit]  ? that's because the pictures are all larger then the sections that house them, and it's pushing the edit tags down the page to the first gap in the pictures. known issue, nothing to be done. --Honorable Sarah [[image:Honorable_Icon.gif]] 18:29, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Aw, that means the article can't look pretty... Kurzspear 18:31, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Fixed, ... &mdash;[[Image:BlastThatT.jpg]]Blastedt 18:32, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Nice. I was wondering about that ugliness myself. If I had a cookie, I would give it to you. ^_^ Gwen Shadowsound 18:59, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * -eats- &mdash;[[Image:BlastThatT.jpg]]Blastedt 19:45, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * undos* You only need ONE , no need to spam and flood the article with it.  I've removed every single one of them as a punishment!  Now you should suffer through all the [edit] links!!!  (ie, I've fixed it) -User:PanSola (talk to the [[Image:follower of Lyssa.png]]) 20:26, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Explorer Title
It should be noted on the page somewhere that Hard Mode combines VERY well with explorer titles, as you are already required to clear every enemy from the area, it's no challenge to map it while you're there. --   19:47, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Entering Hard Mode
ive allrdy beat hells precipice on my tank, so will i be able to enter had mode on him and my other characters?

suicide farming
farming hopping vampires and thought stealer's on hard mode lvl 20 necro 9 soul reaping 9 death magic and the skill animate bone minion mwahahahahaha