Talk:Game updates/Archive9

Older update obsidian chest change
Sometime this year, I believe there has been a change to the way obsidian chests work in FoW. I recently completed a clearing of FoW where we cleared THEN we finished quests. During clearing, there were 2 obsidian chests. After we started taking/finishing quests more obsidian chests spawned at various locations around FoW. Once we had finished all the quests, we ran a victory lap looking for more chests, and came up with a total of 7. Now, I had done this once before (clear->quests) and I noted no such dearth of chests that time.

I suspect it is a change, but I don't know when (I hadn't FoW'ed in probably a month, and I our usual behavior down there is to take the quests as they become available rather than saving them all for the end).

I plan on doing a similar clear of UW to see if that behaves this way as well, but I'm curious if anyone else has documented this behavior before? -- Oblio (talk) 12:03, 7 March 2007 (CST)

It's happening in Domain of Anguish as well. There are very few chests, and more spawn depending on finishing quests (and/or killing monsters?). I think that's Anet's response to chest running, which is a very boring activity that is really unfair to those people who actually go through the work of killing stuff, instead of just running around. I say it's a good thing. NightAngel 13:29, 7 March 2007 (CST)


 * This explains why UW is so empty of chests nowdays. It must be the same thing. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 14:17, 7 March 2007 (CST)


 * Previously to that FoW run, I had recently done 1 UW clearing run (almost no quests) and found it to be mostly empty as well (2 chests throughout all except the spawning pools (which we didn't do based on time). Unfortunately, to test this, you have to clear first then quest, which will be much more difficult to test in UW since my prefered testing team is a 2man-BP and minions don't teleport. Regarding DoA, I have only spent time in Gloom, and the very few chests that seemed to be available now seem to be gone (but that is a lot of "seem"). With regard to "good or bad", I will refrain from editorializing here. -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 14:34, 7 March 2007 (CST)


 * I haven't seen chests in UW for ages now, so this must be an old update. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 15:06, 7 March 2007 (CST)


 * For gloom, particularly, it is very common for a chest to appear at the Rift after you capture it and finish the Closing the Rift reward. Or to get a demonic chest to appear together with the Ravenheart chest when you finish killing the Darknesses, etc. I've seen it in Veil too. I think it is something new, this "chests appear as you finish quests" thing. And why not editorialize, this is the talk page, we can surely share our opinions here. I wouldn't put "and that's a good thing" on the update page, which should stay clean and factual, but this is a good place as any to comment on it :) NightAngel 16:22, 7 March 2007 (CST)

I put notes in the February 14th update about what happened to the chests. --Karlos 20:00, 7 March 2007 (CST)


 * I see. What about the FoW and UW changes? Should we just not add them? --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 04:07, 8 March 2007 (CST)


 * The note, if you read it carefully does say that ALL chest spawns in the game have changed. I don't think further elaboration is needed on that note. --Karlos 14:34, 8 March 2007 (CST)


 * I added the word "all" into that sentence to clear it up. Good enough for me. -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 14:46, 8 March 2007 (CST)

Regarding UW a full run through questing (avoided servants of grenth and horseman quest) i only found two chests with one in Chaos Planes and other in Spawning Pool. I didn't see a change with ecto as the party received a healthy drop of 12-14 ecto.

Again regarding UW, I think this change has been round for quite a while, about a month ago there was a huge drop in the number of chests i found on ele UW runs, used to be at least 1 per run but now theres about 1 every 5 runs

I did 5 Chest Run in FoW yesterday. The big amount of chest (without quest) was 4, the less 0. I think it's very depend but yes Anet removed a lot of chest. --Benoit flageol 12:12, 13 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Yea sometimes chests spawn when killing monsters in FoW our group was in the middle of the quest ([The Eternal Forgemaster]) Once we cleard the patch to the main gate the chest appeared...--Dr.D 10:56, 16 March 2007 (CDT)

Perhaps with the free UW/FoW access coming up tis weekend it would be a good time to test and prove these ideas?
 * Already prooved. --Benoit flageol 18:07, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

March 20th Update
Your qualified character will have access to UW and FoW.... They mean acended ? --Benoit flageol 20:49, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I would assume so. &mdash; [[Image:Fin_sig.gif|User:Kyrasantae]] kyrasantae  20:56, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Or Weh no Su, or Nightfall characters who completed Hunted!. -- Gordon Ecker 21:04, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes yes and yes, see the scribe. --Armond Warblade (talk) 20:07, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Seems odd to me that ANet is promoting high-level farming. 82.17.103.240 03:54, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I don't think that's just for farming purpose.. in the opposite, there is a lot of XP and quests to do in theses areas, not just simple farm.. And it will also let people from regions that hasn't big window of favor to go to theses maps in the normal way to play them.. :) &mdash; Corsaire  [[image:Corsaire_Signature.gif]] 04:00, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I think it's to decrease the price of glob of ectos and obsidians shards in a over farming. --Benoit flageol 10:18, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * No, ANet have no interest whatsoever in decreasing prices for high-end items. I've heard rumors about ANet killing the favor system altogether. This is most probably the test weekend before the actual change. This would make sense on multiple levels, and the first that comes to mind is to allow Japan and (*)China access to these areas.  &mdash;  n00kie  (ping) 11:31, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I would consider this change rather "ho-hum". I constantly hear people say "I'm going to switch over to Europe so I can get favor FOREVER!!!", but what's the point?  As an American, I've never really had a problem getting into the UW and FoW when I need to, and there have been few (very few) times when I just NEEDED to get in there when we didn't have favor.  I tend to not see Japan and China on the board, so I can see the positive change there.  It just seems easier to keep the favor system, but also have team-based PvE challenges to ALSO allow favor (or, at least, entrance).  I'm also okay with them allowing for multiple favor, as well.
 * As a mostly PvE player, I think it's highly unfair to base some aspects of PvE (read access to high-level areas) on something PvE players have absolutely no control over. This is made much worse by the fact that the only territories I ever see with favor are Europe, America and rarely Korea (and it's been a while). &mdash;Khudzlin 14:57, 30 March 2007 (CDT)


