Talk:Non-Elite Tome

They are profession-specific. I just got a ranger tome, and i have to have at least a ranger secondary to use it ~Avatarian 86 22:58, 19 April 2007 (CDT)

Drop Rate
Anyone know the drop rate?Skax459 17:10, 26 April 2007 (CDT)

Article naming
How do we name the Tome articles? I would suggest Skill Tome for non-elites, Tome as a redirect to Skill Tome, and leave Elite Tome as is. --Roland of Gilead (talk) 05:18, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I'll go for merging them all in one, like keys and chests pages. We don't have separate articles for High end and low end keys or chests, have we? They are basically the same, and both articles are not so big. It's like the treasure pages, they ended up in one single article. Mithran 16:37, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I set up the original Skill Tomes articles as the same thing for elite and non elite tomes. You can check who changed it but don't look at me. Urock 22:11, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Acquisition
In the update it is said:

"Non-elite Skill Tomes may be obtained from any normal creature in Hard mode."

They can be obtained not only in the chests.--Crigore 05:23, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Theoretically, with it being a "Common drop" in Hard Mode, it should be common enough to provide an alternative to 1k those who play Hard Mode. If its just as easy to get a gold drop, then they won't be very much used, but if they drop fairly frequently so that they sell for about 800 gold, then thats fine with me. Also, do one of the traders carry these? Can you sell/buy to/from Rare Scroll Traders or Rune Traders? They might even add in Tome Traders or Common and Rare Tome Traders... Would be interesting. Urock 02:05, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Adding a trader for these would spoil the whole thing imo. Alot of areas would stay unexplored by alot of ppl because of the convenience of getting the elite skill from anywhere. It´s a nice find and hopefully it will stay that way :) --Soulflame 04:56, 22 April 2007 (CDT)

Usefulness
Unless these end up in the lower than 1K value bracket, I really don't see the use. You might as well get the skill from a trainer (since it's already unlocked and therefore accessible easily). --Theeth (talk)   10:59, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I use them when they drop for me, saves 1k, but I'd never buy one. Lord of all tyria 11:00, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * If they don't a cost a skill point to use, they save the time to do a master's reward or the like. Might be handy on my less-played chars. 134.130.4.46 13:39, 20 April 2007 (CDT)


 * For a PvE char playing in PvP they might be useful, as if you're in a group and someone asks you to equip a skill the char doesn't have, you can just crack open one of these and learn it. Other than that I don't see these being much use than for someone severely short on Skill Points (such as if you're going for Skill Hunter). RossMM 08:57, 21 April 2007 (CDT)


 * You guys are totally missing the point. These tomes are only sort of useful for saving yourself 1k and a skill point if they drop or you buy for less.  They really shine, however, when you need skills before you would normally have access to them--not because of unlocking, but because of campaign.  Let's say I start a Rit, and want to play a growth bomber: normally, I would have to wait until I got to Kaineng center and did the quest to get to Kamadan in order to acquire Spirit's Gift (for example).  However, with a tome, I can learn the skill while still in Shing Jea.  THAT'S what they're really good for.Reason.decrystallized 20:23, 4 May 2007 (CDT)

Cover image
The image on the 'cover' of the tome, of course, is the Priest of Balthazar/Rune Trader icon for its respective profession. &mdash; kyrasantae   13:26, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Also, Elite and Non-Elite tomes have the same icons, as far as I can tell. &mdash; [[Image:Fin_sig.gif|User:Kyrasantae]] kyrasantae   15:13, 20 April 2007 (CDT) My bad, elite ones have gold trim.  &mdash; [[Image:Fin_sig.gif|User:Kyrasantae]] kyrasantae   04:32, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * The base color is the color of the boss aura. --[[Image:Warrior's_Endurance.jpg|18px]] numma_cway 19:30, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

Normal Mode Trading
Is it possible for someone from hard mode to trade a skill tome to someone from normal mode,or is it only for hard mode players?
 * Hard Mode doesn't get applied until you enter an explorable so why would it matter? --Kale Ironfist 10:12, 21 April 2007 (CDT)

Oh,sorry,I didn't know that because I'm not in hard mode yet.That would be a yes then.

