User talk:Entropy/Archive 25

first
suckers. (T/C) 11:57, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * second. Cress Arvein [[Image:Cress sig.JPG]] 15:38, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You archived while I was sleeping, so I reject your position as the first poster. And you cheated anyway :o --Shadowcrest  15:41, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * One less than fiveth. [[Image:Rsz_PLSig.jpg‎]] 16:07, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 五. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 16:18, 13 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Two more than one less than fifth. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  16:19, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

I'm here
You can all put your pants back on now.--ìğá†ħŕášħ 16:49, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I hope your American, because otherwise i'd like to know what sly trick you used to get my underwear off Random Time  16:52, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I refuse to reapply my lower torso covering for the occasion of your return. [[Image:Rsz_PLSig.jpg‎]] 17:21, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Infact, so do I Random Time  19:03, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Fear my power. Born of Mexican and German ancestry, I have the power to remove anyones article of clothing by simply changing the past so that YOU NEVER PUT THEM ON IN THE FIRST PLACE.  BWAHAHAHA!--[[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg]]ìğá†ħŕášħ  07:43, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Warning, you have created a [[Image:Deadly Paradox.jpg]], mission failed! [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 07:53, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * BUGGER! Not again D<  That's the fourth freakin' time I've done that this week!--[[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg]]ìğá†ħŕášħ  08:07, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Scotch
Is the stickiest kind of drink, no? &mdash; Powersurge360  06:43, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Indeed. Good job. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 06:46, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd been guessing it was some cocktail with fruit/olive on a stick, but I couldn't recall any names. --◄mendel► 07:40, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It's called dumb puns for a reason. If you wanted to get all Medieval on it, a stickiness index could be a good alternative answer. But yeah, Scotch(TM) brand tape from 3M(R) and Scotch the alcoholic beverage. The sheer stupidity of it makes it a hard riddle. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 07:53, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * ... what are you suggesting? &mdash; Powersurge360  07:54, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Bananas, melonas, the summer of forbidden fruit. What are you suggesting? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 07:56, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Certainly not that coconuts migrate, if that's what you're getting at. &mdash; Powersurge360  07:57, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * With age they do - the heavier the coconut, the harder it falls. Also, if you have no horses, you can clap two halves of a coconut together to... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 07:58, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

BTW
Do you take suggestions on what different ones you do? Because if you ever run out of one, I have three really insanely hard ones.--ìğá†ħŕášħ 08:09, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * But then they wouldn't be mine. I have more but they aren't clearly visualized right now so I will add them later. Mostly I just want someone, anyone to solve the impossible one. :) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 08:11, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It seems to me that the one left won't be solved as much as it will be guessed by random-assed luck. &mdash; Powersurge360  08:12, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Hey, if I had to solve it that way, so do you'all. It was hard for me too. A good deal of perception and awareness was necessary before the game would reveal its secrets... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 08:14, 14 August 2008 (UTC)


 * @impossible: You mean, that's not a Haiku? "Wild Geese Fly Back / O, how I envy those wild geese / Flying back to summer less lands / ... "? --◄mendel► 08:15, 14 August 2008 (UTC)


 * No. It's a Poem and also a Song depending on how it is used. Very old (I think). Obscure. Try again? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 08:18, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Ok, I take a shot, I recall a phrase in Sound of Music (ok, not that obscure) "Wild Goose that Fly with the moon on their wings. These are my favorite things.". In some cases, like the version of "Beautiful Glassbottom Boat", they remove the word 'that' out of the line. Not sure if it was based on a poem in the beginning, though..-- [[Image:merty_sign.gif]]-- ( talk ) 09:14, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Felix has guesses that one long ago (should be in the archive?) --◄mendel► 09:30, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * bored enough to try this hmm, Wild geese fly.. Wild geese fly southward without faltering, and so on and so on.. cba to write the rest Kurtan  18:05, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Incorrect [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:14, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Wild geese fly overhead/In the wild Autumn weather./Souls of the newly-dead/Crying and flying together.Lurkerabove 20:24, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Incorrect. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:38, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Chinese Poetry
No 7. The Scattered Folk Collected Into Villages?--ìğá†ħŕášħ 08:42, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

It could also be:
 * Wild geese fly...
 * And on a warm spring day I could look up in the air

If it's from a song. *Defiant Elements*  +talk  18:28, 14 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Getting warmer (more obscure), but incorrect. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:14, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Forsaking the mists/That rise in the spring,/Wild geese fly off./They have learned to live/In a land without Flowers.Lurkerabove 12:25, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Incorrect [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:00, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Maybe this part is the following ?
 * Wild geese fly overhead
 * In the wild Autumn weather.
 * Souls of the newly-dead
 * Crying and flying together. × GW-Topinambour 14:10, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry, incorrect, that's the third such guess. :\ [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:11, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Well anyway, don't have the patience to test any of google resuls with such vague indication :D × GW-Topinambour 14:23, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Wild geese fly over head.
 * They wrench my heart.
 * They were our friends in the old days.
 * That? [[Image:Bunneh.jpg]] ~Bunny  03:27, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It isn't some weird translation of Qiu Hong, or one of those other Autumn Wind poems (don't remember all of their names, but u cant tell me if im really off) or is it

"Far from here the wild geese fly past hate and love and caring In countless graves they nameless lie the long lost sons of Erin The passing years shall not condemn those who those lie beneath the poppy When from the same green slender stem there grew an Easter Lily" Bastthegatekeeper 03:49, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Curses! what an bad time for me to look at entropy's page and realize i recognize one of the things... /sigh Bastthegatekeeper 15:37, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

Congratulations Bunny! You finally got it. Good job. (T/C) 16:39, 24 August 2008 (UTC)
 * What do I win? [[Image:Bunneh.jpg]] ~Bunny  20:16, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * You've recieved well over 10 pieces of text, deviating from hilarious to weird to intriguing. Check her userpage and ctrl+f Bunny ;) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  20:21, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

Mario Tennis Music
Failed to find the specific mp3, but found the music files as a whole if that counts. 19:19, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Now I need to find a way to convert those to a more universal format... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:30, 14 August 2008 (UTC)


 * 1. Or just: Use WimAmp. It can convert GBS files to WAV. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  20:36, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * WAV is a hugely inefficient format which takes up gobs and gobs of space. But I can convert WAV to MP3. I wonder if that much conversion will break something. Thanks in any case. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:39, 14 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I would've screwed something up trying to convert them. Glad I didn't try. [[Image:Rsz_PLSig.jpg‎]] 00:38, 15 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't think you can lose any quality when you convert from a lossy format to WAV, since uncompressed formats are lossless by default, but you will of course lose a little bit when you compress the WAV to MP3. However, I don't know anything about GBS format - it may be an uncompressed format to begin with, in which case the conversion to WAV should be completely lossless.  And you can always use a lossless compression like FLAC so that you don't lose anything in the (re)compression, either.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 01:01, 15 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Random note - Vista / Windows Media Player 11 is a bitch to navigate. All I want to do is add .FLAC to the list of extentions WMP can play, but is it easy to do? Nooo.... even though I have the codecs and I can open them manually, it's so annoying. And WMP hates .FLAC anyw ay, causes major errors whenever you try to skip ahead in a track (as if you were on YouTube and video didn't completely load yet). Sux. I just want to listen to Prophecies music, but this makes it so complicated. >.> WinAmp is cool but it's not free if you want conversion utilities...and imho, everything is too small/hard to work with. I had Meridian for .GBS files, but apparently the authors lost the source code so it's broken now. Bah.
 * So - anyone have a free converter for .GBS to .WAV/.MP3? Anyone know how to open that magic window where you can associate extentions with WMP?...I tried to do a reinstall, because that's where you first see it, but apparently it cannot be uninstalled now. :\ [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:47, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Videolan VLC Media player ftw? --◄mendel► 10:09, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