 * If they do away with favor completely, however, what is the point of HoH, other than for some weapon skins? --Mystisteel 13:47, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * From an HA player's perspective I really don't think it was ever about favor. I mean, I've never heard of any happening where a guild/group of friends wanted to do FoW/UW and asked their guildmates/friends to go win them favor.  &mdash;  n00kie  (ping) 13:55, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * The only people who do that (read: myself) never get a good group and die on the first PvP map there. --Armond Warblade (talk) 14:21, 22 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Unfortunately I'm gone all weekend for some book publishing business(es). So I wont be able to participate in this. My thought was that they may stay with this idea (as long as one is ascended, they can pay 1k to go into the FoW or UW, regardless of territory). This would probably reduce the ecto/shard rate (or ANet could keep the same price, but reduce the chances of getting one even more). Or perhaps they might stick with this idea and open up a new region? (available to those with favor). that'd be a thought.--Ambuu 16:02, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Decrease the price = good idea. Decrease the chance of drop = bad idea.. its already at 2% for smites and 4% for Attaxes. But I'm okay with a regardless on territory for favor. --Benoit flageol 18:06, 22 March 2007 (CDT)


 * You don't even have to pay the 1k this weekend. --Armond Warblade (talk) 20:07, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

29th's silent update
At least two skill descriptions have changed although their actual effects have not. See Talk:Crippling Slash and this edit to Pestilence. I'm not motivated enough to look through other skills to see if anything else was touched. --Fyren 04:54, 30 March 2007 (CDT)
 * HA party size of 8 also. And looking at GWW it's supposed to stay 8. No word on the skills :/ &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 05:24, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

I was playing with my Paragon last night and noticed something I was happy to see. My echos (Mending/Agressive refrain) were being re-applied by ALL shouts and chants, even if they were in place before the last time the echo was applied. Before the update if I had a shout on me that was in place before I put up my echo, the echo was not re-applied when that shout/chant ended, so I had to always make sure I had a "newer" shout/chant (newer than the last echo) up each time the echo applied. Very glad they fixed this. --Tom128 10:17, 30 March 2007 (CDT)


 * I take back that above comment. I swear it was working last night, but it was not doing it for me today. I know I was not that tired... --Tom128 17:31, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

Try using a key on a locked chest and you will see part of the code "Use KeyCancel". --Some Random Anon &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 87.64.22.111 (contribs) 17:26, 30 March 2007.


 * I think this might be a formatting error in the dialog. "Use Key" and "Cancel" may be associated with the 2 buttons. 75.89.77.39 22:52, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

Update isn't silent anymore, it's on the website. Also add under the notes the Keycancel things introduced when opening chests.Jelmewnema 13:07, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

So I'm assuming it's double faction in HA only? CannibalBob 21:22, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

2007-3-30 Silent Update
Anyone know what's happening here with this update? -- Tarun 23:54, 30 March 2007 (CDT)
 * At the very least they changed the descriptions I mentioned before back to normal. --Fyren 00:12, 31 March 2007 (CDT)

Check Kamadan, Lion Arch and Shing Jea. And look at your character. Surprise! §: Tu?ipVõr?ax Talk 04:11, 1 April 2007 (CDT)

April's Fools... -Cel

keycancel
does not appeatr anymore, or at least not on phantom chests.


 * Nor canthan chests. --Armond Warblade (talk) 06:49, 1 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Nor Obsidian Chest. --Benoit flageol 11:12, 1 April 2007 (CDT)

1st April 07
There was a stealth update on this day. Characters at Lion's Arch]] and Kamadan change sex. It should be written here even if it isn't on GW official page? --Glenn 07:43, 1 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Confirmed that this is also occurring at Shing Jea Monastery today. But more importantly, has anyone seen anything else odd? I'm thinking there probably are some other more subtle pranks laid by those Anet folk and that they wouldn't settle for just the gender change. -- Mike Arms 12:25, 1 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Maybe Lucky Aura will actually do something for once.... ;-) Argel 00:36, 2 April 2007 (CDT)
 * There wasn't anything yesterday except for gender change Timir222 10:38, 2 April 2007 (GMT)
 * Perhaps it was just an april fools joke?--66.66.11.47 20:16, 2 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Next up on Captain Obvious TV: We are using the internet! –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 20:23, 2 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Stop mocking the new users! And to 66.66.11.47, yes, it was an April Fools joke. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    20:25, 2 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I love captain obvious and his henchmen! Sirocco 17:06, 3 April 2007 (CDT)

command post spirit
I just realized the toxicity spirit that was dropped by the smuggler in the command post does happen any more, when was that changed? -- Xeon 07:23, 3 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Never mind there he goes and drops it again -- Xeon 08:05, 3 April 2007 (CDT)
 * lol. --Benoit flageol 17:00, 3 April 2007 (CDT)

Getting the same update its a big 'un.. loading on both PCs and the DL time is SLOWWWwwwwww....

