User talk:Warwick/Archive 37

For the link to my TopEnd, go to: User:Warwick/TopEnd/Talk

archived
For you. --Shadowcrest 01:01, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * That was so unrespectful. I was actually about to say Alari was right, the only conclusion we can come to is that she's got a different opinion from most of us. I personally enjoyed it. Thank you, Alari.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 01:03, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I can't ban you for c/p'ing that entire convo back here. I'd rather you didn't, but I can't stop you. --Shadowcrest  01:05, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm flammable and hard-headed, but not a dick. BTW, where's the archive?[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 01:08, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * She has a showhide box near the top labeled archive. Open it, it's archive 36. --Shadowcrest  01:10, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Ok, ty.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 01:12, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Conversation in the Archive
Excessively, I actually did that as a form of a joke. I knew that no-one would ever accept it, and RT suggested it in Alliance Chat, as a joke. I just decided to go through with it =P. &mdash; Warw/Wick 10:30, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Holy mother of god, it got accepted? O_o.. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 10:32, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I must wonder, however, why such a fuss is being caused over it. Belar repeatedly vandalised afaik, and I dont see why he did that. Just ignore the wiki if you dont like it. Its not going away. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 11:56, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * You're trying too hard to get attention imo. --[[Image:Progr.png]] -- talkpage 12:09, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * What? &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 12:11, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

I happened to notice that most of your pages (if not all; I didn't read through all of them) are copied from the Guild Wars 2 Wiki. Not only is that stupid but the way in which you have copied them is a violation of the GFDL, as far as I know. -- Brains12 \ Talk 14:55, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm planning on changing them; They're just like that for now. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 14:58, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * And I'd appreciate it, brains, if you didn't call me stupid. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 15:00, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * He didn't call you stupid, he said it was stupid to have copied info from another wiki, especially if it's your counterpart. I'm starting to think Prog hit the jackpot with his comment...[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 16:04, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * ...Uhu. Its getting needed info on pages. I'm planning on updating it currently, and as I said, on the main page; Some of the information is GDFL. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 16:17, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

As per riks request
A copy of the email Wikia sent me:

Hello, Warwick,

The Wikia you requested is now available at . We hope to see you editing there soon!

We've added some information and tips on your user talk Page () to help you get started. If you have any questions, just reply to this email or browse our help pages at .

Good luck with the project,

Catherine Munro Wikia Community Team 

&mdash; Warw/Wick 12:40, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Bad, Bad Idea
While I understand what you were trying to acomplish with making a seperate wiki; I think it is a bad, bad, idea. Why seperate the Guild Wars community again? GW2W is supposed to help change that, and help to bring the Guild Wars community back together. I know you mean well, but it is not a very good idea IMHO. --Myria83 16:54, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, ironically, the idea in itself was a joke. It got accepted and I was like.. O_o.. Anyway, I know that nearly no-one will be using it. Its really just going to be used as a recluse in case GW2W turns out to be like GWW; Which is why GuildWikians dont go over to GWW. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 16:56, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, Wikia didn't know it's a joke, and they aren't gonna deny somebody's desire to make an unofficial wiki if the players claimed there is a need for (and a community  to support) one.  The good news is the wiki you founded is also on the GFDL license, so you can leech everything from GW2W (provided proper attribution) and get the same article count, even if only two ppl uses it q-: -User:PanSola (talk to the [[Image:follower of Lyssa.png]]) 17:28, 10 April 2008 (UTC)


