Talk:Chaos Gloves

These are sooooooooo leet O_o --84.24.206.123 08:45, 1 September 2007 (CDT)
 * Seconded. Obsidian Armor, I wouldn't pay for. Chaos Gloves? Now THAT I would pay for. Gwen Shadowsound 09:36, 1 September 2007 (CDT)

Dyable tint around the edges.

wtf 75 ectos just for gloves? I thought at first they were colector till I noticed the infobox...i was cosidering these as a nice second set of gloves for my necro to go with his fow.....not ruddy likely now tho...&mdash; ~ Soqed Hozi ~  12:47, 1 September 2007 (CDT)

hmm.... if it changed all your damage to armor ignoring - it may well be worth 75 ectos - I'd suspect it would be rather popular w/ Warriors - but I'd like to see confirmation (DonBrouhaha 14:39, 1 September 2007 (CDT))

Reminds me of Chaos Axe --Shin 15:11, 1 September 2007 (CDT)

can you dye them? to change the glow?--Yakslappin 18:07, 1 September 2007 (CDT)
 * Despite the cost, I may just have to get these. Who doesn't want glowing hands? Arshay Duskbrow 20:21, 1 September 2007 (CDT)


 * People who already have glowing hands. Which coinendentally includes me. = P Flechette 01:50, 2 September 2007 (CDT)

far too many etos needed, and the gold too is a little ott. Magmas are far more affordable and look much much better. &mdash; ~ Soqed Hozi ~  15:11, 2 September 2007 (CDT)

I made a dye chart and posted it. I also noted that it does not dye like a Chaos Axe as the chart shows. Drtstudios 00:04, 5 September 2007 (CDT)

Ugh even THESE are going to be hella expensive. With destroyer cores going at 1k each, the 250k sounds... bad. 12.175.211.39 19:48, 11 September 2007 (CDT)

recycling
does any body know whats happens when you recyle them? JuGe 06:42, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

The Game Crashes and Automatically Uninstalls :P Synthetic Ian 23:15, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

a dumb joke
so this is why you are not supposed to break a chaos axe

lulz... ingenious


 * hehe, funny COLDshiver 11:38, 9 September 2007 (CDT)


 * Now imagine these gloves wielding a chaos weapon and equipped with pure white armour, sunglasses anyone? Reichi Aryon 13:30, 9 September 2007 (CDT)
 * We now can wear SUNglasses in Guildwars? &mdash; S h  a  d  y  G  u  y  13:32, 9 September 2007 (CDT)
 * Spectacles. 24.178.58.186 09:53, 13 September 2007 (CDT)
 * I wear my Sunglasses at night, cuz these gloves, light my way!! :P 64.229.16.159 05:17, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Crafting Materials
I thought these required 75 ectoplasm? Was the requirement removed or is someone vandalizing wiki again?
 * Vandalism apprently COLDshiver 19:51, 7 September 2007 (CDT)

Cost
These are entirely over-priced as far as the ecto is concerned. If it had been 5 or even 7 ectos then maybe the GW community would be more inclined to purchase these. I also understand that not everyone can afford these, and the ones who can are able to show their character "status" or "uniqueness". I however can afford these and will not purchase these until they adjust the amount of ectos to a more reasonable amount. I hope others feel as I do on this item. --Smitty00 19:45, 6 September 2007 (CDT)
 * They're expensive, but as you partially stated, they are meant to be the new prestige item that only very, very few can afford, since a lot of prestige items lost their appeal as more people acquired them. Even FoW armor has become a lot less notable since so many people have it now. Like FoW though, people are just going to start farming up stacks of ectos again and then these won't even be that uncommon. It's just the way of things to keep introducing new, ridiculously overpriced items so we always have a new way to "keep up with the joneses". Also, unfortunately, I really doubt they're going to adjust the amount of ectos they require because that would completely devalue them to those who purchased them at the original price. BigAstro 19:52, 6 September 2007 (CDT)
 * GW:EotN is the end of the line (baring possible small expansions) for guild wars 1, this is end endgame. You have to note also that ectos have devalued quite a bit from their prime or even there long standing average (7k-ish). The time it takes to farm the money for these gloves is roughly equivocal to the time it took to get the chest piece of FoW in the 7k-per-ecto days. As for readjusting the ecto price, those who already bought them would be outraged. Also given the fertile "hype market" that is produced with each expansion (Gwen being no exception), I was able to farm all the funds with in 3 days and not investing a great amount of time per day. Drtstudios 20:24, 6 September 2007 (CDT)
 * Whine whine whine. It's harsh but it's the truth. What do you want ANet to do? Make them 10 ectos so EVERYONE can get them? It's frigging called frigging prestige frigging items for a reason and it's not because everyone can get these. I can't get these but I don't care, I much prefer the Destroyer ones honestly --Blue.rellik 20:32, 6 September 2007 (CDT)
 * It's impossible to make everyone happy. This isn't that bad for some people (motivated farmers with some time on their hands) and outlandishly expensive for others (casual players who barely have the time to get to R5 so the crafter will even speak to them). I think 75 ectos is pretty good balance personally. BigAstro 20:43, 6 September 2007 (CDT)
 * These are fine as is. I would only get really pissed if they made an entire "Chaos" set and we had glowing people running around. That would shoot the price of Ecto through the roof, again, and probably exhaust all the Rune and Dye traders as well. It's bad enough already, after every expansion this happens...or when there are new Heroes...or like when they buffed the Windwalker insignia...sigh. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:54, 6 September 2007 (CDT)


