User talk:Warrior Nation/Dual Monk UW team

Revote?
Check the dates on the favoured votes, this is old and should be revoted upon.--Raps4life 23:11, 17 January 2007 (CST)
 * Probably... though I'm not sure the build changes count as "substantive". If you think so, and no one complains, just move it to untested, archive the old rate-a-build, and put a new one in. Give it a few days to guage interest. -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 15:40, 18 January 2007 (CST)

Rate-a-build
Please test and vote on new builds

Tested:
 * 1) Awsome build, works perfectly! I would however replace the rebirth with blessed signet since if the bonder dies then its all lost. --Apathy 16:53, 25 September 2006 (CDT)
 * 2) I agree, it seems to be very well thought out and considered all the bases. Just remember to let the non-tank stay back. :)
 * 3) I changed the build because what i changed is much better... But later i found out i may not change anything without permission! Oops! Sorry guys, but this works better... And btw... To the owner of this work, well done i tried urs to and it worked well... But this one works a bit better. Keep the work going and sorry for changes..! --Pino 17:44, 27 September 2006 (CDT)
 * Nice changes, but you forgot to change the divine favor to protection prayers. I changed it though. --Apathy 15:16, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

Unfavoured:
 * 1) (your vote here)

Discussion
this build kick and fast killing i like it more than the 55 mon whit ss

Bonding Monk
I think Signet of Judgement isn't bringing alot to the party and, if I understand how to use this build, Mantra of inscriptions is mainly there to cut the recharge. Blessed Signet is there to give you energy (when the tank isn't in combat) primarily so you can cast mantra of incriptions but also help with energy for re-bonding if they get striped.

Are there a better 3 skills that could go here? I've a couple of half formed thoughts. I'll see if I can make a serviceable build with any of them this evening. (EoE or maybe Symbiosis, or maybe even both ;o)). -JP 02:32, 12 September 2006 (CDT)


 * It is posible that there are 2 better skils. I say 2 others cause blessed sig will be needed for energy as most skills require energy. Signents do not but there are not many that help with it. Symbiosis would be a bad idea though. It would throw the health way over what spirit bond could handle. With all the enchantments up you can have 10 enchantments(this includes spellbreaker) you would boost your health by 270 - 1250. if you take a supirior rune of protection you lose 75 hp which will help and spirit bond will heal for 104 being able to maintain roughly 1000 hp. Retribution only can deal damage back up to 21 so 63 damage brings that to its maximum efficentcy. Holy wrath can deal up to 53 which sets the required damge for maximum efficentcy to 81. This means having over 810 health does not help. With a major vigor and a 30 health offhand with a 20% enchant sword and vital blessing on this build sets your health at 740 so a health bost is not realy needed. EoE could be a good boost to damage though. I may have to try that tonight. Winnowing could help also with the grasping darkness to hit a little harder. AngelOfChaos 12:39, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
 * My main thought with Symbiosis was it may remove the need for Vital Blessing. Thus giving us a slot to play with on the Tank. Maybe for echoing the Spell Breaker.  I haven't really done much in the UW so I'm not sure how much use the ability to use SB again would be vs "them nightmare thingys".--JP 14:28, 12 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Actualy after i posted my last post i was thinking about maby droping vital blessing and taking life attunement and grabing supiorior protection and favor. And setting the bonders beast master to a level that puts the health to a maintainable level above the 810 health. This would maximize the damage delt back and give more of a cushion against inturupts. With vital blessing the tank could maintain over 1500 hp without a problem. I will look further into it and figure out how to work it in.AngelOfChaos 21:20, 12 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Vital Blessing and Life Attunement and go 16 Prot, 16 Smite. go for the kill, don't be timid. Mantra of Inscriptions and Inspiration are a waste of skill bar space. --Karlos 17:04, 25 September 2006 (CDT)

Shield of Judgement
On a seperate note it mentions Shield of Judgement as a varient. I think that would not provide much use as it reduces the amount of damage taken due to Retribution and Holy Wrath becuase of it's knockdown effect. --JP 14:28, 12 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Yes I do not rember why I said that now. Without any smiting prayers it would decrease the damage output and have not benifit. With higher smiting the knockdown helps a little. They will be kocked down after every attack so they will have less chance at inturupting the spells. AngelOfChaos 21:28, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

Needs to be reworked...
The support monk should go 16 Smite, 16 Prot, and throw Vital blessing and Life Attunement on the tank. He can use superior runes, the tank can't, so it's best if he uses Vital and Life Attunement instead of having the tank use them and then giving him Succor (lame). I also think Elemental Resistance is not needed as the damage dealt by most foes will far surpass the limit of Retribution and Holy Wrath and the ones that don't do enough damage (Coldfires) do Elemental damage.