Acquisition
On the artical it says: "Drops seems to be profession-bound"

I was farming hard mode and a necromancer mantid dropped a elementist tome, this needs to be looked into and see if this information is inaccurate.--Patch 15:56, 21 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I´ve been farming undead rangers alot and they seem to drop either a Ranger Tome or Warrior Tome, mostly Ranger Tome.
 * it's very possible that every monster in the game has both a primary and secondary profession, but most monsters simply don't use the secondary class. this would explain both, but is a bit hard to prove. perhaps farming one of the known multiclass monsters and looking for a third-profession-tome? --Honorable Sarah [[image:Honorable_Icon.gif]] 04:51, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I'm the one who added the note, because it was something that catched my eye. The observation isn't done on too many drops so it could be false, but I do think it is reasonable to be true. I've got 2 Mesmer tomes from iboga's and 2 ele tomes from Stormseeds (Plains of Jarin so basic class (normally low-level) creatures who probably lack a 2nd prof)--Wesley 09:54, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Perhaps they can drop tomes of any profession, however the odds of getting one tied to the profession of the mob killed is much greater than one for a random profession? RossMM 15:17, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * It was my understanding that this was the case for all mobs in the game. Anything you slay can drop any sort of equippable loot (monks dropping swords, for instance) but the chance of a critter dropping an item tied to its profession is significantly higher.  It would follow, then, that Tomes work the same way.  &mdash;DaveK  20:01, 13 June 2007 (GMT)
 * I am certain they drop based solely on profession. I've solo killed hundreds of stalking nephilias(rangers) and skeletal archers(rangers) and gotten only ranger tomes from them. I've killed numerous ibogas(mesmer) and bladed termites(warriors) and only gotten mesmer and war tomes from them respectively. I've soloed a couple hundred vermin(assassins) and only gotten assassin tomes. Etc. DKS01 17:36, 13 June 2007 (CDT)

Skill point
looks like Tome usage doesn't consume skill point

Drop Rate
So is drop level-based at all? Is it pretty much like Golden Eggs/ Clovers in terms of if all monsters drop it? How common are non-elite tomes?
 * I wouldnt think its level-based, as all enemies in hard mode are 22-30ish, which isn't that large of range compared to normal
 * I doubt it - I was solo farming in hard mode using an earth invincimentalist ouside of the sunspear great hall, basically just pulling the ranger, warrior, and paragons and got 5 ranger tomes, 3 warrior tomes, and 1 paragon tome, which is pretty much the distribution of what I was killing (and loads of loot, levels, and 5 lockpicks). I moved on to Sunspear and Lightbringer farming and with human parties of 6 to 8 we had similar if not fewer drops even though monsters were 6-8 levels higher.

Wrong pictures on page....
yeah, this is the non-elite page, and the pics provided are all elite tomes...even the description says they're elite tomes, lol ~Avatarian 86 00:29, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Someone just did a bad copy/paste job. I'll fix it. &mdash; [[Image:Fin_sig.gif|User:Kyrasantae]] kyrasantae   04:08, 22 April 2007 (CDT)
 * >_> I knew i had to but i forgot when i did it, heh. -- Xeon 04:40, 22 April 2007 (CDT)

Usage by any profession?
Normal skill tomes can be used by any profession, right? I.e. you are not restricted to using ones from your own profession? (Unlike elite ones, I heard - have not tested either). -Scyfer 21:49, 28 April 2007 (CDT)
 * See my reply on the Elite Tome page. &mdash; [[Image:Fin_sig.gif|User:Kyrasantae]] kyrasantae   22:21, 28 April 2007 (CDT)

Tome type tied to location or creature type?
I have been hydra farming outside of Augury Rock in Hard Mode and in my experience the only tomes that drop in Skyward Reach are Elementalist Tomes. I have collected 8 (always from Hydras) and no other kind of tome has dropped.