 * This gloves are good only for monks and eles.In other cases-warrior,dervish and assasin looks like clowns with it.75e?Rather i would buy 1k gloves than these,its imba fency.Still,destroyer gloves are little bit cheaper(like 20e) but looks extremly better than Chaos ones.
 * Anet should add something that costs 250 ectos, rubies, diamonds, sapphires, and obsidian shards. Plus say, like, 100k. It would be totally ridiculous, but it'd be an unspammable prestige item. Maybe an armor set that costs that for each piece, 3 times the materials for the chest, twice the materials for the legs. Of course, for it to be worth it, Anet would have to borrow ideas from like, the future or something.--Darksyde Never Again 20:21, 12 September 2007 (CDT)
 * These things look like utter sex on a mesmer with white obsidian armour and spectacles. Utter sex --Blue.rellik 00:07, 15 September 2007 (CDT)
 * Anyone who wines about the price of any prestige armor is a dumbass, quite simply put. "oh its outrageous how much this costs!" shove a pie in it. Ive never been rich, or good at farming, and have never owned a piece of fow armor, but youll never hear me say its overpriced. guess why? it has the same armor value and stats of any other peice of max armor. Its a money sink hole. and guess what.... money sink holes are supposed to be expensive. Its what makes exclusive badarse armor badarse and exclusive. Whining about it being too expensive is idiodic. period. (68.63.233.200 13:39, 15 September 2007 (CDT)
 * Just as idiotic as spewing one's "opinion" as if it were fact. Period. You are no more right or wrong than anyone else, ideally... but the way you present yourself puts you at a disadvantage in this case.
 * Not really, he's right. If you whine about the price then shove a pie in it, it's called a money sink/prestige item for a damn bloody reason --Blue.rellik 03:38, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yep. When I wanted to buy a panda, the fact that it cost a lot just made me want it more. Nobody is forced to buy these things in GW, they have no game effect. Want it? Work for it (It is a game!). Anyth else sounds like whining. NightAngel 20:58, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I think its nice that there expencive, im not rich or anything so i dont really want them (well i do, but theres no point because im poor) but it shows off just HOW rich the player is & it says "i must farm ectos" all over it, and there very kewl. Oh and the price dosent seem to affect many people because i have seen loads of people with these, one of the most popular armor pieces (after Those Glasses, and the bandanna maybe)--Azzazthing 12:18, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

black dye?
Can someone post a pic with black dye? All the other colors are shown in the article. Seeing as this dyes differently from chaos axes, maybe we can get a nice dark shadowy glow ^^ Tain 14:12, 14 September 2007 (CDT)
 * check out my talk page in the other wiki. Foo 18:30, 14 September 2007 (CDT)
 * oo, I like that a lot, ty... it's subtly different from white or silver, but it dims the glow so that your hands have more definition rather than just being a big bright blob. Tain 00:04, 15 September 2007 (CDT)
 * I have tried to dye it in black apparently it doesnt show any black aura around the gloves, just simple like dyed in grey 148.197.27.178 10:43, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Try mixing one or two blacks with any darker color (purple, red, blue, purple+red, or try your own mix - dye preview is my favorite dress-up feature, now we just need an armor fitting room before-you-buy XD). RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 18:56, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Chaos gloves + axe picture
...can anyone post a picture with Chaos gloves & Axe ? --Grethort 16:09, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
 * ...still no picture... :( RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 20:20, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

here you go. Foo 00:33, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Cool... XD Now just need to make entire chaos armor set.  Oh yeah... RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 04:42, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Under Water
Pretty cool, If you are underwater and they are green died they completely disappear. I found it interesting although of no use whatsoever. Mini-Rurik's sword flame goes away too.