Hi
The theme of your jokes 'n' quotes seems to be god and cigarettes. What are those for anyway?-- (Talk) (Contr.) 02:11, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You fail(ed) at making new headers at the bottom of the page.
 * I have stuff on a wide variety of topics; if those two seem to be more prominent, then meh. Some of the bit more risque, unfunny, or blatantly offensive I leave out. Anyway, every time someone solves a riddle, I post them something as a kind of reward, because I am too poor to give anything in-game. (except junk. and in any case that's too clumsy system) Should I do something else? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:18, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You should stand on your ears!&mdash; Powersurge360  02:19, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Do I look elfin to you? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:23, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You should chew through metal and play "Twinkle Twinkle Little Stars" using only a nunchuck and a dish of butter, then post a video of it.--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 02:25, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) How should I know if you are elven or not. Someone won't supply the pictures! &mdash; Powersurge360  02:26, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Pics or it didn't happen? O'rly. How many naturally blonde Asians do you know? ...I thought so. Here is an idea, how about every person still active on GuildWiki post their pics, and then I'll post mine. Or not. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:30, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

prO Player:
Is not hard. You should probably exclude that as an option. Entrea   [Talk]  02:36, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, and ` is the odd one out, you don't need to press the shift key to type it.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:37, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Curse you, I figured both those out, but you posted first because I was busy updating armor galleries. >.> &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 04:05, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I know about Flux Matrix, but that is not a fair way to solve it so I won't count it. :\ Gj on the `, though. (That's what you get for all work and no play, Doc! :p) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:27, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Well, that was a languagist riddle. For me:
 * shifted: & ! ) ' ` _ ( * ? : & " > % $
 * Alt-ed: ~ @ { | }
 * unshifted: # + ´ * < ^
 * + is unshifted for you, too, if you use the one on the numeric keypad.
 * --◄mendel► 10:17, 1 September 2008 (UTC)


 * No numpad on laptop without using the retarded function key. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:33, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Spot the Reference
The Answer (42 obvious HGttG reference) + 4,123,891,318th digit of Pi - grand total of Water and Ghost-type Pokemon over all series (54, unless you're including half water/ghost pokemon) * total health of the Pokey Statue(99,999,999) + Numeric name of a legendary Final Fantasy weapon(2, from Excalibur 2 or Javelin "II" or Tiptaptwo? 7, from Seventh Heaven?  100, from Masamune 100?  Probably none of them...). Raised to the power of the number of candles in the Shadow Queen's lair(6). Divided by the AP cost of Luminaire + Bahamut summon in FFIV (What about it?).

((((((42+PiDigit-54)*99,999,999)+FFWep#)^6)/LuminareAP)+BahamutSummon)

How wrong am I? Too tired to finish, I'll try and finish it tomorrow, unless someone does it for me. --Totally Imbalanced 05:16, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Correct, no answer, I'll take any Water/Ghost even if it's not pure type, correct (although depends on version, I heard), incorrect weapon but you get the idea, wrong Shadow Queen (iirc), Luminaire is not from Final Fantasy, sum its AP cost with the MP cost of Rydia's Bahamut summon in FFIV.
 * A nice start though. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:27, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * ((((((42+PiDigit-110)*99,999,999)+FFWep#)^6)/LuminareAP)+60) ... I'm trying to find a way to figure out the Pi one, short of downloading all the digits between 4billion and 5billion and sorting through it ... All I can find on Luminare is it's MP, and I still don't know the FF weapon ... Oh well, I have all day


 * OK, MP cost, I forget sometimes since many different measurements exist. AP, MP, SP, and more weird ones... The FF weapon is obscure because it's from older game. Also I am pretty sure there are more than six candles, otherwise the synchronized "lights out" wouldn't look impressive at all. (like the scene in Kung Fu Panda, if you saw that movie). [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 13:08, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * By the way, Luminaire is in Chrono Cross too. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 14:32, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Such a cool-sounding/looking move, but I tend to use Confuse instead... Does it have a different AP cost in CC as opposed to CT? I've never got my hands on CC yet. For the purposes of this riddle I want the cost in Chrono Trigger. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 17:23, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The entire skill system in CC is radically different; I don't recall if they even used AP at all. It was a good game as RPGs go, and quite attractive graphically too. Unfortunately, I bought my copy used, and the first disc had a scratch that froze the half-game cinematic. I was SO close to disc 2, but I never got there. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 17:25, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Hmm, so maybe I should get PS emulator eventually, as much as I hate them. I feel for you...it's not cool being Error 007'd while fighting Disc of Chaos after slogging through at 60% DP for 2hr. (at Norn: "If you trade hits, you will die." <- sage advice) I've also done some long dungeons in other RPG just to have the game crash because I accidentally touched the Gameboy...or such. :\ I wish all games had "save state" capability like you can do on some emulator, it makes disaster recovery so much easier. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 17:30, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * ((((((42+PiDigit-110)*99,999,999)+FFWep#)^45)/(20+60) ... Is it 45? The scene I was talking about before was when you were actually fighting her in Paper Mario Two.  Still can't find the FF weapon (is it in another language?), and I'm about to resort to downloading the 4,100,000,000th through 4,200,000,000th digits of pi, and just sorting through them.--Totally Imbalanced 20:10, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Well, before the fight begins, during the cutscene there should be a whole lot more. Right?...The FF weapon is from an older Final Fantasy but it is in English, though the game is obscure. There are...easier ways to get Pi digits. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:14, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

((((((42+7-110)*99,999,999)+7)^Candles)/(20+60) ...Finally found the FF weapon. only missed it before because I was looking at normal FF games, and totally skiped over FF Legend II. Ended up downloading 100mil digits of pi and found 7. Having a hard time with the candles ... My only access to the queen's room is through Youtube videos, and it's hard to get a good count due to fast camera movement and crappy framerate ... Total equation (before Candle input, but whatever); (-6099999932^candles)/80 Someone finish it ... In doing this, I've had to download and sort through 100mil digits of pi, sort through 21 Final Fantasy full item lists, gotten an oddly bad (bad meaning crappy) virus that somehow got through my defenses, and download a new malware program to remove said virus. --Totally Imbalanced 23:34, 27 August 2008 (UTC)


 * ...Wow! :O For going above and beyond to attempt this mission, I'll give you complementary credits for completion when it is done even if your answer is not correct (have to check it myself). I'm sorry about your computer... >.- To be honest, I am surprised why anyone would bother with such an effort for a little thing like this. I mean, it is rewarding in and of itself (you know more about some of my favorite games, now!), but still...there is no material reward. I guess you people must simply enjoy the challenge. I know that throwing down a challenge can be an effective motivation, but I didn't think it applied here. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 09:32, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

"(unless caps lock is on)."
Caps doesn't matter for sich thing. Only works with letters ;) Also, I should convince Prog to scrim often again.. 1337 damage shouldn't be too hard? :D --- -- (s)talkpage  07:20, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Hmm, I remember a "master caps lock" or such which would lock the entire keyboard to caps. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 12:53, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Sticky Keys? --Totally Imbalanced 21:38, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Qwyzzle
Entropy, you should become the next author of Qwyzzle, if you've played it, you know what I mean. Here's the link http://home.planet.nl/~Qwyzzle, but the site is down at the moment. Some people are trying to get it back up and running. Himm Taeguk  (T/C) 09:20, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * No, I don't have enough dedicated time for such a more serious program, nor do I have the riddles (I'm running short, flying on whim now). But that's an honor to be recommended for the position. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 12:53, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Out of curiosity
Which college do you go to? Because you said it's in New York, and it would be kind of cool if we were going to the same college.  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 15:22, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Only a one letter difference, I'm afraid. :p Sorry. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 17:23, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
 * That'd make me lol. --Shadowcrest 21:01, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

LoZ
Which are in your opinion the top 4 games (this is actually very tough for me). --Shadowcrest 21:01, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Twilight Princess, Ocarina of Time, Link's Awakening, Oracle of Seasons were my four most favorites, in no particular order. I'd have to say that overall, I would rank Twilight Princess and Ocarina of Time as the top two, but can't decide which. Why is that? Well...it's just way, way different playing on console than on little piddly handheld. The experience is so much more immersive.