Does anyone else notice a trend in tome drops by location? Keep in mind that some zones may drop tomes from multiple professions (this could be explained by there being multiple types of creatures, if tome prove to be tied to creature type, or it could just be the "zone definition"... as in "these 3 tome times drop in this zone and this 1 type in another zone, etc).

Or there is another possibility... The type of tome is tied to the type of creature you kill. Maybe Hydras only drop elementalist tomes.

Whatever the coincidence is (by creature type or by location)I would like to know so that we as a community can document where tome drops for each profession occur. Then I can go farm my own Monk tomes instead of having lots of elementalist tomes! Jkyarr 16:16, 8 May 2007 (CDT)


 * Tomes only drop from their correspondingly professioned monster, ranger tomes from skele archers, elite mesmer tomes from mesmer bosses. &mdash; Skuld 16:19, 8 May 2007 (CDT)


 * Thanks Skuld.... now then... where do all the monster monks hang out together? Thats a little unbalanced when you think about a zone like skyward reach where 90% of the monsters are all elementalists... Monks get shafted
 * Smite Crawlers (Underworld), Succulent Junipers (Deldrimor Bowl) , Azure shadows (Talus Chute) , Blessed Griffons (Snake Dance) . Have fun. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]    17:10, 8 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, I guess Monk tomes will be worth about 10 gold pretty soon lol. Readem (talk *contribs ) 17:28, 8 May 2007 (CDT)
 * I bet I can give you the same list for any class you care to name. --[[image:rollerzerris.jpg|50x19px]]   17:41, 8 May 2007 (CDT)
 * I'll take that challenge, Ritualists. --The King Tarosian 06:48, 24 May 2007 (CDT)

Can all HM monsters drop these, or just ones at or above a certain level?
I've solo farmed a ton of the stalking nephilia's outside Sunspear Great Hall, gotten mostly junk, a couple of golds, a nice max purple Sun and Moon Shield, 2 lockpicks, but not 1 single skill tome. Likewise, while dead sword farming in HM, I've killed hundreds of slave spirits and not had them drop 1 tome either. The nephilias are lvl 22, the spirts are 20, which makes me wonder if monsters have to be higher than 22 to drop them, or if the spirits don't drop them because they're part of a quest and I'm just unluckly with the nephilias, or if both can drop them and I'm just really unluckly period. DKS01 08:14, 9 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, I eventually got them from nephilias, but none from spirits. DKS01 07:49, 24 May 2007 (CDT)

Redirects?
Maybe "monk tome, warrior tome, etc" should redirect to this? I don't know how to though. Eric368 00:07, 20 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Assuming you should, it would be new page called Monk Tome, the contents of which would be #REDIRECT Non-Elite Tome - but I don't know if you should :D -- Snograt   talk here   00:58, 20 May 2007 (CDT)
 * I think tomb and stuff should direct here because I spent forever looking typing tomb instead of tome lol. But I'm probably the only person that dumb though...&mdash; JediRogue  [[Image:JediRogueSig.jpg]] 13:34, 2 June 2007 (CDT)

In any case, Tomb should redirect to Tombs Of Primeval Kings. Misspelling Tome for Tomb seems like a rather silly mistake to make. And that's coming from a non-native speaker.

Tomes drop separately
I recently got a Necrid Robes and a Necromancer Tome to drop from the same Necrid Horseman. Is it possible for a monster to drop two things? I think this would be proof that tomes drop separately from normal drops or has everyone already known about this? Interesting, to say the least. --Vortexsam 22:04, 9 June 2007 (CDT)
 * yeah, Tomes seem to drop in the same fashion as special event items, I don't know what impact this really has though, besides that any run containing tomes may have slightly uneven distribution of loot between players -Ezekiel 07:17, 10 June 2007 (CDT)