 * LLLLol. Brains got teh pwnds. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage 17:30, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I said it's a violation because the current copied articles have no attribution. -- Brains12 \ Talk 17:40, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Truthfully, I only did it as a half joke though. Anyway, yeah, I'm providing it- Theres a notice on the main page. Its a just in case sort of thing, cause im cautious like that- *looks back at guildwars* hey what, Im dead? &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 17:43, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Just saying "Stuff on thsi wiki is under GfDl" is NOT providing attribution. You need to explicitly, for each article, say "this article is derived from the content of  GW2W, the original article was (link to GW2W article), the list of contributors can be found (link to GW2W article history)." -User:PanSola (talk to the [[Image:follower of Lyssa.png]]) 18:19, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Bah.. >_> &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 18:23, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Its your call, guys
Since evidently many people dislike the idea of this new wiki, its honestly the wikis call. Belar said, once the wiki has more than two articles, it can be put on the page.. It has several articles now -_-. Anyway, if the cause of the dislike of it is me, I'm happy to step down and let others take control (Ie Entropy). I'm paranoid, I cant help it. Anyway, Its honestly your call. I will run this wiki on my own, regardless. Company would be nice, but its the full communities call. Any suggestions for the wiki and its running are appreciated. &mdash; Warw/Wick 12:02, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Doing the right thing for a change...I'm glad.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 16:07, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * You're talking about the Guild Wars 2 wikis, right? What happens when the pool will mark the official GW2 wiki a winner? You'll delete the wannabe Guild2Wiki or what? &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 16:56, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I dont know. It'll remain, just in case GW2W turns into GWW. Which may not happen. This is wikias site so idk. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 17:17, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Good question.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 17:14, 10 April 2008 (UTC)


 * If you go to GW2W now and make your proposal for a policy, you can help and shape it towards a midway between GWW and GWiki. If you think GW2W will be GWW #2, make a change. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage 17:22, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Im bad at that sort of thing tbh. =| I'm no good with policies.. Only enforcing them. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 17:31, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * You moved it from the Community Portal, but the issue still stands. Are you deleting it or not?[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 18:08, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I moved it form the community portal because a) it'd already been discussed b) the answer was known. I can't delete it, eranor. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 18:16, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It can't be deleted? Woot you really screwed it.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 18:25, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Quit with the annoying, Ereanor. It can be deleted, its just wikias choice if said happens. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 18:31, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Goodnight
Everyone. And as a note, I just know that GW2W is gonna turn out like GWW.. :( &mdash; Warw/Wick 22:01, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Believe what you want, just don't help it happen by attempting to divide us.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 00:16, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * @Warwick-->Good night, sweet princess. Misfate  00:24, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Ereanor, stop bitching and go away. Misfate, thanks. ^_^ &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 09:19, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

And Cut
Stop with the bitching. -.-" &mdash; Warw/Wick 09:19, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * What bitching might we be talking about? [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 09:20, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Alright, closer to "Enough with the bitching, ereanor". &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 09:23, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * He raises a number of perfectly valid points. Wouldn't it be more productive to address those issues than to filibuster the whole thing? [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 09:26, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It would, but ignoring them is more interesting. And hes annoying me by consistantly bringing up the issue everywhere. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 09:27, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, I've just responded to it in those places where you have brought it up first, and I recall having spared it at Entropy's talkpage.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 15:44, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, but you havn't, as far as I've seen in this archive, said anything constructive or useful. I'll go reread. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 15:56, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I think my Greatest Hits are in your last archive while a argued with Alari. With you all I get is evasion, so I can't really do anything but answering what you say at the start.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 16:00, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm good at evading awkward questions. ;) &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 16:02, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

IMO
From what I can see in the rapidly degenerating flame war on my previous archive, many people are opposed to this. Ereanor, I've already brung this issue up, but it was forgotten and ignored. I've brought it up 3 times, forgotten//ignored. So meh. After reading through this, I will redit this. &mdash; Warw/Wick 16:09, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * brought* --[[Image:Progr.png]] -- talkpage 16:11, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