Oracle of Ages is a good enough game, but the sheer increase in difficulty compared to Oracle of Seasons is really off-putting, since it isn't appreciably more entertaining as a result.

Wind Waker is...different...from other Zelda games. It's a great game, don't get me wrong. But I don't think it is really a fair comparison to any of the others. It definitely earns mad points for hilarity, but that's not all a Zelda game should have.

A Link to the Past is a classic, but at the same time that hinders how I can rate it. It is one of the best Zelda games in terms of completeness and execution, but I've never particularly cared for it as a "fun to play" game.

Minish Cap was a great comeback and a very good game. But it didn't have that same sort of retro, rock'n'roll, good time fun feel that I get from some of the older Zelda handhelds. Kinstone Fusions was BS too.

The original Zelda is a classic in terms of laying groundwork for future games, but unless you are really into retro gaming it can't possibly be considered a great game by today's standards of graphics, music, controls, etc. It's just too old.

Link's Adventure was major lulz ("Link // The time has come // To save -- the Princess Zelda! // ...and now the children don't play..." oh god, that song was so epic, they should have put it in Brawl). Link's Crossbow Training hardly counts as a complete game. Four Swords is a remake of A Link to the Past.

...I could explain more if you wanted. (T/C) 01:24, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Link Awakening, Link's Awakening, Link's Awakening! (DX) [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 01:36, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, DX indeed. Color Dungeon was fun. And it remixed the original dungeon music! ("Theme of Love" I think it was called?) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:37, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Marin was my first video game love. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 01:48, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Some of the photos are epic lulz too. Link running away from BowWow...the one where Marin lands on you after you fall down the well. Too bad there isn't one for Marin grabbing the Trendy Game Guy. :) Good times...I'm also very fond of Red Clothes + Piece of Power = crazy fast kills on some bosses :) It really was a great game wasn't it. I especially remember using "Magic Powder" to set dogs and chickens on fire. :> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:13, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Remember the screen filled with tall grass right below the shop that you could farm mindlessly for hours? I always did that and bought the Shovel and Bow & Arrows before the first dungeon. Also, monkey glitching. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 02:28, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I have missed out on so much by not playing zelda handheld games. I want to cry now. Or go out and but all of them. Either way.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:34, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * There's no reason to but them all now, just download the ROMs. GB and GBC games should be easy to find. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 02:35, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The problem being that I generally dislike pirating stuff. Old-fashioned of me, I know, but still.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:43, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Well in that case, eBay. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 02:46, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I bought mine from eBay. It was uber cheap, so now they must be like $1.00 . My personal favorite bugs were Flying Rooster + Boomerang and...stealing from the shop. "I wasn't kidding when I said to pay! And now you'll pay the ultimate price!" *BZZZZT* "That's a naughty boy, THIEF! Who taught you to look in other people's drawers?" ... one time I started a game using a different name, so in the opening scene it went thus: Tarin: Ho there, Tarin! You're up! How did I know your name? Well...I saw it on the back of this here shield!" ...even though it's not really that funny, I was laughing for hours. And yes, I spent some of my finest Zelda hours farming the bushes. Grass cutting in Link's Awakening puts grass cutting in any other game to shame. :> Except for maybe at the Fish Pond in Twilight Princess, when you run out of Rupees from playing the stupid marble game. :| [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:04, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I ask because it was interesting that at Zeldapedia most of the people said Majora's Mask was their favorite, and- since I knew you had played most (if not all) of them- I asked you, and I find even more interesting that you didn't even mention it. I thought people wouldn't think it was a top game just because of how unrelated it is to the rest of the games... at least all the other N64/GC games had a connected storyline. It was fun, yeah, but I didn't think it would be rated top. I never played the Oracle games... my friend Kyle had one of them (I forget which, though I think Seasons) long ago, but I was never interested enough to get it myself. All I really saw was Subrosia, and for some reason I really didn't feel like getting it after seeing it.
 * I don't know which I have in the top four- all I can definitively place are Ocarina of Time and Twilight Princess. The other 3 I have in consideration are Link to the Past, Majora's Mask, and Wind Waker. I loved playing all of them. The original LoZ was bleh (so I herd Dodongo dislikes smoke, hbu?), and Phantom Hourglass was fun, but it wasn't great (I hated Tetra anyway). I have Link's Awakening (in the Eagle Tower I think it's called), but I haven't touched it in ages. I have Four Swords, but I didn't finish it (and then lost my large GC memory card, so now I can't anyway), but I relatively enjoyed what I did play. I need Minish Cap still, and I agree that Link's Crossbow Training doesn't count. --Shadowcrest 00:03, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I HATED Majora's Mask! Hated it so much. Having to reset everything every few hours was the most miserable experience of my life. Such a bad game. I never even finished it, I just watched my little brother finish it. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 00:04, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * See Felix's comment. The game itself isn't inherently bad, but it's just too...un-Zelda. There are fun quirks, of course - no other Zelda game lets you transform into a Deku scrub, Goron, Zora, or the ubercool Fierce Deity Link. Still, those are rather petty consolations for a game that has...


 * Lame-ass music compared to nearly any other Zelda.
 * Incomprehensible storyline and almost no relation to other Zelda games.
 * No Ocarina :\ (iirc)
 * Lack of FUN.
 * Disappointing resolution at the end. Who the hell cares about lonely Skull Kid?
 * Appearance of Tingle. (iirc)
 * Bleh. Anyway - Subrosia is only in Seasons. It's a fun place. I think one thing which really misses for Majora's Mask is that it doesn't feel epic like other Zelda do at times. It feels like "some damn fool crusade", as Obi-Wan would say, for no real purpose. I just have this distinct lack of motivation to ever continue in Majora's Mask. I will concede, though, that the final boss fight is quite a bit more challenging than some others in the series. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:31, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Ages was the harder one, right? MM has an ocarina; it even changes into pipes, drums, and a guitar. And it had the ballad of the wind fish- I can't tell you how many times I've sang that song in my head. But the Elegy of Emptyness was the most ugly, annoying song... and we had to play it a billion times in that idiotic dungeon. Why isn't it fun? Other than resetting every three days, I liked it a lot. Tingle is lulz (except for when he's a cheap bastard in WW). Tingle Tingle kooloo limPAH! imo. Ganon is always noob, and when I played MM 10 million years ago I *had* to use the FD mask to beat Majora. Also, you forgot that game's severe lack of Zelda. She only appears in a stupid cutscene reteaching forgetful Link the Song of Time. At least nowadays she shoots arrows or uses magic or something. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  22:26, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, a Zelda game without Zelda! How awesome is that? MM is horrible, or maybe I just suck because I can't get past the 3rd dungeon in that game -_-. I happened to enjoy Ages more than Seasons though. Cress Arvein [[Image:Cress sig.JPG]] 22:48, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I liked Ages more too, although that may just be because it was the one I played first. <3 Nayru, <3 Din. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 01:19, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
 * No Magic Boomerang. No Roc's Cape. No Magnet Gloves. Hyper Slingshot >>>> Seed Shooter. "Time Warp" theme isn't as effectively or creatively done as I believe the seasons theme was. I will grant that Veran is a much more fun boss fight since you can actually lose...well, actually, in general the Ages bosses are more challenging and hence more fun. But I still think overall the game isn't as good. Certainly there are more things I would consider "annoying yet necessary" compared to Seasons. I'll also have you know that most of the real Zelda fanbase is deadly allergic to Tingle and it is a good example of Nintendo introducing more gayness to attract more fans. In short, it is disappointing. If there ever was a chance in any game to kill Tingle, I'd do it...There is a fine line between annoying but funny (Mr. Resetti) and annoying without purpose (Tingle). Complete miss... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 09:38, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Other than resetting every three days, I liked it a lot. If you couldn't finish a dungeon/sidequest in three days, you were really slow. If you used the Inverted Song of Time and failed you should be even more ashamed. :P -- 17:59, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

prO Player
"Find a way to deal exactly 1,337 damage in Guild Wars (in one packet), and take a screenshot for proof. Flux Matrix does not count. (Rank 5)"