Exactly what skills are available?
I am a Monk standing in Factions Harvest Temple where there is a skill trainer. I talk to the skill trainer and get 6 DF skills I can learn. I open a Monk tome and there are only 2, and 1 of them is a Nightfall skill. What good is a tome if it's not showing all available skills?
 * As stated in its description, a tome only allows you to learn skills you have already unlocked on your account. BigAstro 16:50, 10 June 2007 (CDT)

Bugged Drops
I was playing through Vizunah Square (Foreign) with a guildie yesterday and when we killed an Am Fah Assassin, he dropped 24 Assassin Tomes all reserved for her, in a stack. Has anyone else had this happen? It was really weird but very funny. I didn't get a screen shot, but I think she might have. I'll see if I can get it later - has this happened to anyone else? Kami No Kei! 14:18, 21 June 2007 (CDT)
 * Thats dam impressive :P Lord of all tyria 14:30, 21 June 2007 (CDT)
 * Ah, so maybe that's why Assassin Tomes are worth less than all the other types. -- Dashface [[Image:Dashface.png]] 22:10, 1 July 2007 (CDT)
 * Unless she dropped the tomes herself? Are you certain that it says "Am Fah Assassin dropped 24 Assassin Tomes" or did you just see "[Friend's Character Name] picks up 24 Assassin Tomes."?--MagickElf666 14:42, 24 July 2007 (CDT)
 * If it was customized to any character then it had to be a monster drop. Rcollins779x 23:49, 2 August 2007 (CDT)

Unlocked via PvP edition.
On my second account, i have prophecies only, then both nightfall and factions pvp editions. All skills are unlocked in those campaigns. My question is, if i try to use a warrior tome on a pve warrior, will it give me the prophecies only skills? or will it let me learn factions/nightfall skills too? If i had a guild member on atm, I would test this out. --Idiot 22:25, 11 July 2007 (CDT)
 * As I understand it, if you created a PvE Warrior on that second account and used a warior tome as you describe, you'd be able to select from all the non-elite warrior skills from Factions and Nightfall plus any you've previously unlocked from Prophecies. However, not tested, so can't give you 100% answer. --Wolfie [[Image:Wolfie_sig.jpg|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:39, 11 July 2007 (CDT)
 * Very interesting question. I'd guess you can't, as it is being unlocked for PvP, but I'd be happy to hear otherwise. Foo 05:02, 12 July 2007 (CDT)


 * Maybe not that interesting, it's well documented that skills unlocked "for PvP" can be gotten for PvE chars with tomes. The only mildly interesting part about that is the fact that he doesn't have Factions or Nightfall. And thus, if he learns a F/NF skill with a tome on a PvE Prophs char, the skill is "learned" for that character, but it remains locked and unusable until you add a F/NF key to the account. Once you do that, your character can then use the skill. DKS01 07:13, 12 July 2007 (CDT)
 * Makes sense, like when an accounts has a free 10-hours trial. toons can get skills, but after the 10 hours, cant use those. Foo 09:30, 12 July 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, I'd go along with that. So while *could* select a non-elite Warrior skill from Factions or Nightfall, be little point doing so, as would be unusable. --Wolfie [[Image:Wolfie_sig.jpg|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:45, 12 July 2007 (CDT)
 * The skills would be locked. Readem (talk *contribs ) 22:57, 12 July 2007 (CDT)

Question
Can I use a tome to get a signet of capture?--Yorn 16:43, 1 October 2007 (UTC)


 * nope --[[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG]] -- (s)talkpage 17:21, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * thought so. thanks--Yorn 18:14, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Another question:

Has anyone noticed that when you use an assassin tome while you do not have assassin as one of your professions, it displays the message "You cannot use the Assassin Tome because you are not a assassin" where correct English would dictate that this should read "because you are not an assassin"? Is this counted as a bug, or nothing really? Also I haven't tested this out with Elementalist tomes yet because I don't have any :D
 * It would be safe to assume it uses a template msg, and just throws the tome's profession in. --130.108.7.68 14:31, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

???
<--- Where the hell did that came from???
 * Was that the icon they used when originally announcing tomes? -Ezekiel 14:21, 25 October 2007 (UTC)