Also, the tank can put some points into Illusion and grab SV so he can take the smites to the Coldfires and rain their energy, forcing them to attack. --Karlos 17:09, 25 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Elemental Resistance is there to ensure all hits are above 60 damage and activate Spirit Bond. Graspings don't always do enough damage to activate Spirit Bond and will kill you. (Ocelot never 00:32, 8 October 2006 (CDT))

Ok i have reworked it with lots of time spent in uw. Here is what i have came up with.

Tanking monk: Spirit Bond, Protective Spirit, Spell Breaker, Elemental resist, Blessed sig, Blessed aura, Essence bond, Balthspirit

Bonding Monk: Shield of judgement, Smite Hex, Blessed sig, Vital Blessing, Life Attunement, Retribution, Holywrath

When fighting the casters drop holywrath and switch 2 a energy boosting weapon and aply shield of judgement on tank when he has pulled everything together. The tank should also put spell breaker up to force them to attack. Tell me what you guys think about this new set up. if someone wants 2 modify it to show skill bar im ok with it just too tyrd right now to mess with it. AngelOfChaos 01:38, 20 October 2006 (CDT)

Merge
This should be merged with. I made this article a while back but I guess no one noticed it because its not in the untested builds category. (T/C) 12:03, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
 * They are almost the same, but I think I like this build more because its more simple. --Apathy 08:11, 30 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Also, I think this build is actually faster because the knock down from SoJ really slows down the killing process. --Apathy 01:22, 6 October 2006 (CDT)
 * Hey, that sounds like someone who didn't actually read the article. "use Shield of Judgment whenever going up against Coldfire Nights." This build may be 'more complex', but it does its job at the same speed and doesn't require the team to avoid certain enemies. [[Image:Chuiu Me Icon.png|Chuiu]] (T/C) 01:30, 6 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Yeah just realised that sry, last time I went with someone who used this build he kept using SoJ everywhere. --Apathy 01:45, 6 October 2006 (CDT)

Well when they say merge I think they simply want this to be put under the other as a variation. or vice verse. So there's rly nothing lost in merging. Hell lightning hammer and crazed carpenter got merged and ones pvp, the other pve! (Not a fifty five 23:57, 14 October 2006 (CDT))

Yes, merge this, it's pretty much the same thing. --Swift Thief 07:38, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

Abandoned or Favored?
I was about to delete this build as abandoned; but when I saw the talk page, I noticed that it has three favored votes. I don't want to get caught in the deletion controversies so I won't delete it yet. Others will need to review it. For now, I'm removing the delete and abaondoned tags. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 11:33, 29 December 2006 (CST)
 * I think you should put them back on, or maybe do a revote? Check the dates on the favored votes, that was back before the nf update.--Raps4life 21:21, 11 January 2007 (CST)

Nerf?
Wasn't SB nerfed during a previous update? If so, then this build should be archived, or deleted. Blaster 14:23, 29 December 2006 (CST)
 * Oh, yes, Spirit bond was nerfed, but it still works, it just requires more careful timing, my guildie and I sometimes do it for laughs. Dr Titan 04:42, 30 December 2006 (CST)
 * solo spirit bonding was nerfed. also giant mobs. places like the uw where someone else can deal the damage still work fine.--Coloneh RIP[[Image:Coloneh.png]] 21:05, 2 January 2007 (CST)
 * You can still use it in large mobs as well. My friend and I use SoA to negate damage and Spirit Bond to heal the health lost while SoA is lowering the damage. It works as effectively as the former build, you just need a third skill now. The tank build we use is the same with Frenzy instead of Elemental Resistance and SoA over Blessed Signet. (slightly slows run but not by much if you time your skills so energy is charged at end of battle) The Smiter is Mo/N with Spiteful Spirit, Defile Enchantments, and Desecrate Enchantments. (This allows us to kill Coldfires and Terrorwebs more easily and also allows us to kill the IW Mesmers more quickly.
 * why not just use SOA on large mobs?--Coloneh RIP[[Image:Coloneh.png]] 01:21, 6 January 2007 (CST)
 * Because if Spirit Bond gets interupted it's nice to have them hitting zeroes and it's not like your low on energy, right?

Removing Merge Notice
Why? Because the other one was nerfed and this one wasn't as heavily impacted. --Mgrinshpon 22:14, 7 January 2007 (CST)

Merge (again)
and Build:Team_-_Dual_Monk_UW_team need to be merged. They are conceptually the same, they have the same goals, they use the same classes. Differences between the builds can be easily listed as variants. -- Oblio (talk) 10:19, 25 January 2007 (CST)
 * Yes, the former uses SoA and is better/more easy to survive. --Apathy 11:46, 29 January 2007 (CST)