What about 1337 heal? Dmg is rather undo-able. Prog and I have tried with Wild Blow, a ton of buffs on a Frenzy/Healsig Warrior without Armor, and topped around 700. --- -- (s)talkpage  20:09, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You just have to use the same (presumable Infuse?) trick with a slight twist. I expect half credit for that comment if someone else uses that before I get a chance.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  22:07, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * ...wouldn't losing 1337 health with infuse work just as well? --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  22:26, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Meh. That's not as fun, though. Either way, it would help if I had a guild with active members so I'd have people to do this kind of thing with.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  01:55, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Wild Blow isn't the strongest damage you could do, though. GB isn't technically "damage", but I might let things like that slide if this proves to be too difficult. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 09:19, 30 August 2008 (UTC)


 * No, but even 40 armor ignoring damage won't boost damage by 600 :P And, Decap disallows Avatar of Lyssa. We used Wild Blow/AoL because we didn't feel like restarting the whole buffing sequence every swing, just to wait for a crit (we had some Adren skills to charge, so it took a while), and since I was casting Healing Signet as he struck, AoL would deal some bonus damage. Keen Chop didn't exist yet :P
 * D/W vs W/Mo aside: Using my Sin's Scythe, I've hit 191 in one Chilling Victory, not counting additional Cold damage. And that's with Aura of Holy Might, Vow of Strength, Strength of Honor, Asuran Scan and a crit. Sure, it was an AL 60 target, but I doubt you'll be able to increase your damage by 1k by switching to weaker targets. So, GB will probably come into play to deal 1337 damage, but that's so easy. Get a Health Difference of 2674 and cast. One guy with a Vamp weapon would carry GB, and degen low. The other is enchanted beyond recognition, so he has 2700 HP (Symbiosis lols). The GB guy degens to point 26 hp and casts. Done. You can porbably get away with 3 heroes. Monk/Ranger with Symbiosis and Enchants, 3 Monk heroes, one with BR/enches and the rest with: 4 Maintained enches, and random, long lasting enches.
 * Who's up for a scrimmage? ;) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  09:44, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I can't give any better hint than that. :> GL though, you ought to video it since if you manage 1337 damage it will be quite epic. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 10:37, 30 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Haha, I need to wait for my new computer if I want to make a video :P My current computer has a slight lagg on screenies, let alone videos ^^" And yeah, there are many means of dealing damage. Siege hits for 8k, but I doubt you can get it to 1337 without burning daylight like mad. Or you could get 6685 HP (enches/Symbiosis again), then drag along Defiant Was Xinrae. 20% is the dmg cap, which is 1337. Spells won't deal enough damage, since you can't buff 'em enough, or they deal damage in many, many packets (old Pain of Disenchant was fun. Prog and I loaded up the Guild Lord with ~30 enches, then PoD and Gaze of Contempt. Was quite an awesome sight to behold, but the Amu of Protection kept him from dieing). At least, I think so. Anyways, there's, so far, 3 ways from my view: Infuse (Easy as pie), Grenth's Balance (requires another player and some coordination), Siege (hard numbercrunshing, need exactly 6685 hp). Well, and Flux ofcourse, but that one's excluded. Maybe I can find an Undead creature, low level with Frenzy. JI + AoHM + Vos +etcetc = gg? Brb, looking through bestiary... --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  10:46, 30 August 2008 (UTC)


 * /facepalm. Hellhound. Brb, chopping Undead :D --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  10:47, 30 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Bah, way to much micro with heroes... Still,


 * Got me a neat 602 shot (^not on one character, ofcourse.. I needed a Monk). Could be a lot higher, since I have r1 Kurz (used Kurz AoHM) and r0 Asuran, didn't use Weaken Armor, Anthem of Envy and whatever other buffs. Orders won't function with the Holy dmg, btw. I should grind some Asuran rank for better shots, and perhaps get r3 Kurz or something. And need a second player (Great Dwarf Weapon ftfw). Ooooh, and "By Ural's Hammer!". --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  11:32, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * you need a second player viper? unless you find someone else i can assist you. <font color="FFOOFF">Kurtan 12:03, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Get 1337 + ~50 health with symbiosis, etc, and let shadow form fall off. That counts as damage.  --Neutronium 06:13, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Not really :P Shadow Form "damage" is actually life loss. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  07:52, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


 * OK, I'll show you the two easy ways...first, you can use Ebon Vanguard Sniper Support. Second, you can get owned by N.O.X. with a crazy number of bit golems active. I was getting damages easily over 1,000. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 10:49, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I thought we had to deal exactly 1337 damage? --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  11:04, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


 * That whole N.O.X. fight was pretty funny, because we coincidentally brought a stunning strike paragon. He never got a single attack off.  It was plain ridiculous. --Neutronium 22:17, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


 * If you grind numbers exactly perfectly, you could theoretically deal 1337 damage with Sniper Support, and N.O.X. could hit you for 1337 damage. I only said "find a way to deal 1337 damage other than Flux Matrix"; I didn't say that the player had to be the one doing it. Don't forget that Simple Thievery used to be able to steal Monster skills, too. :> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:43, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I thought the idea was to find a way to "deal" 1337 damage - I take that to mean that an infuse wouldn't count... I suppose you could count GB, but that seems really hard to do (and also a little bit like cheating). For the record: We came so damn close just today without using either aforementioned tactic.  I'm sure it's do-able!  Just have to find the right combo :P --Raj4h 00:39, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wow, nice job. What was your strategy? I'll give a bigger reward for less cheap ways to do it, though like I said I'll allow any of the above. Anything except Flux Matrix. You can do Infuse or GB even though they aren't really "damage", since it is still a leet achievement. But it's less impressive. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:59, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It was a guild scrimmage, using lightning orb @ 18 air magic vs an unarmored opponent with frenzy/heal sig. A guildie and I were attempting to get the biggest damage packet ever (without GB or infuse), and it just happened to work out - almost!  Our biggest packet so far is 2403.  Expect an update on that soon though --Raj4h 07:05, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Oh, I better be quick getting Prog to scrim and numbercrush a bit ;) Nice shots, I say. Too bad you couldn't see what was happening, tho. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:43, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Hmm, I am surprised that it did so much damage, Lightning Orb in PvP doens't cause Cracked Armor... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:48, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * ^My thoughts, but not about the CA. CA doesn't work when your AL is below 60, assuming lv20. I don't know how CA functions when your AL and level are below max, though. Weaken Armor casting Devourers really feels redundant in Old Ascalon ;) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  12:18, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I had forgotten that. But you just gave a new idea for a possible anomaly. Easy way to test would be a lv1 Canthan War, unarmored, use Tomes to get Frenzy and Healsig, go scrimmage. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 21:44, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * According to my calculations, if you have a player who has -40 armor from Healsig, and is under Frenzy, and you have Rank 16 attribute, and you are Level 20, and you have no armor penetration...you have to deal roughly 78 base damage to reach 1337 damage. I am sure there are a bunch of skills for that. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:18, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * A quick google search reveals a good skill for that purpose. Or two others to tweak the damage by one point either way. And two more to tweak the final damage.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  23:41, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Something seems to be wrong with my calculations or the template. Will debug later. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:49, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

call_out("replace_favicon", 1);
Does anyone know how to override the favicon on GW2W? I'm feeling anarchistic so I want to change it to the GuildWiki Swords and Shields logo. L: I think ANet locked it against simple .JS hacks though...I'm running the same .JS on both sites but it does not work over there. Perhaps it's because the image isn't on the ANet servers, but the Wikia ones? I couldn't upload it over there, either, because that would be a major copyvio. I suppose I could render my own from GW itself...hm... (T/C) 12:33, 30 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Shop the swords out and put other swords in, like Longswords. Then disguise it as a screenshot edited with Photosoup :D --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  12:45, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * So are you saying that is the problem? That I need to target an image on ANet's servers instead of Wikia's? I could probably choose something else... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:43, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Copyvio is not an issue. The icons were made by LordBiro under GDFL, so you'd be fine porting them over.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:51, 31 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Orite. :\ [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:46, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

disable interwiki link
So there is this page on GW2W which is an interwiki link: Gw1:Guild_Wars_Utopia. It transfers to that page on GWW. But, when that page is linked to via their Candidates for Deletion, it says that the link is invalid or broken. However if I just go there directly it seems to work fine and I get transferred...