The bear
I want have a bear like pet, how I can do?

(je veux avoir un ours comme, familier comment puis-je faire?)
 * Charm Animal, usually. Bears are easily found in the Southern Shiverpeaks and in Pre-Searing. -Auron [[Image:Elit Druin.jpg|19px||My Talk]] 22:10, 5 April 2007 (CDT)
 * You could try posting your stupid questions in a forum.
 * You could have a look at GW:NPA and GW:SIGN. --Hhhippo 13:29, 24 April 2007 (CDT)

april update
it changed the mask for 15k canthan assassin armour (male at least)... I'll post pics on the page to show it  ~ Soqed Hozi ~  11:39, 6 April 2007 (CDT)

Greek Text
When was support for this added? was it with the russian text. It wasnt there before--213.7.48.114 17:00, 7 April 2007 (CDT)

Easter goodies?
I haven't run across mention of the eggs and bunnies that are dropping. Did this make it into the wiki?
 * Golden Egg and Chocolate Bunny. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (gem / talk) 11:43, 8 April 2007 (CDT)

the update a little while ago
They fixed up the bottom of the text in the chat window with the small interface. -- Xeon 00:23, 9 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Burst of Aggression has been modified. At 0 Strength, it now lasts 2 seconds. Oscidaes 20:33, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Maybe this will finally spell the death for BoA sins...  but probably not.  They'll just switch to flurry. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    20:35, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I still see no difference how do u lower it from 2-10 if its 2-8 or lamens terms BoA=2-8 so how do u nerf it if its *Decreased* to 2-10?Stevo101 20:50, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * They also nerfed one of the sin attack skills in the chain... to do a whopping 7 less damage... does that spell the death of the boa sin? 66.65.34.242 20:54, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * no but i want an awnser, how do u decrease it if u increased the time..Stevo101 20:56, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Are you retarded? From 5..9 to 2..8 seconds. Bye BoA sin. --&#91;riVen] 21:03, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * They dropped the minimum duration from 5 seconds to 2. --Kale Ironfist 21:02, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I like these updates. I hated BoA sins and I'm glad those lame ZB monks got hit with the ban-stick, too.  Cheap builds.--CannibalBob 23:45, 10 April 2007 (CDT)

boa sins sucked anyway, too little durability, hopfully this will bring them to their senses, that boa is a waste of time, it does NOTHING! btw, flurry will decrease their damaage, so that nub to use, and well, those nub-ass boa sins...if they dont come round they obviously even more n00b than i first thought, which is prettty n00b.  ~ Soqed Hozi ~  22:30, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Hint: Flurry only affects base damage. Assassins do about 40 base damage and about 400 bonus damage in a combo, so that's only gonna drop it off by 10 dmg or so. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    22:42, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Zerris is correct, which is why I always used flurry anyway. Being able to attack faster 100% of the time is greater than 5 seconds of the time, despite doing ~10-15 damage less (in those 5 seconds, not per attack).  But then again, I don't follow a cookie cutter build anyway.Cyrogenic 13:56, 11 April 2007 (CDT)

Other than BoA sin news, anyone feel that they nerfed most classes except for Necros? They reduced energy cost in a few skills. I can see that Anet not going to give us back freedom in Soul Reaping, but in time I can see the majority of necro skills having a cheap energy cost.
 * Paragons didn't get touched :D:D--CannibalBob 23:45, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * They ran out of things to nerf for Paragons, that's why. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]   23:54, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Hahaha, hey guys, lets go make "Incoming!"last for half a second now lol. Readem (talk *contribs ) 13:56, 11 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Stop giving them ideas. ;-)  Cyrogenic 13:59, 11 April 2007 (CDT)

Just for the heck of it... they double-spaced quest steps Lostage 22:53, 10 April 2007 (CDT)

April 10, 2007 updates
Nerco changes Surely the energy cost decreases are to offset the Soul Reaping nerf. But these changes don't come nearly close enough to compensate. --Mooseyfate 23:09, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I wouldn't mind the soul reaping nerf if all the necro's skills didn't cost 15 energy. A few of em got moved down to 10, its a start.Death Queen Arabess 23:20, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * As far as I can tell, the objective was to stop every single healer in Heroes' Ascent from being Necromancer Primary, and to leave the healing to the real monks. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]   23:22, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah the HB necros were getting a little nuts --Lania Elderfire[[Image:Pinkribbonsig.gif|My Talk]] 23:35, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * The SR nerf did not bother me much when I played my Necro, but this buff... :o I'm more powerful in PvE than before! -- 82.169.153.174 06:20, 11 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah PvE >.>, they nerfed necro because of PvP in the first place -.- --Birchwooda Treehug 10:35, 11 April 2007 (CDT)

Guild wars won't start
My guild wars hasn't been starting and I think it's because of this new "update" (I use quotes because it doesn't even load). Has anybody else experienced this problem or know how to fix it? -Isi
 * Probaly a stupid responce but have you installed new anti virus software recently without oking the guild wars app.? My guild wars wont open once it tries to update without me allowing it through the norton firewall.--Sefre  [[Image:Sefresig.jpg|15px|]] 00:36, 11 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I'm having the same problem, and no, I havn't installed anything new. It was working fine until after the update. - Sorrows_Flame