<!-- == Your brother. ==

Has he been creating new wikis? Or have you? Because a warwick started a guildwiki2. <font color="#DD2200">Lord Belar 22:53, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Which GuildWiki will not officially support. Ever. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:14, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * But who are you to make that decision on behalf of guildwiki? --[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 23:20, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It's already been brought up, and the general decision is no. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 23:22, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * "But who are you to make that decision on behalf of guildwiki?" ... How about, the only GuildWiki bureaucrat? :P --Macros 23:23, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * She's Entropy, and what she says matters for a lot of users. Besides, she's right, both GuildWiki and GWW have problems because of the community split. The official GW2 wiki is our chance to start over, and no one wants to spoil it.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 23:26, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * When I say GuildWiki, I don't mean individual users - they can do whatever they want. What I mean is that there will never be a policy, declaration, promotion, blabla of this "Guild Wars 2 Wiki on Wikia". Why? Because I said so. ...No really, unless something has radically changed, it has been decided for awhile that we are not making GWiki into GW2Wiki nor making a new GWiki for GW2. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:27, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * But it is fair to endorse one wiki but not the other? This whole thing is funny as hell.--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 23:29, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It's not funny for those of us who have lived the history behind that decision.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 23:32, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It doesn't have to be, you dont have to have anything to do with it, I however am curious why there is a link to one but not a link to its counterpart, is not a wiki supposed to be unbiased. And What I mean being funny is the stuck up denial and vandalisms :)--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 23:34, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Link to...Oh, you mean the main page? If you were opposed to that I'd expect a post on the talkpage of the editcopy. It's still there because the admins (I don't pay much attention to it) got the sense that most people were apathetic or supportive of it. If it bothers you I'll remove it, since I agree that being nonpartisan is a good goal. (Although to be fair, there was no other choice at the time it was added.) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:39, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * There's nothing on Guildwiki2. And half the time, the main page just points you to GW2W anyways. <font color="#DD2200">Lord Belar 23:41, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * If the new wiki gets a start (and that is assuming warwick male did not create it as a joke as he now holds only bcrat powers) then that would be fair, if it does not then I have no objection.
 * @ belar, thats most odd. --[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 23:44, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm trying to fix that half the time part, but you keep interfering. :P <font color="#DD2200">Lord Belar 23:46, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Hah! a confession! --[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 23:47, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * LOL Anyway, it's not as simple as saying "let's not be biased". There's a player base, a Guild Wars community, and from that community the wiki user base will arise. There's no need, no point, and no benefit in creating two different wikis for the same community, you'll either split the community or have the same ppl working on the same thing twice. Therefore, if there are actually two wikis, the present wiki community should choose.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 23:49, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * You do not speak for everyone that there should only be one wiki however. You don't have the justification to say there should be one. I for example may disagree with unity, and I may wish for a wiki other then GW2W, are you saying that I do not have that right?--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 23:54, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm saying that if you do, you're not actually giving ppl a different option, because it's the same ppl working on both.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 23:56, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I think you're purposefully misinterpreting "Guildwiki". Entropy used "Guildwiki" in the general sense of the community. I'm certain she did not mean that every single user to ever have contributed here will support GW2W or else. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  23:57, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * @ Eranor Who says that everyone on guildwiki WILL go to gw2w?
 * Shadow, I was refering to the link on the main page, if this new wiki sucedes then is it not fair to either link to both or neither?--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 23:58, 9 April 2008 (UTC)
 * The discussions that have taken place in this wiki to cover that issue, and common sense.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 00:00, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Obviously not, otherwise this conversation would not be taking place.--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:01, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * This conversation is taking place because someone did not consider what has been discussed here, and assumed that he/she could take this wiki's name to propose to this community his/her personal intention.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 00:04, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It has occurred, I think at the community portal. It was generally decided that GWiki would support GW2W, unless I'm deluded. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 00:05, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * GW:YAV, all I have to say to that.--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:07, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Creating a new wiki is not protected by a policy intended to encourage editing in this wiki. EDIT: If anything, it is a violation of that policy against everyone else[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 00:10, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * No, but arrogant users making decisions based on past conversations ignoring other opinions is covered.--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:12, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Alright, acording to your opinion here, you wouldn't support GW2W because of what you think of GWW. And you add that you would instead join another wiki to avoid a GWW-style GW2W. Well, guess what, if GW2W repeats GWW's mistakes, it will be because of that attitude.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 00:17, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't know where this is going. Alari, if you want to contribute to wikia's GW2 wiki, fine. I'm not going to say anything to stop you. What are you aiming at by continuing this conversation? Getting the ANet GW2W removed from the front page? If so, please bring this up at Talk:Main Page/editcopy. This is rapidly degenerating into a flame war, and I'd rather not have to deal with that. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 00:18, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Shadow, I am not flaming anyone, By contributing to this discussion I hope to keep this wiki nonpartisan were a second wiki for GW2 to succeed, some are putting down the idea of supporting any wiki other then the one they have decided on.
 * I am open to either wiki, my comments there are turning me off GW2W because of what I have observed of it, not what GWW is. I claimed I would contribute to another wiki if the popular one disapointed me, which I predicted it will. Please do not twist my words. --[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:24, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Stop with the policies. People who spam "you're breaking blahalbhablah" sound like robots and to tell the truth I really hope I stop playing Guild Wars so I don't end up like most of you. IRL the kid that sayd "but thats against rule #22" gets punched in the face and mugged. imho and yes I'm angry again b/c my dad is a lieing retard who lied about me and laughed right in front of my face to my mom that selfish bastard. <font color ="skyblue" size="3px" face ="mistral">Lost-Blue 00:25, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I believe this^^ would be flaming.--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:26, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * OK! for that weird thing. Now, Alari, pushing to be unpartisan is already being biased, you know?[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 00:28, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Explain how being unbiased=biased?--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:29, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * For a start, being "unbiased", in a complete sense, is an abstract ideal wich we can't really achieve. Similarly, not only you're not unbiased, nor are you trying to be, what you're doing, and that's what I'm talking about, is arguing that this community should be unbiased, and arguing is never unbiased. And as you can see, here I am countering your intentions, were they neutral, I just couldn't make an opposing stand.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 00:38, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