Now the problem is that I want to delete that page on GW2W (obviously - it's in Candidates for Deletion!), but I don't know how to access such a page and disable the redirecting or whatever is used to transfer me. &redirect=no does nothing. Any ideas?

By the way, reason I ask these things here and not on GW2W is because I can probably get a response here quicker :> (T/C) 21:24, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Try this. I get a permission error because I'm not an admin, but it might work for you.  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 21:45, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * See Guild Wars 2 Wiki talk:List of candidates for deletion; it's already been discussed before. Also, Wizardboy, that link leads to the Index.php page. -- R [[Image:RPhalange star.png|18px]] Phalange  22:20, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
 * This different layout takes some getting used to. Thank you. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:18, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Category:Non-orphaned articles
Why'd you change that instead of making the category and subpage for it? It's not hard. --◄mendel► 10:38, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't understand how the system works. Feel free to do it properly...all I know is that there's this subpage which shouldn't be messed with or linked to (if I understand the arguments right), and therefore it becomes an orphaned page, except it's not really because it's a subpage and it ought not to be considered possible deletion fodder, etc...? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:32, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Ok, I'm going to try to explain this clearly, and if I succeed (with your help) I can copy this to the article.
 * Orphaned pages are pages that are not linked to. This is usually an indication that they're not integrated into the wiki very well, and the way to fix it is to integrate them: think about which pages could link to it, do a wiki search for the article name, whatever it takes.
 * However, there are some exceptions. For example, we endeavour to not link to disambiguation articles, but rather link directly to the intended alternative. This can leave disambiguation pages orphaned, and that is a good thing.
 * Another common exception are pages that are transcluded onto other pages; they're usually subpages. You can link to them (some of them make good QR guides), but they're useful even if they're not linked to, and there may be no need to link them.
 * We want to remove these pages from the "orphaned pages" list so that we see more clearly which pages really need editorial attention. The idea is to create a link somewhere to make the wiki software think that the page is not lonely any more. The easiest way is to collect all those links in a special article. (Another way would be to maka a link on the including page and disguise it with display:none, which is simple if you do the inclusion via template anyway, but we currently don't do that.)
 * However, what with this wiki being quite large and transclusion being used so often, this special article got rather big and unwieldy. Many pages on that big article belonged to categories that should, as a whole, never be on the "orphaned pages" list: for example, the disambiguation pages; or all pages in one of the "subpage" categories. This offered an obvious course of action: split subpages off, one for each category. For example, the subpage Non-orphaned_articles/Disambiguation has a link to every disambiguation page. What's more, this is done automatically. If you make a new disambiguation page and place it in Category:Disambiguation (which the does for you), it will automatically appear on the list (there may be a short delay if the Wiki is busy). Of course that also happens when you add an appropriate category manually.
 * To summarize: the old procedure to make a page non-orphaned is to put a link to it on Non-orphaned_articles. (That still works, too!) The new procedure is to add the page to a category that is automatically non-orphaned.
 * If you find that you want to unorphan a page, but there is no proper category for it, the you can create one - maybe it already exists. To unorphan a category, you make a subpage off Non-orphaned_articles like the others and put the same template call on it. The template will read the subpage name and automatically make a link list for the corresponding category.
 * Pages that can't be categorized, but still ought to be taken off the orphaned pages list, can still be linked to from the article (old system) - or we create a Category:non-orphaned pages and its automatic list subpage and put all of these lonely pages in there (new system).
 * So that's basically what I suggested you might have done. ;-P --◄mendel► 17:21, 4 September 2008 (UTC)


 * So I put it in the subpages category - isn't that the right thing to do? I can remove the notice I put at the top if that is a problem. I think your explanation is a good one to put to the page, although not everyone would understand necessarily the technical parts. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 06:03, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Could you be so kind and make the "technical parts" bold or italic in my post above? --◄mendel► 09:28, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Jargon and/or things that someone new to Wikis may not understand. What do you want ME to do, though, is still my question. Your original message implies that I did something wrong, but reading through your instructions all I done was categorize the old birthday drop data as a subpage, which puts it into the non-orphans article, etc. So I am confused. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 10:49, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the highlights, I'm going to ponder them.
 * My reason for commenting was that, going by your first edit, that category seemed the natural fit for the page. I've considered "category:subpages" to only apply to pages that actually get transcluded; this one's a "legacy page" or archive if anything. Of course, technically subpages are anything with a slash in the name. You chose not to create the category & list page as I would have, but instead chose to recategorize, and I wondered why. My comment wasn't meant as a call to action.
 * But since you asked, what I would like you to do is the next time you want to use this category, to actually create it, and add the old birthday drop page in. (Hmm, maybe a better way to un-orphan the old birthday page is to actually add a link to the new page or its talk to point out that the history of the old additions is available at (link) - it doesn't help having an archive if we can't find it later). --◄mendel► 11:52, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Okay. I was unclear about what should have gone into the Subpages category, since I was under the impression as you say that anything with a slash in the name was a subpage. And because this seemed to be the only "legacy page", I thought it would be dumb to make a category with just that one thing in it. (Also, Template:Legacy is for GuildWars related things, not old Wiki articles.) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:41, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

hey
You probably know about this already, but if you didn't, here is the best VC release to date :). Cress Arvein 00:46, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I have Clu Clu land! <font color="Orange">Random <font color="Black">Time  05:17, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I did hear about it. Here is my reaction: O HEL YES!! But screw you, Nintendo, that took forever. :\ Oh well, at least one of the greatest games of all time will finally be available to a new generation of players. Now about EarthBound and Chrono Trigger... :\ [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 06:03, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * There was a massive rally for EarthBound's VC release a week ago. Don't count on Chrono Trigger being released anytime soon due to Chrono Trigger DS coming out soon. Cress Arvein [[Image:Cress sig.JPG]] 05:56, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh well...it's not like Nintendo gives a flying fuck at a rolling donut about its hardcore fans anyway. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 10:49, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Me wants Banjo-Tooie :( --Macros 13:06, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I loath you, Cress. You got the Mario RPG song stuck in my head.. --[[Image:OrgXSignature.jpg]] 22:33, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It seems to me like if you can get a working ROM for a game, Nintendo should be able to make something to the Virtual Console. I guess it must be more difficult than that, though. Since theoretically, there are hundreds or thousands of games more they could put in, but they don't. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:41, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * They should add GBC games imo. Oracles and Pokemon anyone? [[Image:Bunneh.jpg]] ~Bunny  16:15, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * /signed. Especially since you can't play GBC games on a DS. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 16:26, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Can't you put them in the bottom slot where GBA games go? --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  18:10, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, I guess not. That's lame. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  18:12, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