Improved Storage
When did they improve the storage size? It's awesome - but I must have missed the update note on it! Kind Regards (Girion 08:47, 11 April 2007 (CDT))
 * lol? Game_updates/20070405 &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 09:41, 11 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I must have completely bypassed that one - but it is sweet! Just send my mule to the graveyard.. RIP and Kind Regards (Girion 09:53, 11 April 2007 (CDT))

Skill Balances
Is it just me or does Anet not know what they want to do. They keep buffing skills only to nerf them again. Crazy. 68.226.178.120 23:57, 13 April 2007 (CDT)
 * it's not easy being Random --Honorable Sarah [[image:Honorable_Icon.gif]] 23:59, 13 April 2007 (CDT)
 * When you buff new skills you expect them to be changed after so they fit better into the overall game. -- Xeon 00:26, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

Conjure Line Nerfed
Good or bad? I say bad because who uses conjures in PvP? I thought the balances was all about making PvP "fair."
 * Your kidding... All warrs have been using this since its buff in pvp, this skill is not widely used in PvE at all. -- Xeon 01:26, 14 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Flame is used with barrage and Mark of Rodgort. --Armond Warblade (talk) 02:00, 14 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Although conjures where nerfed a bit, the're still very good. Check the history of those skills and se how they where before any buff. Horror. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 09:07, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

Wow, you don't play GvG's, do you? 3/4 of builds involved W/E or D/E or sometimes A/E with Conjure Flame + Mark of Rodgort... - (Abedeus) 13:02, 14 April 2007 (CDT)


 * And to think, when i posted a W/E build using mark of rodgort, and conjure flame, it got deleted almost instantly lol. I've been running builds like that for months, Conjure Flame adds for nice dmg, but in my opinion, the burning is what makes it work. It adds wonderfull pressure as you are wackin em with your sword(adding bleeding and gash to the mix of course :D ). Death Queen Arabess 13:33, 14 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Any W/E Rodgort build + Conjure usually gets deleted immediately because there are much better ways to utilize the combo...Mark of Rodgort is 15 expensive energy, especially for a Warrior, and a lot of those Conjure builds put anywhere from 8-12 ranks to Fire magic just for Conjure/Mark. Which is complete silliness...It's fine to stick leftover points into Conjure for some nice, easy bonus damage. But if you don't have your typical PvP frontliner utilities - speedbuff or snare, deepwound, condition removal if possible, maybe selfheal, etc - then you're not going anywhere anyways. Sever + Gash + Conjure + Mark is an okay combo at best, nothing spectacular. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:47, 14 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Don't people remove enchantments these days? The un-nerfed Conjure spells had fairly long recharges-30 seconds--CannibalBob 16:06, 14 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, mark is 15 energy, and conjure is 10, but thats what glyph of less energy is for. And that 'okay at beast' combo of sever+gash+conjure+mark, rapes sins and warroirs in seconds. Who doesn't want to deal -9 degen and deep wound, while maintaining the ability to wack people with your sword. And yeah, the build has counters, but so does every god damn build you use, whats your point. The only time i've ever lost a scrimmage match using my conjure/mark build, was against a derv using mystic regen. Problem is, all you fucking morons that are deciding which builds are good and which aren't, are a bunch of stuck up, head up your ass morons, who wouldn't know a good build if it fucked your mom in the ass. I'm sick of all you 'elite' PvPers saying what builds suck, and which don't, cause guess what, my conjure/mark warroir build probably kick the shit outta your warroir or sin, or w/e other melee you wanna fight me with. The killer in the build is the degen, not conjure flame, enchant removal might remove a few points of dmg, but you're still giving the other guy -6 degen, and -9 after sever, and deep wound after gash. Death Queen Arabess 12:21, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Lolz, must be an RA fan. Ever heard of Cripslash warrior? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 12:33, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Also, keep GW:NPA and GW:YAV in mind. –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 12:55, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Warriors do not have skill slots to waste on inferior effects. Conjure Warriors are already at a disadvantage in utility compared to others by one slot, a slot that could be filled with grasping earth, shock, bull's strike, protector's strike, disrupting chop, etc. Using 3 skill slots will put you at a real, real disadvantage - you will have to drop attack skills or IAS, speed buff, healing, disrupting. &mdash; Skuld 12:28, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Conjure is usually a bad idea. Readem (talk *contribs ) 12:42, 15 April 2007 (CDT)

Typically Friday 13th.. it's nerfday then. &mdash;Sig mA   15:00, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

Adjust Skill Progression
Skills have a 0...15 attribute level progression while GuildWiki still use 0...12 attribute level progression. Wouldn't it be time soon to start adjusting all skills to 0...15 instead? --Lexxor 04:34, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I find 0-12 to be more useful for the average user on everything but updates. If you look at the actual templates, you will see we *do* use 0-15 for extrapolating values at attribute levels we have no yet reached. I bet I mispelled that. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    04:37, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * The Skill Monitor uses 0...12. -- Gordon Ecker 06:21, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes, in-game they use 0...12 so we should use that on wiki. --Heurist 11:17, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * The only reason its 0...15 is because of the way they created their formula for skill progression, for some reason anet also prefer to report it as a 0...15 progression on their game updates. Because this is a direct copy of their game update page, we report it as such. 0...12 progression makes more sense, not only does the skill monitor report it with a 0...12 progression, secondary professions can not go past 12 (not including special event items to boost attribute levels in PvE). -- Xeon 12:16, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I like 0..12 in that you can't get 13+ as secondary (at least, not just with armor). 0..15 is kind of lame, why not 0..16?  I've seen 0..12..16 before, which would be the best way to express a skill, ie. CLEAVE: If this attack hits, you strike for +10...26...31 damage.--CannibalBob 16:42, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Because ANet uses 0...15 in the update notes and the 0 and 15 values always seem to be whole integers, while the 16 values are often rounded. -- Gordon Ecker 20:12, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah. It's very possible, that the game code is made such, that you enter the 0 and 15 values, and the game makes the rest by itself, just like our progression tables. As such, it's easy for ANet developers to just copy these numbers from the code and would explain it. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 06:23, 16 April 2007 (CDT)