My Dragon Gauntlets also seem to disappear.
 * So does your hair Kudoz2u 23:42, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

Hate 'em
This Gloves are just ridiculous. Come on, 75 Ectos for something that looks like a freaking glitch? This is just dumb. D-U-M-B. And they are ugly as hell.--81.229.153.243 22:54, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The number of people who have them shows that many people would disagree with you... Just like Obsidian - there are about as many people who dislike each profession's FoW armor as those who like it. If you don't like it, don't buy it. Tain 00:17, 22 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree and qualify as someone who does like them. Liking them isnt why I bought them, though. After 2 years of playing, the only thing that really captivates my attention is collecting sets of armor and all of the EOTN common armor - these gloves included - are items I've collected.

As if they actually like them. They just buy them to be able to say "Look at me, my dick is big because I have an expensive armor.".
 * Maybe in some cases, of course. I buy armor I do actually like. Some Obsidian sets, some mixes with 1k armors. Tain 16:54, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

I've met plenty of people who buy expensive armor/items just to look rich.....they're pretty common. So far, I think these look really good on mesmers (cause their chest pieces cover the arm) and somewhat decent on monks. I wonder how they'd look on a sin with all those spiffy flips and attack animations. They don't look that bad (boring design though), but they leave an ugly line on your arm since it isn't covered, and that looks like junk. P A R A S I T I C 00:06, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Wait, I wonder what happens with elite geomancer. Since the chest piece for that covers the entire arm including hands. -Ezekiel 00:09, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Same thing that happens with ele FoW - instead of a line of skin, there's a line of grey below the elbow. Tain 01:12, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

I agree with the guy above, everyone buys them cos they are expensive, not cos they like them. It's a show off item, cs i don't see how anyone can like these things. Every monk in gvg and ha is running around with a set of these on, and it just looks silly imo, cos they have become as common as monk obsidian. Jackers 13:34, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I like them. I've never bought anything to make my e-weiner bigger. Proof of this is that my Ranger, Warrior, Necro(both), Ritualist, and Dervish all have 15k+ armors, but my Assassin doesn't. I can afford 15k armor for my sin, but i don't like the way they look. Many people buy things just 'cause they like the way they look, and i'd trade destroyer gauntlets for mask of the mo zing anyday. Destroyer gauntlets "cost" more, but mask looks better, in my opinion. Some people DO like them, and if i DO get them, it'll be for my Paragon, since it'd fit the whole "Angelic awesomeness" theme.--Darksyde Never Again 21:37, 7 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Well, I have no problem with "liking" the idea, sure they look cool, but the problem with these gloves is that the graphics are incompatible with just about every armor out there. It clips, it looks weird, it doesn't fit, etc...  They just weren't designed to go with most armor sets, only the few lucky sleevless ones can look ok with them.  THAT is the problem, and THAT is why I hate them.  I can't wear them with anything I own without looking stupid.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 00:23, 8 January 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm assuming you're talking about your necromancer. In that case you could wear Ancient, Primeval, Vabbian, Ascalon, Sunspear, Istani, etc etc. They all have sleeves that end before the elbow. Some don't have sleeves at all.--Darksyde Never Again 18:05, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