How about this: when that wiki has more than 2 articles it could be put on the main page next to GW2W. At the moment there's no point. --Macros 00:41, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * That is what I had originally said of the matter.--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:43, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Then... why are we arguing? --Macros 00:44, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Because some didn't want a second wiki at all?--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:45, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't want a second wiki, however I'm being tactful by not mentioning that that wiki will never amount to much and be taken seriously. --Macros 00:47, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * That closemindeness(lol?) is why there is argument.--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:48, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * That was a joke. And I left unsaid that the reason it will never amount to much is because no one wants to work on it. ^Look up^ if you want proof. --Macros 00:50, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * And probable lack of support gives users a right to flame?--[[Image:AlariSig.png]] 00:52, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
 * This is the internet. So yes. --Macros 00:53, 10 April 2008 (UTC) -->

Anyway, so yes. Ereanor, What buisness of it is the wikis if a new wiki has been made? I spent about half an hour yesterday talking with progger about this, and I'm not bothering about it. If you're going to ban me for making a new wiki, do so. Though you'll be virtually banning me for no reason.

"Creating a new wiki is not protected by a policy intended to encourage editing in this wiki. EDIT: If anything, it is a violation of that policy against everyone else<strong style="color: black;">reanor 00:10, 10 April 2008 (UTC)" - How is it breaking policy? If I've decided to make a wiki of my own, whats it got to do with you? I'm hardly breaking any policies there. More to be updated. &mdash; Warw/Wick 16:14, 11 April 2008 (UTC)