message of the day
??? ~ Soqed Hozi ~ 
 * !!! &mdash;Aranth 21:00, 16 April 2007 (CDT)
 * $$$ &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 21:18, 16 April 2007 (CDT)
 * /%/%/% &mdash;[[Image:BlastThatT.jpg]]Blastedt 11:32, 18 April 2007 (CDT)

My thoughts exactly lol ***  ~ Soqed Hozi ~  14:09, 18 April 2007 (CDT)

Armors
When does Elonian Armor were added to the game at Consulate Docks ? §: Tu?ipVõr?ax Talk 03:08, 17 April 2007 (CDT)


 * It's been there since nightfall was released. --Armond Warblade (talk) 03:11, 17 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Yeah, you probably didn't notice it earlier because it's only available for Paragons and Dervishes. -- Gordon Ecker 03:14, 17 April 2007 (CDT)


 * That's it! My first Elonian character is an Elem. §: Tu?ipVõr?ax Talk 03:32, 17 April 2007 (CDT)

Messaging
Did you used to be able to click an NPCs name in the chat and send him a whisper? --Armond Warblade (talk) 03:11, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes. I remember doing it to Rurik in the early Prophecies missions.  --Fyren 03:58, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Lemme guess... Rurik then went to "Do Not Disturb" and rushed a mob of Charr? --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    04:05, 17 April 2007 (CDT)

Quest log
Does anyone know when the bullet points in the quest log became double-spaced? -- Gordon Ecker 03:19, 17 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Some days ago, last or before last update. And i hate it ! §: Tu?ipVõr?ax Talk 03:33, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * There's a comment further up this talk page that mentions it: "Just for the heck of it... they double-spaced quest steps Lostage 22:53, 10 April 2007 (CDT)" &mdash; [[Image:Fin_sig.gif|User:Kyrasantae]] kyrasantae   03:40, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * It's irritating and horrible. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (gem / talk) 06:18, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Maybe they want us to read between the lines... Foo 07:04, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * ROFL, you've just won a Lyssa's Cookie of Bemusement!!! (-: -PanSola 07:27, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, thank you :] Foo 11:01, 17 April 2007 (CDT)

Worse thing is that things like new quest aren't showing up in center of screen and near top, but in right-down corner of screen. It's ruining old "climate" of the game, when there was a "whooosh" sound after accepting quest... - (Abedeus) 07:19, 17 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Umm, I think it depends on the location of certain UI pieces. I have the text in the same default position as always. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (gem / talk) 07:25, 17 April 2007 (CDT)


 * I still get a whoosh sound, at least when changing from one quest to another. You sure your quest is for the continent you're on? --Armond Warblade (talk) 12:19, 17 April 2007 (CDT)

Change of afflicted skills
When going through some lowlevel missions for the master rewards, i noticed the monsters had elites. Image:Afflicted_ranger_using_elite.JPG I also have pictures of other lowlevel monsters using elites. Should it be added to the updates? Jelmewnema 14:56, 17 April 2007 (CDT)

Can anyone confirm or deny the presence of low level monsters having elites before this update? If it can be confirmed they didnt't, it should be added to the wiki notes.--Ryudo 19:03, 17 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Sounds like a bug to me. Bug = mention + wait for fix. I fixed up the above coding, btw. --Armond Warblade (talk) 01:15, 18 April 2007 (CDT)


 * I do not have screenshot proof, but I am 100% sure Afflicted never used Elites before getting to Level 20 - i.e., not before reaching the Mainland and seeing them in Wajjun Bazaar, Bukdek Byway, The Undercity, etc. I clearly do not remember any Elites on Shing Jea, not on Afflicted anyways...Maybe this is related to Hard mode, which said to tune some normal-mode monsters too? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:32, 18 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Hardmode was also the first thing that came in my mind. It is probably something that slipped through together with the changed soul explosions.Jelmewnema 01:57, 18 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes, level 10 necromancers using Order of Apostasy in Vizunah Square was a very odd sight. I thought I just missed it every single other time I did it but this makes more sense. It must be new. Ocelot never 07:33, 18 April 2007 (CDT)

Aye, that's probably it. Then again, other low levels use elites in other parts of Guild Wars, maybe they are just trying to make Shing Jea harder? Suppose we will find out whenever hard mode comes out. Level 24 Charr FTW! --Ryudo 04:48, 18 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I had this quest on my monk and forgot about it until I decided to clear up my Ascalon quest log. Level 24 charr ftl. --Armond Warblade (talk) 02:29, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I think it was to offset the explosion damage being changed to armor ignoring. - B e X or  [[Image:Bexor.png]] 05:12, 18 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I think so too. The afflicted are not really that hard if it weren't for there explosions, so I don't mind the occasional Elite. There attributes are low, so it doesn't really 'hurt'. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 09:49, 18 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Explosions = no melee class getting survivor from factions. Explosions are offset by the fact that the quests give 3.5-4k xp each. --Armond Warblade (talk) 02:29, 19 April 2007 (CDT)