random Note here so people will read it soonish
Don't forget that all the R.O.X., P.O.X., and N.O.X. skills need to be added to Monster Skill. (T/C) 16:13, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * R.O.X. don't have none. :P That article needs to be overhauled anyway - turn it into a quick-reference style page, or maybe a DPL.  Why wasn't it done that way in the first place, I wonder?  I'll add that to my list of projects.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 16:32, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * R.O.X. has Golem Strike but that is already on the page. However I didn't check whether or not it is identical to the normal version. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 16:36, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * ROX's Golem Strike is the same, yes. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 18:05, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * A quick reference would be something like Icon-Name-Effect-Skill data-Notes-Used by Whom-Can be Disabled? I think the reason it wasn't done like that in the first place, is because they aren't skills that can be used by players so it's not the sort of info/page that someone would come to look at. (Ie. you don't make builds with Monster skills) Also, it was started during Prophecies when there was precious few Monster skills. With each campaign they added some more, and GWEN added a HUGE amount. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 16:39, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I've got a mockup ready at User:Dr ishmael/Sandbox/Monster skills dpl, let me know what you think. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 18:05, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Good job on fixing all those monster skills without callthrough, I thought I'd already done that. :-( The big drawback of this list vs. the current one is that it lacks a "used by" column, we'd need some creative dump parsing to do that automatcially. Anyway, I'd prefer bigger icons, say 35 or 40 px. And why not use our standard QR format? I've got a mockup ready at User:M.mendel/Sandbox/Monster skills dpl, let me know what you think. ;) --◄mendel► 19:00, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I didn't use the standard because this is going to need an extra column or two - "Used by" at least, and maybe "Disable-able" (needs a better name of course, but would require testing against every single monster skill).  The duplicate and quest boxes (next to the campaign box, under the stats box) are also completely useless for this list.  For "Used by", I was going to go through and add that to all the skill templates as a new parameter, wouldn't be all that hard - there's only 222 of them...  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 00:37, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * About icon size: this is going to be one of the longest skill qr articles we've got, except for the "<Profession> skills quick references", we should probably stick with the smaller icon size. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 00:41, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * With the added columns, the length will be determined by the descriptions column on most screen sizes, not by the icons. At the size they ra enow, you could replace them with generic reddish and yellowish squares and no-one woul notice. If you roll your own QR, I'd just not display any of the generic monster icons. If the "disable-able" affects only very few skills, wouldn't a separate QR be better? What about "stealable"? The used-by means another parse through the current_pages.xml . --◄mendel► 01:03, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * No Monster skill can be stolen since they fixed the Simple Thievery (?) glitch, but I think the disabling column isn't rally needed.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  01:10, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * No dump parsing required, I already got the list I need right here.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 03:27, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The Disable or Interrupt-Resistant column ought to exist, and it can be a simple check or X. I believe it is important when planning strategies for harder missions and quests. For example, you can use Diversion to totally pwn any Siege Wurm type monster. But Shiro Tagachi won't be affected. What about N.O.X.? I had a great idea where you could do an epic echo chain of Blackouts to keep him permanently locked down. But I don't know if that works. Etc... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:10, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Now ZAT!! was Doktor assisted homicide! I prefer the Doc's version, though of course it is still bit messy. The spacing for Effects needs to be standard (ie straight tabbed colums so Adren, Acti, Eng, etc. all line up in same horizontal position down the column). I agree with Mendel that the icons ought to be bigger. I am also wondering what would be the best way to sort...ABC by skill name? Monster used? Campaign? Allied or foe? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:16, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Stats width corrected - I missed where I had to assign class="stats" to the td that contained the class="skillstats" table (copying from other qr row templates). I bumped the icons up to 32px.  The default sort for DPL is by article name, and the sortable table allows you to re-sort on any column you want - of course, if you think the default DPL sort should be different, there's a couple options available for doing that, but not much.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 04:54, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Coolness. Did you ever notice that no Monster Skills do Health Sacrifice? I think it looks pretty good as is...now that I think about it, most people would logically sort by ABC skillname. Thanks Doc - and that only took you what, a few minutes? :p It's the Machine Revolution taking over! [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:08, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Except Animate Undead. Which isn't on that list, evidently?[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:51, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

(Reset indent) That's because the job queue still kinda sucks at the timely re-processing of pages that include templates after the template is modified. I did a null edit on Animate Undead, and now it shows up in the list. &mdash;Dr Ishmael 03:51, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, it was because the template had "no profession" instead of "Profession:Monster" until I fixed it shortly after that post.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:59, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't it be prO to take /Monster secondary? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:04, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It would indeed.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  03:10, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Final(?) version
I'm done adding the mosterusedby parm to all the templates, so this table is now fully populated. I didn't include anything on disabling/interrupting right now, because I don't know any easy way to compile that information. &mdash;Dr Ishmael 18:46, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, cool. :) For disabling/interrupting...well, that would have to all be done manually, testing with Diversion and a hard interrupt etc. Some are already known as being a yes, no, or interrupt-resistant, usually noted on those pages. Others have never been tested. Some which have crazy recharge or activation (Knock, Metamorphosis, etc) don't need to be tested because it is irrelevant. Instant activation or permanent skills are also irrelevant, except maybe for disable...I guess it could be a project to work on over time, as it would comprise research in all four campaigns across all three continents, from the beginning of the game all the way to elite missions. Hehe. And of course some PvP. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 21:44, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I can go ahead and put the columns into the template for those, and then you or whoever can add the parameters to the individual skill templates as the research gets compiled. Blanks will be displayed for any skills that don't have the parameters, of course.
 * Should this be moved into mainspace now/soon? Should it just replace the current tables on the Monster skill article?  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 21:58, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I vote replace the current table since it is just miles better and more up-to-date too. Put a notice with instructions on the page for people to add in info for interrupt/disable as they see fit, to each monster skillpage. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:27, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Random woohoo
Tom Brady is injured and out for the SEASON with a torn ACL! WOOHOO! --Gimmethegepgun 01:53, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * WOOHOO! Now to wait until Brett Favre gets hurt. Cress Arvein [[Image:Cress sig.JPG]] 02:25, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * WOOHOO!--[[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg]]<font color="Black">ìğá†ħŕášħ 03:35, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * So I assume you're a Jets fan then? If he gets injured, then he's not gonna be throwing his massive number of interceptions to the opposing team any more. Otherwise, if you're not a Jets fan, I think you should reconsider and hope he stays healthy again :P --Gimmethegepgun 03:37, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

HALP
My favicon is acting like a paint shaker gone berserk ( Spot the reference ), when I am on a "special" page like my Watchlist or Recent Changes it is the GuildWiki logo like I have specified in my .JS ... but when I am on any other kind of page it reverts to the Wicked Wikia W. Why now? :((((((  (T/C) 04:16, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I highly suspect it's because Wiki has turned on the URL rewriting Javascript that is to compensate for redirect URLs not changing to the new page. Why am I not surprised the first version is buggy? See w:Forum:Redirects. I wish Dr Ishmael would develop soem combat code that allows us to disable some of teh Wikia Javascript functions (the one that fills the searchbox would be another contender). --◄mendel► 04:41, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * A Javascript war with Wikia? Epic... :\ Well, at least this is better than simple "doesn't work anymore". In her left hand, she held the Light of Hope, and in her right the Sword of Mana. (Spot the reference!) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:51, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Sword of Mana, I fucking love that game.--[[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg]]<font color="Black">ìğá†ħŕášħ 04:52, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It's a so-so game, but I am highly biased because I played the REAL Sword of Mana, aka Final Fantasy Adventure. Old skool. Now, THAT was a great game for its day. I still personally find it much more enjoyable. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:08, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Using firefox and monobook and having no changes to my .js or .css regarding the favicon whatsoever, I have the guildwiki logo everywhere.  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 05:06, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh. IE is fecked up, then. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:08, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * No, I see it in FX3 with Monobook. Wizardboy, it only does this for redirects with anchors, like Travel quest.  Check that and see what happens.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 05:19, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I just had an EVIL idea. What if we went and took out the Wicked Wikia W altogether? ...or is that file not accessible by us? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:21, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