i dont agree with this childish argueing from above: ppl dont buy these gloves or a fow armor always cuz they like it, but just to show, that they have money, or at least farmed damn long. it's only a show off and many ppl have just a fow armor for this. sorry to attack all those ppl with (for example): ranger, warrior, monk fow armor. if they WOULDN'T be fow, they never would've made this armor.
 * Sure, most people buy things to be "special", but I would have bought my ranger FoW even if it wasn't FoW - it just is my favorite appearance. Tain 02:28, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Standard armor?
Why are these in the Standard armor category? I think that there's a rather extremely profound difference between getting these and getting any other piece of "standard" 1k armor, considering this is THE most expensive single piece of armor in the entire game... O_o RoseOfKali  08:04, 29 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Its in the "Common". Its common because all professions can use it. --[[Image:Warwick sig.JPG]] Warwick (Talk ) (Contr. ) 08:07, 29 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Common does not equal Standard by any means... It belongs in Common, obviously, DUH!, but why is it also in Standard category? RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 08:14, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Images
The images for both male and female are far from adequate... The male dye chart is the only thing worth keeping. Also, if someone could post a separate image set for Mesmer gloves, since they look very different from the other 9 professions, specifically: they only cover up to the wrist, not below the elbow. RoseOfKali 08:56, 29 November 2007 (UTC)
 * 5 weeks later... HEY! The images still suck! And I'm not buying these, bacause they cost too damn much to be bugged as much as they are.  Oh well.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 00:27, 8 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Would REEEEEALLY like to see a screenie of a mesmer with these gloves, so we can check out how they look (ie, different from other profs because only cover to the wrist). --Wolfie [[Image:Wolfie_sig.jpg|19px]] (talk|contribs) 03:34, 17 January 2008 (UTC) ...or a donation of 75 ecto and I'll make 'em myself and provide the pics. :D
 * They go all the way up the fore arm, just like any other profession. Just mesmer coats tend to cover all the way down to the hand, making you look somewhat like a margonite, just in better clothes.--99.225.4.255 04:02, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the extra info, but as the saying goes... a picture says thousand words :) --Wolfie [[Image:Wolfie_sig.jpg|19px]] (talk|contribs) 04:14, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

From article
Sorry i don't know where to put this, but how does that work if it's 4 different dyes, but only 2 work at a time? 69.159.200.89 20:58, 23 December 2007 (UTC)


 * It means that if you use 3 of thesame color dye, only 2 will have an effect. You can still use up to 4 dyes, though. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG]]-- (s)talkpage 21:00, 23 December 2007 (UTC)

Dye
Sorry i don't know where to put this, but how does that work if it's 4 different dyes, but only 2 work at a time? 69.159.200.89 20:58, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
 * NOTE: Moved from main page RT | Talk  - A joyous wintersday to all 21:00, 23 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Ummm... look up, mate :P --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG]]-- (s)talkpage 21:04, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Damn, checked history, your right RT | Talk  - A joyous wintersday to all 08:04, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
 * in the notes it says "a cool backlight effect blah blah..", well, wheres a screenshot to prove this? Dont add things like that to the notes without a picture.
 * Here's a screenshot. I've updated the main page. Rukh 18:18, 12 April 2008 (UTC)



The black dye image on the main page doesn't look much like black light, though, just looks like different shades of blue, big deal... O_o RoseOfKali 05:04, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
 * If I look at an example from Wiki, then to the human eye, black light is just blue-purple... thus the images on the front page. And thanks for resizing, whoever did that. Rukh
 * You're welcome. I'm still upset that these gloves don't go with like any of the armor I own, not to mention FoW.  My elbows look all jagged and messed up...  They should have 2 versions of them: Sleeved and Sleevless (the current one is sleevless, sleeved would match with armors like Elementalist Obsidian armor/Female, appearing like your entire arm glows, but the top is just hidden by the sleeve above the elbow) :( *Breaks another chaos axe* RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 17:20, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Screenshot plz
"A cool blacklight effect (the core is still white) can be created by mixing two black dyes, a blue dye, and a purple dye."

Can we get a screen of that please? --Majnore 18:56, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * You can very easily if you have 75 ectos, 2 black dyes, a stack of dust, and 10,150g--D N A 18:07, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Wow... Har... Har... RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 20:14, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

These are:
For those who have too much money, want the best skinned items in the game, a goldsink.--Relyk 04:42, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Except it isn't one of the best-skinned items in the game... :( It's just a gold sink that doesn't fit with >80% of this game's armor sets.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 17:09, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

HoM
I was really upset to find that they cant be added to the HoM, like all other common armors... Synthetic Ian 23:16, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
 * What did you envision, yourself naked just wearing a pair of glowing gloves? RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 04:39, 26 May 2008 (UTC)