Yeah this is true, I saw an Afflicted Assasin (under lvl 20) using Shadow Form when I was doing Unwelcome Guest.
 * Does every afflicted then have Elites? Because in Shing Jea, I know of a Ritualist Afflicted Boss (Sentimental Treasures Quest) and Assassin Afflicted Boss (quest right before "To Zen Daijun"). Could you capp their elites? --MagickElf666 23:32, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Nope. All bosses have exact same skills in Hard Mode as Normal Mode. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    00:14, 23 April 2007 (CDT)

Cursor
Not sure if it was the latest update, but my cursor no longer turns red or green when I scroll over creatures in a cutscene. --Armond Warblade (talk) 02:30, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Not the latest one. I noticed that the day before. Perhaps it's been that way even longer. --[[Image:lazyeyes.png]]Ishmaeel .ping ; .peek; 03:46, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I've seen this for as long as I can remember, so I can assure you it wasn't form a recent update. &mdash; [[Image:NessHrinIcon.png]]  Ness  16:01, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Recent as in the past couple of months at least. - B e X or  [[Image:Bexor.png]] 16:18, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I've never noticed it either way... the only thing my cursor goes near is the 'Skip' button. If everyone else doesn't skip, I go for a bite/drink/smoke Tain 16:19, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Smoking kills :( &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 17:01, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Who wants to live long and be wrinkly? Tain 17:09, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * *Raises Hand* --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]   17:11, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * /agree It's better than the alternative. Besides, when you're dead, I'll be old and wrinkly getting my Vanquisher title on my last character. And you'll only have it on one or two. :P --Armond Warblade (talk) 17:34, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Lol good one. -- BrianG 19:42, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * no, thats tain, tain will have it on 7 of 6 characters... curse you tain. Eronth 19:53, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * within a day or two. :p Tain 20:54, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * really? i over estimated, i figured it would be in just seconds of hard mode's openning Eronth 21:15, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I meant a day or two after Proph was released. Tain 21:20, 19 April 2007 (CDT)

Hard Mode
It said on the guild wars site that hard mode would come out in a matter of hours. Anyone know when exactaly.Kharn 17:24, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes, it will be exactly in a matter of hours. -- Peej 17:28, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * NEED HARD MODE *zombie* Maybe I'll be able to get on hard mode tonight... I want that fucking shield. >.> Hard mode farming ftw. --Armond Warblade (talk) 17:37, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Technically, a year is a matter of hours... 8,760 hours. Tain 20:56, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * As is your life. What?–Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 21:24, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * True :p and mine will be fewer hours than yours, given the discussion above. Tain 21:26, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * It's out, 9:43PM Central time

-Thorton

I just got Master's on Abbadon's Gate in Hard Mode... the icon looks pretty sweet, want me to post a screenshot? Tain 22:55, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes, a screenshot would be nice.&mdash; Ali ( talk )  11:09, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Ok, Im sure this sounds lame.......but I have tried jokanur digs mission /hard mode 3x and died/was defeated each time...Any tips? I know hard mode is supposed to be harder, but....I dont think a lvl 20 should be dieing on a noob island mission, hard mode, or not.

Faction
Not sure if this was a recent update, but... I have UAX, and have had it for a while. It used to say "30,000/30,000" for Balthazar Faction. Now it says "30,000/0" instead. --   17:31, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Wierd, I have UAX and 16000/16000 faction. -- Gordon Ecker 17:34, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * It's back to 30,000/30,000. Must have been a temporary bug. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    19:48, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * It's a random bug, I've had it before too. &mdash;[[Image:BlastThatT.jpg]]Blastedt 09:42, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Hard mode update notes
See http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Game_updates:April_2007#Update_-_Thursday_April_19.2C_2007 Danakin 22:08, 19 April 2007 (CDT)

slow interface
Is anyone else getting a slow reaction time with the interface after the hard mode patch? -- Xeon 01:10, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Update - Friday April 20, 2007
Loot Changes

All other rare (gold) items All unique (green) items Special event items

Is the droprate from a weapon like Icy Dragon Sword still the same, or back to the old normal one? Otherwise this sword will become like ... 100k? - UnexistNL(my keyboard is being a basterd atm)
 * Good question. I believe that the game mechanics treats IDS just like green items. only difference is that it is blue, so you will be able to mod it. Foo 11:00, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Can any1 comfirm this? UnexistNL 10:59, 22 April 2007 (CDT)

Does this mean that solo farming for greens is back on? Ghost1
 * Yes 66.65.34.242 23:23, 21 April 2007 (CDT)

when farming low level bosses such as the ones in istan in the nightfall campaign is the stats on their unique weapons max?