 * I'll quote myself from the end of that conversation: "Avoiding real conflicts is what feeds empty wiki drama". I think we've proved me right, your stubborn evasion against my pushing has provoked all your complaints about me. This is not a flame war, don't try to make it look like one. It's actually very simple: it's not enough to acknowledge, pos hoc, the community's opposition, actions are what matter. You created that wiki, so if you really want to respect this community's opinion (and the policy that Alari brought up) and consider it a mistake, amend it. Do whatever is necessary to get it deleted. If that's not your intention, we shall keep arguing about it.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 16:20, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Do I really have to explain to you why using GuildWiki's name to create a wiki the GuildWiki's community doesn't want is a violation of "You are valuable" against that community?[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 16:24, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) That was rapidly turning into a flame war between you and Alari. I won't speak about this matter any more, Ereanor, because in my opinion, your opinion on the matter doesnt matter- You're one of the people who is happy with the way GWW was being run. At least, it seems that way, as you were happy to contribute there as well. I'm not breaking GW:YAV, I don't mean it doesnt matter, I mean its bias- You "Approve" of GWW. GW2 is a extra precaution to GuildWiki incase GW2W ends up like GWW. And if it doesn't, I'm remaining with GW2. The community has nothing to do with it. This is wikias choice, and its wikias site. I will NOT try to get the site deleted on the whim of one person. Entropy won't stop me either. And to be honest, it was You and Entropy who were doing the most arguing. And Alari, of course. As a note, why did you bother to be on my talkpage when it was clear that I wasn't going to be on the wiki, and was going to be asleep? As I've said, this isn't the community's decision- Its both Wikia and GW2's communities. Now, I won't deny that I did add this up. I dislike the offical wikis, and GW2W is, I fear, going to end up the same. And so, I made GW2. End of. I won't be arguing with you, Ereanor. I'll talk to you reasonably about it, but I refuse to argue with you. You're clearly trying to antagonise me, but I won't argue with you. How am I breaching GW:YAV? Please, tell me that in terms I understand. I have no idea what you're saying. GuildWiki is part of Wikia, so its Wikias decision as to whether or not its used. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 16:28, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Now, that is flaming. You've just acused one of the editors that has fiercely fought to change GWW's ways of supporting them, that hurt me. The community is everything! Not wikia (don't get me strated about wikia), not you, not me, not Entropy. As long as we can see some consensus among the community we must respect it, that's why we respect policies, not because they are enforced, and that's why I'm not asking for a ban against you. But you did violate GW:YAV. You bulldozed through everyone of us by using our name to create your preemptive wiki, as if we were not valuable. And that's another point, you can't justify the present existence of your wiki based on a posible GW2W, I'll believe in having an alternative when GW2W is properly active, and only if it shows unsalvable mistakes.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 16:39, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, Ereanor, I can, because I just did. Some of the wikia things I disagree strongly with, but Im used to it now. I had no idea what you've done on GWW. I refuse to contribute there. Anyway, how is it your name? Its as much mine as it is yours. Anyway, If you insist I can change the name perfectly easily. Its just the fact that that site was made to form a off-branch for this site. Specifically, the issue is on that site, not this one. I havn't broken any policies on this site. Any since there arn't any policies on the other site, I can't break any policies. There is truthfully as far as I can see no way that I broke YAV. I never said you weren't valuable. I was sheerly using the name. I can't see any reasons for your such strong arguments. Just ignore the wiki if you want. Theres nothing that I can do to delete the wiki except for messaging Wikia- Which my pride prevents me from doing. Pride is overrated, but I'm one of those who it matters to. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 16:46, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It's your name, my name, our name, that's exactly what I'm saying. Yeah, you can change the name, but the name issue is not about that, is about you using that name with the intention of making us support it. You want an alternative for GW2W, that's fine, but that also means, wheter you want it or not, that the Guild Wars community would split in two, again. We don't want that, so I'm asking you to take responsabilit for that consecuence and act accordingly.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 16:55, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I never had any intention of making you support it. as is evidenced by the fact that I havn't advertised it anywhere on the wiki. The community isn't likely to split unless the whole community does- Which is the whole point of that wiki. The wiki will be used as a data reserve, a GuildWikian sanctuary incase GW2W becomes like GWW and a wikia guildwars2wiki. All of them are useful, just to different people. As a note, GW2 is licensed under the GDFL. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 16:58, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Talking about a "GuildWikian sanctuary" expresses your intention of making us go and work on it, explains why you use the name you used, and proves my point. It's naive to think making that wiki is of no greater concecuence, I'm telling you it's sole existence goes against the community's intention to reunite, precisely because of your attitude. I'll assume good faith and think you didn't like the split that occured when GWW came out. Please realize you're setting the scenario for it to happen again.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 17:12, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * No, I'm getting ready for when GW2W ends up like GWW. And its true, if GW2W ends up like GWW, then most people from GuildWiki will go there. I'm not telling ANYONE to go there. You're just implying that I am. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 17:16, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * You know you're basing all your actions in an assumption wich may turn out being false, right? Because, believe me, it can, and it probably will because most users have and will go to GW2W and make it the best way they can, myself included. Don't you see the risk you're making us take today based solely in that future assumption?[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 17:23, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * No, I'm making a Just In Case. And regardless, I'll contribute to it as well as GW2W, as well as the other purpose I named for it - It being a data reserve. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 17:26, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Ok, it seems like there are 2 divergent views of what GW2 is supposed to be. It looks like Warwick wants GW2 to be a direct, unused copy of GW2W until GW2W blows up and people want to leave it.  Which seems like a potentially good idea.  However, the very existence for GW2 is rather pessimistic, in that it assumes GW2W will fail.  Ereanor might fear that the existence of GW2 will be a self-fulfilling prophecy.  That's just how I've seen this debate (from my short browsing).  JonTheMon 17:28, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I am pessimestic. I'm not sure what Ereanor is so worried about- If it happens, it was gonna happen anyway.. =| &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 17:32, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Nothing wrong with preparing for the worst, but relying on the worst is a bad idea, in my opinion Zulu Inuoe 17:44, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