another random callout
I need a PvPer to help me reach HA someday. Anyone? No one would take a PvE player at Team Arenas, and trying to win there with a P.U.G. is dumb. (T/C) 15:57, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * You mean, get 5 wins in TA? That's easy if you know the lame meta. Usually it's just 2 back/midliners, some physical that just c-spaces everything to tiny bits and one other, which can be just about anything... However, if you don't want to run lame crap, I wish you a lot of good luck to get 5 bad teams ;) Although there are some times where TA is deserted, which means you'll find quite a lot of RA teams. Easy wins are rather easy <3 If I misunderstood what you said: My apologies. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  16:16, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Hmm, I've not been doing much PvP either, so I guess I would join you if you'd like. --◄mendel► 17:21, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * If you see me on, I can monk (or do whatever, if you don't need a monk). And if anyone else in my guild is on I could probably drag them along.  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 18:28, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Warwick said she would help too. So it looks like we have a team :P [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:52, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Don't take Warwick, she abuses TA monks. 208.44.247.101 01:21, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Shadowcrest will volunteer if warwick is rejected :P --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  01:30, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I can (in order of effectiveness) Mes, Cripslash, or monk if you need any of those. If you want me to run a dom build though, you need to let me know in advance so I can warm up my reflexes before the match. &mdash; Powersurge360  02:01, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I can (in order of effectiveness) kill or heal. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 02:33, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Too late - jio, dejh, and I helped her out with epic triple hammerway.  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 02:52, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, Wizardboy happens to actually be in my timezone now and so he was the only one online. But thanks anyways to others. I am surprised at so many offers! We were running a pretty terribad build which was...amusing to lose to. Took out a few pseudo balanced teams, lost to duo monks and Hexway...but we got exactly five wins. So it was okay.
 * Now if someone can teach me how to play balanced, I can participate in HoH runs or such. :> Probably the only build I could even try to run is R/Mo Cripshot with Mending Touch, since I have a little experience with that. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:03, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Interestingly, you don't need five consecutive wins... just five wins over the course of your entire life. 04:04, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Kay-o. I'm just saying it was coincidence that after the match which unlocked HA (5th win), we lose to Hexway which was a perfect counter so to speak. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:13, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Actually, Felix, I strongly recall you need 5 consecs. Ah well, doesn't really matter. Congrats Entropy :) And if you want to get to HoH, you probably won't play balanced a lot, until you're at least r6+. You'll rarely find a worthy <r6 Balanced group, let alone reach HoH with it ^^' Well, unless you find an HA guild that doesn't discriminate, that is. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:39, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * 5 (10?) consecs for RA...I forgot about the whole "guild" thing, I was hoping maybe I could just run with some of you dudes after practicing a bit. Heh. Too bad I can't do full H/H in HoH. (Why is it called the Hall of Heroes then?) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:48, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * For HA it's five over your career as a PvP player. For TA it's a streak. &mdash; Powersurge360  03:06, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I believe those are mutually exclusive conclusions. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:09, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I think he meant HA for the first one. It's definitely five ever (not necessarily consec) to unlock HA, because we only got four consecutive wins last night, not five - we didn't get a glad point :(  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 03:26, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, lapsis linguae, I was thinking about the end of my sentence at the beginning of the sentence. Fixed now. &mdash; Powersurge360  03:28, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I've never played TA before...? How did I get 5 wins? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:02, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Did you get one with an RA team, maybe? But I distinctly remember a conversation along the lines of the following:

Lana Irving: HA unlocked Nyzant Kreng: We should try to win this one too for a glad point Anjiru Kuro: Gogo one more for a style point Nyzant Kreng: That too Lana Irving: What are style points? Pie Wizardboy: Not in-game :P Nyzant Kreng: oh crap, hexway. We're screwed
 *  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 04:11, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * So what are glad points? :p I thought we had hit 5 wins right there when I said that. I know that I got to TA on a streak with an RA team which was a PvP monk, me as W/N with Plague Touch and Parasitic Bond, and two other...but I don't remember getting a win there. Hmm, I guess that must be what happened then. Oh well. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:14, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

"Which is more famous?"
I voted LAME. It's been around longer, and has been used way more.-- (Talk) (Contr.) 02:05, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd vote for LAME, but for some reason FF isn't letting me. Guess I'll try with... *shudder* IE --Gimmethegepgun 02:12, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, IE failed at it too, so count that as +1 on LAME. Also for some reason it's spamming up this annoying script error thing involving a null somewhere --Gimmethegepgun 02:20, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Votingphail causes me to say LAME, despite it's recent dormancy compared to INAFR.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:56, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Because Izzy has lately been giving out more serious buffs than nerfs, I guess that would be why. Usually every time there is a giant skills update change, there would be a few LAMEs. Although I think about 1/2 are placed by me...INAFR though is on its way up because it's much easier to work into any conversation. 6/10, 6/10, better luck next time! Spot the reference. See, easy. Anyway I am amused and appreciative that people would vote so...it makes me feel like I've been useful for at least one thing for sure at GuildWiki. :> Of course even though I made the template (with some help and guidance from other users), the actual acronym LAME was invented by User:Queen Schmuck, who I doubt anyone remembers.
 * I think a book about the history of GuildWiki would be cool. LAME and INAFR would definitely get their own chapters, or at least appendices. I'd consider writing it someday but it is beyond my own personal experiences... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:09, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I can't vote - weird <font color="Orange">Random <font color="Black">Time  05:50, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Known bug, on the wikia board. Btw, archive moar, my school computer is lagging. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  14:48, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * But I'm only to 76kb. It's all the same to you, my friend...I think it's all because of you! Do GuildWiki at home, and study at school :p [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:48, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Also, Wikia is secretly trying to repress the spread of God's Will democracy! Conspiracy! [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:50, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * And on the 16th day of the history of the universe, God turned to the Angel Gabriel and spoke: "Ya know what this place needs?  Music, give me your horn."
 * And on the 17th day of the history of the universe God spoke to the Angel Gabriel: "Where did all these people come from?"
 * And on the 18th day of the history of the universe God went fishing.
 * CENSOR THAT WIKIA!--[[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg]]<font color="Black">ìğá†ħŕášħ 01:55, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Study during programming 2? We did in a day what would take us a week in programming 1, and then we had nothing to do for a day. It was quite lulz, and my teacher doesn't want to speed up the curriculum too much. I'm even contemplating designing a sig on photoshop at school, because the computers have photoshop2 :P
 * Oh, and since I can't vote, LAME. And my home computer is lagging. Badly. I have to type 1 character at a time :P
 * Stop ec'ing me. Moving my cursor by clicking causes the page to stop responding. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  01:59, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Some of my favorite comics are "Acts of God", "Half-Baked Earth", God saying "Man, these things sure are easy" while making snakes out of the "clay of life", etc. Gary Larson and The Far Side rule. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:05, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I actually made up te 18 days of the history of the universe at one point. I did not win the school talent contest with it because I was DQed for blasphemy (fail Utah, fail), but I did make the entire school laugh so hard the majority of them needed to find a small empty corner off somewhere to recover.--[[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg]]<font color="Black">ìğá†ħŕášħ  02:09, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * LOL! Post to Wiki if you still have it...or even better, YouTube. :D Hey! We ought to have a GuildWiki Talent Contest! [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:12, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I have it still somewhere, however I cannot post a video because my sister wandered off to college with our camera.--[[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg]]<font color="Black">ìğá†ħŕášħ 02:13, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Lulz, I have Adobe CS3 on my laptop. Cost a fortune though, and technically can't use it after school ends :\ I prefer Paint for making most simple things, it's more leet. I guess it depends on how complicated you wanna be...when you have, say, a sig which is already a computer graphic you can easily resize that with any number of programs. If you are using a digital photo (like my sig) you need to crop, clean up noise and edges, clarify text, adjust levels, etc... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:05, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * In RIT's game design and development lab, the image they use on the computers is 70 gigabytes. Vista is like 15 gigs, while adobe stuff takes up a whopping 35 gigs xD Also, we have 60 xbox 360's hooked up to the same gigabit LAN. Which creates some interesting possibilites, considering the number of copies of halo 3 we have in the stock room.  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 04:16, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Dude, I am using 117 gigs out of 150. And I have cleaned up as much as I can :\ I know a transfer student from RIT...I wonder what it is like over there. Maybe I should visit some day. There are mostly Wii's here at RPI. I wonder why. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:56, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Hey Shadow, stop giving me your lag, I've done a self-EC / double post from 1 click / related thing like 5 times today. That's a record. :\ (T/C) 06:16, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Quotes
I couldn't help but notice, there's an awful lot of quotes on your userpage. You wouldn't happen to be collecting more, by any chance? I know a few good ones (I've been reading some books of quotes recently), and I probably know a few good story-like quotes (which may or may not be too big to quote). I'd be happy to impart unto you small shards of my glorious intellect and wit, if you so desire. Or better yet, shards of other people's glorious intellect and wit, which I have so gloriously collected due to the scope of my intellect and wit. --<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  08:02, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Put them on your own userpage (or a subpage thereof)? --◄mendel► 14:44, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * You misunderstand, I don't "collect" quotes - I awarded them for completing various tasks and puzzles. I pull all these from one game, which has an ever-useful function called the Fortune command. I still have more to use when I need them. If you want to use your own, I'd suggest doing something similar instead of just posting them, that's no fun. And it creates less spam. :> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 21:44, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * When I said "we", officer, I was referring to myself, the four young ladies, and, of course, the goat. From the FreeBSD fortune file. It's huge. --◄mendel► 23:24, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Heard it. That's not where I go though.
 * "Flat tire?"
 * "Damn kid had a bottle under his coat."
 * ...yeah. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:26, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Hmm, I see. Didn't realize the quotes were part of the game rewards there! To the casual observer, it simply seems like a userpage full of fun quotes. :D --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  03:04, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * "This is a list of trivia, tasks, and other things which you may complete on your idle time to please me and boost your cultural literacy. As a reward for your efforts, I will dig up something out of my vast archives of Memorable Quotes, Stories, and Other Things to share. The harder the challenge (1 easy, 5 daunting), the better the reward...though you are free to disagree, of course." no one reads instructions these days :> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:21, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