 * No, ALL enemies drop the EXACT SAME items they dropped before. Same item name, same stats, NO changes. DKS01 00:35, 23 April 2007 (CDT)


 * I certainly do not believe a word in the Apr 20 "update". My experience since then, as well as the experience of several friends refutes it. For example: out of the last 12 smite runs, I have only gotten ONE ecto and no rares. I used to get AT LEAST one ecto *every* run.Talia 01:33, 25 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Perhaps you were just lucky before then, cause my experience I certainly never got 1 ecto per run, same with the people I play with regularly. Now, I won't say the drop rate has improved, but I don't necessarily think it's gotten worse on ectos either. DKS01 02:12, 25 April 2007 (CDT)


 * They said that you'd get better loot when in a full party too. Nope, no change, and the golds we rarely get are always req 13 anyway. - B e X or  [[Image:Bexor.png]] 01:37, 25 April 2007 (CDT)

Wide Screen
Don't know if anybody mentioned this, but some update a little while back finally fixed Guild Wars for Widescreen, so that it now adjusts itself to proper proportions automatically. --   18:26, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I ran gw fine in widescreen about a year ago >.> –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 18:51, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * On my comp, it always used to stretch it out of proportion. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]   20:20, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Ah, worked fine on my laptop, running 1280*800 on it. (ati card), maybe it's just certain brands/drivers–Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 20:24, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Maby he used a resolution with non-wide screen proportions? Widescreen resolutions hav eworked on Kalomelis computer for a long time. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (gem / talk) 21:12, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I considered him to be smart enough to use the correct resolution >.> –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 21:15, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I think that everyone is just like me, and using an incorrect resolution is just what I would do. ;) --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (gem / talk) 21:26, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Speaking of Widescreen, I hate EA. Sirocco 21:28, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I wouldn't consider myself smart enough to use the right resolution... heck I dont' even know what the different resolutions mean. I'm Brilliant Guild-Wars-Wise, not Computer-Wise :p --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    21:35, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Sirocco, you and me both >.> Zerris: you and the rest of the world keep crushing the little faith I have left in humanity :P –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 22:10, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Just tried it, it doesnt adjust to proper proportions on my comp when I try and run wide screen. It streches everything to hell. =/ --Dice 10:50, 25 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Widescreen always worked perfectly for me with two different notebooks I tried with. I just needed to select the natural resolution of the display panel from graphics options (which is currently 1280x800 fwiw). --[[Image:lazyeyes.png]]Ishmaeel .ping ; .peek; 11:07, 25 April 2007 (CDT)

Pulling with longbow
Article says: "Pulling with a long bow in Hard Mode is impossible if all of the following are true: 1st - the mob is not in your aggro (they don't "see" you, even while you are attacking them), 2nd - the mob is normally stationary (not a patrol)" -- I had not probs pulling anyone in the 'ring of fire' mission in hardmode. Worked just like usual in normal mode too. I used a flatbow though ;) Same range. --217.230.229.181 04:32, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I agree that the note in the article sounds odd. Foo 05:07, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I can confirm this as well. I pulled all the Lords in Stygian Veil (who are all stationary) in hard mode with a Flatbow. They pulled as normal.
 * I'll remove the note. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (gem / talk) 12:29, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Longbow? Heck, the other day I was pulling Avicara with a Channeling staff >.> They definitely didn't nerf pulling... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 12:32, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * On the other hand, I murdered Captain Besuz in Hard Mode from a range without him even noticing me. Not sure if it was a bug, or this note above. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    14:49, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * So you agree the bug does exist, because you saw what I did. So, this bug does exist, but either only sometimes triggers, or only triggers on certain stationary boss mobs.  The mob I killed without them moving was a mob that was with a boss, so maybe that is also a condition for the trigger?  Queen Schmuck 17:37, 22 April 2007 (CDT)

in areas where you can kill bosses but they are low level like those in istan in hard mode do their unique drops have better stats?
 * No. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]   15:48, 22 April 2007 (CDT)

60dp and out
not true. tried and tested not true  ~ Soqed Hozi ~  16:27, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * In Hard Mode? I believe so, just happened with an aggro-happy partner with afflicted Wyvern 16:36, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Possibly you had a Hench or Hero with less then 60 DP? It only happens when everybody has 60. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    16:37, 22 April 2007 (CDT)

no i definately had all party 60dp and ressed at shirne TWICE at all 60dp  ~ Soqed Hozi ~  17:12, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Well can you please provide a screenshot? Take 3 heros, have their interface (where you can activate/lock their skills) open, and show everyone with dead with 60% DP, thank you for your cooperation. Wyvern 17:19, 22 April 2007 (CDT)


 * I don't have a screenshot, but it happened to me too. Me and a guildie and 6 heros, all at 60 DP in Nightfallen Jahai, we rezzed at shrine. DKS01 17:21, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Just making sure, you are all playing in Hard Mode correct? If so you may have found a bug Wyvern 17:48, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yep, definitely hard mode. Added 2 points to my Treasure Hunter track by opening "locked chests" with lockpicks that dropped for me, found a paragon skill tome, was gettin 12 lightbringer points per kill, had the +50% XP hard mode icon(along with the note "there are no hard mode tasks to complete in this area"), etc. Admittedly, I've only tested that in Nightfallen Jahai which DOES NOT count for vanquiser, so that could be why it wasn't sending me back, it may only send you back in areas where you can vanquish. DKS01 18:13, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I can confirm that the game kicks you out at 60%DP... but not always, I swear everyone was at 60%DP once and it didn't kick me until the next wipe. Maybe, if you kill a creature between respawns you won't get kicked. Sirocco 19:46, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, it's pretty easy to work off a point of DP in hard mode, what with the high level mobs and 50% additional xp. &mdash;Aranth 19:54, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * And it's even easier to die once again when you have only half of the normal Health. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 20:26, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * How does dying easily with less than half health lead to working off a point of DP without realizing it, then ressing normally, then coming to the wiki and posting about it? &mdash;Aranth 21:14, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * There was no DP worked off in my case. I had 60 DP, my heros all had 60 DP, my teammate confirmed that her and her heros were all at 60 DP as well. We died at the next mob we encounted, didn't kill a one of them, and we rezzed at the shrine. DKS01 00:34, 23 April 2007 (CDT)