(ri)Bah drama. May you know my opinion on the issue but I want to let everyone know what I'm thinking about it anyway.

There was a concensus that GWiki (let's see it as a company) would NOT support GWiki2. It wouldn't be made, and everyone in the company would go and work for GW2W when GW2 would come out and if you didn't like it, tough luck, but there isn't much not to be liked imo. Now one employer of this particular company still creates the particular product the company agreed NOT to make behind the back of the company, and uses the company's name for it. Then he (she in this case) says 'look I know you didn't like it but I still made it. Sucks for you but there's no way back, now will you please support it?'. If you'd work for me I'd fire you. It's against the spirit of the company (wiki) and of course we won't support it, we agreed it'd never be made.

Now the best thing you could probably do is delete the wiki (or ask it to be deleted) and forget this has ever happened. There is no point for this wiki to exist. Besides you said you'd steal the content of GW2W basically, and isn't that against some sort of license? Don't know the exact details, I'm no lawyer. Nor am I an admin or anyone with any influence on this wiki but I still think you aren't doing the right thing here and I hope we can change your mind. I won't support GWiki2 and I wonder how many people will. If you don't like GW2W, let people over there know! Policies are being made and from what I've heard it won't be bad. Of course there are some rotten apples in the basket, but everyone will work to pick them out.

Anyway that's what I wanted to say. Most of it you already knew but I hope you'll not put it down beside you this time. -- -- talkpage 17:49, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Both wikis are GDFL licensed, so copy away I can. And I Know, prog- read the above last section. Well, this section meh.. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 17:55, 11 April 2008 (UTC)


 * Dyou think you'd get away with stealing all of GW2W's content? --[[Image:Progr.png]] -- talkpage 17:57, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * No, just pointing out that theres nothing stopping me from doing it. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 17:58, 11 April 2008 (UTC)


 * That's just hypocritical. --[[Image:Progr.png]] -- talkpage 17:59, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Warwick, think about it, if GWikians focused on your GW2, then we wouldn't be able to make GW2W more run like GW. [[Image:Thoughtful-new-sig.jpg]] Thoughtful 18:00, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Prog, how is it hypocritical? I wasn't going to do it, I was just pointing out that nothing stopped me from doing it. And Thoughtful, i dont expect anyone to contribute to my wiki. They wont. Unless Gw2w turns out like GWW. -.- &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 18:03, 11 April 2008 (UTC)