 * I loled when i saw that, but no, i envisioned myself wearing my normal (norn) armor, but with the chaos gloves as the norn gloves, they should have made it so the common armors were counted as elite and could be interchanged as elite armor pieces, you know, just make them count toward the set, or something... But on that note, imma be so P/Oed when I get gws2 and I wont receive any credit for getting them. [[Image:Hi-res-Favorable_Winds.jpg|19px]] <font color="#900020">Synthetic Ian 15:33, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Then this would technically let you re-use the same set of gloves to display other elite sets without ever buying the gloves for them. The monument was made for displaying complete armor sets, and common armor does not belong there, no matter how expensive it is.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 03:19, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
 * yes, and you should be able to re use them, thats why i payed all that for them, they should be counted as any gloves in the game, as they cost WAY more than any other gloves, and you would still have to buy 4/5ths the armor set you wanna display... but what we think doesn't really matter anyway :) anywho i doubt they will change it so this is all pointless at any rate... <font color="#900020">Synthetic Ian''' 18:40, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, they don't cost more than any gloves in the game, if they were reusable then they would have to total the cost of all the other gloves in the game. This includes equaling the requirements for each armour set (including progress in multiple campaigns, an ascended character, raising ranks in several title tracks) These gloves are expensive, but they are shallowy expensive. You could get them by farming one mob repeatedly, as compared to something like KoABD (for example) which requires a spread to raise. <font color=#555>Ezekiel <font color=#AAA> [Talk]  08:58, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Just got them
And they're awesome :D <font color="#220000">ICY <font color="#550000"> F <font color="#990000">IFT <font color="#550000">Y <font color="#220000">FIVE  03:22, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

No --J0ttem™ 11:56, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Female Mesmer?
These gloves are so beutiful; I really want them on my most-used character, a lady mesmer. But some of the other common gloves are cut off at the wrist for the female mesmers. Any word on these? If I pay that kind of plat for glove, I want the whole glove! Thank you in advance for the help.
 * ALL mesmer gloves cover the hand only and stop at the wrist. No exception here.  Sorry to disappoint you. RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 18:20, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Though, I have seen a female mesmer in black Obsidian armor with chaos gloves, and it looked really REALLY nice. RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 18:22, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Wrong, they go all the way up. I've seen it.--<font color ="Black">D <font color = "#900000">N <font color ="Black">A 18:36, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Screenshot needed. Every time I've seen them, they were just the hand, but they were also with long mesmer sleeves, so it might have been covered.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 22:22, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, here's a screenie for a male I got in Sif. Thx to Cpt Spalding.


 * [[Image:Chaos Gloves Mesmer Male.jpg]] RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 03:23, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Everyone hates these gloves?
I'm buying them and came here just to see peoples opinions on it. I'm generally really poor and saving up for this has taken me so long, but I really just love how it looks. Does everyone here just hate it because they are so expensive? I realize it's hard to get it to work with most armors, but there are a fair few it can work with as well. 219.89.30.219 08:30, 31 August 2008 (UTC)


 * A lot of people hate it because it doesn't really match with most armors well, they're expensive, everyone has em etc. And there are people who just like them, and thus have them. Personally, I think they look like an exploded Chaos Axe. nty :P --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  09:15, 31 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I was also starting to save up for this since my main has everything he could possibly want besides titles that are more expensive than these. I figured they might go well for a Male Ritualist with Asuran Armor. I've read all the negative feedback but like I said, he has everything else he could possibly want so why not? If you like them, forget what others say about them. Buy them for yourself, not for the opinions of others. --68.32.187.152 05:24, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

ecto cost
Look at the last 4 revisions, [] - 2 identical edits by the same person and both were reverted as vandalism. Now tell me why 71.61.106.38 keeps changing the ecto cost to 5? It almost seems like this person thinks that 75 is too high to be correct? Either that, or it's a strange occurrence of vandalizm fixated on ectos of this page... O_o Anyway, stop changing it, whoever you are, 75 is the correct number. If this happens again, an admin should consider blocking this IP, since its only two contributions were vandalizing this article. RoseOfKali 08:49, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

What happened to the article?
I tried to open the page and it says that it doesn't exist, and the deletion log is empty... WTH? O_o !!!!
 * The article still exists (click edit and it gives you code). I don't know wtf happened. --<font size="3" face="vivaldi" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  21:06, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, I edited it and it fixed itself. I'll ask Kyle sometime. --<font size="3" face="vivaldi" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  21:09, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * This has been happening all over the wiki today. --Macros 21:17, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, great, first my IE7 goes berserk, and now this? Madness is spreading!  :P  But anyway, at one point today I got "Database Locked" message while editing, dunno if this is at all relevant.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 22:23, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * double dye chart, but i'm cautious with complicated wikicode 76.188.100.220 19:46, 24 October 2008 (UTC) (roland cyerni)

Skin tone
You pretty much have to be rather pale, don't you? :S -->Suicidal Tendencie 18:21, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Not at all. These gloves turn your hands into a stubby cone that ends at the wrist.  Look at it underwater or in grass, and you will see that the glove is there by itself, the hand is just not there at all.  It is the same thing as in Image:Glacial_Gauntlets_F_clipping.jpg.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.png]] 22:01, 28 January 2009 (UTC)