i havent got a screenshot, but I guess it may be rabndom, as sometimes I get the 2hours message w/o the please take a break, and sometimes w/ it. i'll try get a screenie  ~ Soqed Hozi ~  03:06, 23 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Farming with guildies, we hit 60 dp, and got zoned out, in hard mode. 208.49.147.194 08:28, 23 April 2007 (CDT)
 * "Farming with guildies" Thats it. As long as a human player is alive you wont rez at a shrine. My party (me, three heroes and four henchies) died a lot (I think that everybody had 60dp) at the huge group of Rampaging Ntouka in Sunward Marches, but everytime the rez countdown started before every hero/hench was dead. -Khan Reaper Kerensky 12:18, 26 April 2007 (CDT)


 * I can confirm. Solus  [[Image:DiscipleSymbol2.jpg|19px]] 02:49, 27 April 2007 (CDT)

gah, bug
New update put obs n the fritz again. Readem (talk *contribs ) 19:28, 26 April 2007 (CDT)

Uuuuhmmm... what? Blaze 02:48, 27 April 2007 (CDT)


 * The observer mode is not functioning perhaps.. &mdash; Corsaire  [[image:Corsaire_Signature.gif]] 03:28, 27 April 2007 (CDT)

Yes it is working Blaze 09:01, 27 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Can't even start the client; it say GuildWars is not installed or that there's not enough free space; i have 10 Go free on that partition. Not the first time i've got that. The first time was about a week or two ago and it got away by running -image again, but not this time. :-( Even deleting (renaming) the dat file did nothing. §: TůζipVõrζąx Talk 10:56, 27 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Lol! It works ok on the laptop... §: TůζipVõrζąx Talk 11:26, 27 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Try uninstalling it completely and reinstalling it maybe? Sorry to hear you're having problems.  :(  --Rainith 11:57, 27 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Done ^^. Still many "files" to download tough. Did not used my CDs this time... Some say to copy the dat file from one computer to the other but i wanted to do things in a "correct manner". By the way, it seems to work now. But i did not use -image for now. §: TůζipVõrζąx Talk 12:05, 27 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Running "gw.exe -image" with the run command or from the command prompt sometimes works to fix dat file problems. -- Gordon Ecker 19:29, 27 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Then it's not a dat problem. Because i was always doing -image before running de the game. And now that there is another update, i encounter the same problem. Should i reinstall the game with every update that comes ? What a burden... §: TůζipVõrζąx Talk 10:37, 28 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Annother update; same bug for me. (Why me?) I think i'll go ask on support (in french section ^^). I have a screenie of the message window i get but it's in french so i dont think it would be good to put it here. But you can see it there : .  See ya. §: TůζipVõrζąx Talk 17:30, 28 April 2007 (CDT)

Stealth Update?
I could have sworn GW had a new build just now, but it wasn't shown on the official site.
 * That's probably just a "hasn't yet". --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]   19:17, 28 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Gaile has said before that their web people don't work on weekends so the site doesn't always get updated when things happen on weekends. Always being the key word, as it does happen sometimes.  From what I've read (being stuck at work) there was another problem with people being disconnected from the game and losing all their work towards the luck title from the rings games.  The update was to fix that.  I had hoped after the same damn thing happened last time they wouldn't repeat it, but I guess that was just wishful thinking on my part.  I don't see why it is so hard to have the game initiate a save after x minutes without a save being made for another reason.  --Rainith 19:29, 28 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I'd think they could just program a "save if game crashes for any reason" thing. Not that i know what I'm talking about, but since it's an online game, I don't see how that would be very hard. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    19:35, 28 April 2007 (CDT)
 * There were two today. &mdash; <font color=#7E6B99>JediRogue  [[Image:JediRogueSig.jpg]] (talk |contribs)
 * I got disconnected and lost my title, went from whatever it was that I had (didnt check, was just amazed I had title) to 7k lucky -.- restarted gw cause of new build message, now I can't connect because of admin access or space errors, I'm an admin and have 10gb of space, ideas?
 * Hey ! That is just the same bug i had all day long. Read preceeding section. There's a link to a screenie. But now i'm back in game and though i have to go take a shower and maybe do some others things; i wont close the game.
 * How did i repaired GW ? We have more than one computer and i've let my friend comp update GW and then copied gw.dat and gw.exe to my computer where i've already completly uninstalled GW.  I made i shorcut to the GW.exe i transfered adding -repair in the command line and i've got the same bug.  I've reboot and then, no bug.
 * Hope this help. See ya. §: TůζipVõrζąx Talk 21:34, 28 April 2007 (CDT)
 * So that is why I lost all my tickets and didn't get any Lucky Points. WTF.  I leave it afk for several hours with like 1200 tickets on Nine Rings.  When I checked it later, I was at the login screen.  I logged in, but only had 5 tickets left and didn't seem to gain ANY lucky points.  I say again.. WTF.  Give me my points. — RabiesTurtle (contribs) 01:08, 29 April 2007 (CDT)
 * This is very serious. They should offer some sort of compensation for this. 68.9.197.232 11:10, 29 April 2007 (CDT)