 * You're just assuming that GW2W will be one big flame fest and asplode very soon after it's creation, which is just silly. Why would it? And you're basically saying this: 'Oh looky, I am stealing all your content that you worked so hard for to create, just because this license doesn't say I can't! You want me to stop? Bite me.' And you ask what's hypocritical about that? Hmmmm... --[[Image:Progr.png]] -- talkpage 18:06, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * This is turning into a flamefest again -_-. I thought we agreed to stop arguing here? And prog, Listen to me. I said I wasn't going to copy them, I said that license doesnt stop me. -.- Afk now. Dinner. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 18:07, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * Guys, don't turn this thing backwards. We already know the community doesn't want a new wiki, we already know it's a better idea to go to GW2W and make it te best we can. And May knows all this as well. That's not the point here. The point is realizing the potential disaster GW2 may trigger and putting an end to it.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 18:09, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * How can it pose a potential disaster? Everyones agreed to ignore it. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 18:12, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * By how many upset posts there are on this page, that doesn't seem to be the case Zulu Inuoe 18:21, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I dunno, I like my disruptive userpage on GW2. Lord of all tyria 18:38, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

I feel I gotta step in here. -User:PanSola (talk to the ) 19:41, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * 1) To Ereanor and Warwick: Warwick did not break GW:YAV.
 * 2) * S/he may have ignored the majority of the vocal GuildWiki community's opinions/desire/consensus
 * 3) * S/he may have made use of the GuildWiki name (and derived the "GuildWiki2" out of it) without this community's prior consent nor support, but created an impression (which Warwick may or may not have intended) that GuildWiki2 is (emphasis on present tense) affiliated or is supported by GuidWikians
 * 4) * S/he may have created a self-fulfilling prophecy by carving out a niche space for extreme GWW-dislikers to hangout for GW2W instead of help preventing GW2W into turning into GWW.
 * But these things do NOT break GW:YAV. GW:YAV is a policy against user's self-deprecation of saying "fine, whatever you say, you are the veteran/admin/boss here and I'm just a newbie/nobody".  Ereanor, please re-read the policy carefully so you don't misinterpret it again.  Warwick, please go read the policy so you can properly point out the key issue in the misuse when it is being inappropriately used to accuse you.
 * 1) To Prog: With proper attribution, the GFDL license does allow full copying of content from one site to the other (if both are GFDL).  So GW2 can legally take everything on GW2W and put it on their own wiki, provided that GW2 added the notes on every article stating "This article is derived from the GW2W article (link), whose list of contributors can be found here: (link to GW2W article history)."  Because of the attribution, I wouldn't quite call it stealing, but yes, GW2 can legally rip everything GW2W has.  In fact, that is the very spirit of the GFDL license: the freedom to reproduce and produce derived works (keeping the license while doing so, and give credit where credit is due).
 * 2) To Warwick: you might want to consider the concern of the derivative use of the name "GuildWiki" producing "GuildWiki2".  In the face of the current majority vocal opposition to the general idea, the backlash might be reduced if you can disassociate the name (at least the "misrepresentation" issue which may or may not be intentional is removed).  Wikia is not going to make the new wiki CC BY-NC-SA license anyways, so you can't even claim any heritage of content.

Pan, I said: Creating a new wiki is not protected by a policy intended to encourage editing in this wiki (so yeah, I know what it is about). If anything, it is a violation of that policy against everyone else. AFTER Alari brought up the policy as an argument to validate a wiki proposed by only one person. That's it, had I thought it was an actual policy breach, an admin would've been notified. May quoted me (a bit out of context) and asked me to explain why would it be a policy breach. Don't twist me that much, please.<strong style="color: black;">reanor 19:51, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) I've read through all of the policies several times now, and I don't quite understand what hes saying about it- he seemed to start saying somthing, then change it immediately. And also, I suppose that that may be somthing. I'll stretch my creativity to find another name.. GW2W is taken.. Hmm.. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 19:52, 11 April 2008 (UTC)


 * guildwars2wikipediawebpage.com.wikia.com? :) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage 19:59, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * The name doesn't matter, I'll whine anyway.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 20:00, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * In that case I'll just selectively remove your comments, Ereanor. And Viper, its already Guildwars2.wikia.com &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 20:05, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm just saying my main point is the potential community split. And btw, from GW:YAV You have the same responsibility to respect our traditions and guiding principles, just like everybody else.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 20:08, 11 April 2008 (UTC)