so i herd in The Marketplace
ANet has plans for a new Sin hero drawn up. Name is "SPARKS", he has a horse, he can be from the Am Fah or the Jade Brotherhood.

I would say worthless rumour, but considering how suddenly M.O.X. appeared I guess it is not totally infeasible. I guess ANet wants to release more Heroes so there are three of all profession. That means we can expect another Mes, Para, and Rit also. (T/C) 00:37, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Probably just a useless rumor. A sin hero on a horse would be stupid, even if they did a sin hero. maybe a Centaur sin. But not a guy on a horse. Hell, does Guild Wars have any horses in any place at all?[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  00:40, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Equine Aegis. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 00:41, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Stone Summit Beastmaster is the closest thing. Otherwise, Dolyak Prod Staff. :> Maybe it is a Centaur and the person was confused. They said ANet had "drawn" them... I wonder where the info is from, or if it's totally made up. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 00:42, 11 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I want the ghost of Althea as a hero... -User:PanSola (talk to the [[Image:follower of Lyssa.png]]) 02:31, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * She is too hideous. That would be like replacing Tahlkora with Danika zu Heltzer. Although at least Althea didn't/doesn't have horrible scars from plastic surgery. Sebedoh the Mesmer moar plOx! Also, I would like Seer Fiercereign for the other Ritualist hero, and for the other Assassin...uh...an Enchanted Daggers would be fun. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:12, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Palawa Joko as a fourth necromancer! [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:14, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * How bout a Shiro'ken Assassin? Or better yet, a Shiro'ken Assassin with Shiro's enslaved spirit in it :D --Gimmethegepgun 03:17, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The undead Lich as a fourth necromancer! [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:18, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * That would be awesome. But I'd rather have him as a Warrior so he could do leaping strikes at foes with his staff, and then get impaled with giant swords as he falls to his demise! Epic mission ^_^ Well, personally I like all the Necromancers, so I wouldn't know who to take out for The Joker. Olias is cool. MoW is awesome. Livia is...yeah. However I can see a problem, what would happen to the Bone Palace when Palawa is out and about?...what would happen when there are more than one of them? [[Image:Deadly Paradox.jpg]]! Personally I'd rather have Sergio. Also, Lich is failsauce, and Shiro'Ken were all destroyed when Shiro kicked the bucket. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:21, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Alesia's never-before-seen sister Diseasia as a fourth necromancer! [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:23, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd take Alesia over Goren any day for Warrior. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:29, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * There's a difference? [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:30, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wide Warrior is wide. (Bald Monk is bald.) Alesia runs a better build in The Norn Fighting Tournament than Goren does anywhere. :> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:35, 11 September 2008 (UTC)


 * What about the ones in the Realm of Torment? Seriously, I never quite got the lore for that, how was he able to make more when he wasn't an envoy? &mdash; Powersurge360  03:49, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Those were really just cheap knock-offs built in Hong Kong by gold farmers. Everyone knows that Shiro, Undead Lich, and Abaddon were really secretly trying to take over the world by underselling their competitors. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:05, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * So basically we fought against the free market? --[[Image:OrgXSignature.jpg]] 17:30, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Sunspears are communists. Never profit alone. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 17:31, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes. Make a userbox. Also, Guild Wars Miners and Traders (can't find link). [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 17:42, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Diamond
You mean like this: ♦? I get that by pressing the back key on my mouse (far faster than the buttons up top), probably how you got yours. Also, might be relevant: mouse is a Logitech --Gimmethegepgun 03:02, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I have no such keys. Also, that button is a bitch, I always hit it accidentally and lose my data (when I am using such a mouse). I must have hit some combination with the "." because that is what I had meant to type. "Vs." [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:14, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Eww disambiguation link, bad Entropy! Anyway, if you "have no such keys", then how is that button a bitch? (not being mean, just asking) --Gimmethegepgun 03:19, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * "when I am using such a mouse". reading is gud, mirite? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:29, 11 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Usually you can press the forward button and only lose a few seconds of work. Well, at least in FF. I've never had a mouse with a "back" button when using IE :) But doubt IE doesn't have that. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  06:29, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Mouse back/forward buttons work with IE and Firefox, yeh. As well as Windows Explorer (you know, that thing with all the folders in it). Weather or not you can press forward to get your typed data back depends both on your cache settings, I think, as well as the website you're on... I know on some websites, if I click to far ahead when I'm writing, I can just go back a page and have it all still there. Some other websites will send you back to an empty page.
 * And yes, I also own a Logitech mouse with back/forward buttons, although I generally just use Alt + left arrow/right arrow to navigate. (and if I'm in the mood to make everything harder, I can edit on my tablet, which has back and forward buttons on the edge of it.) --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  10:39, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You never typed that diamond. --Macros 13:26, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * ...lol wtf? XD [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 17:02, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Forward/back mouse buttons are great!♦♠♦♠♦♠♦♠[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  01:10, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I have a Logitech mouse, yet I don't get those when pushing those buttons while typing... have to use character map to get them. --Macros 01:15, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

bah
I cant edit your page, and polls dont work, so I vote LAME. &mdash; Warw/Wick 18:58, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, I totally forgot that I protted it :O D'oh! [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:20, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

gems
You logged when I was typing a response :( I'll take 2 rubies and all your sapphires when you log back on. I might get a destroyer wep sometime, but not for a long time... and so I don't need the diamonds. Thanks for offering though. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  21:57, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry, class started. I'll check what people are asking in LA etc., and the trader, and then we can negotiate. If I bothered to run all my characters through Nightfall I could get many more. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:20, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I spammed WTB them in Kamadan and never got a response, so... good luck. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  01:21, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Not uberfail- I'd have been able to vote on your protected page, methinks. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  01:22, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I can sell to trader for 3.2k and 3.4k respectively; buying from them costs 4k and 4.2k respectively. So I charge you 3.6k per ruby and 3.8k per sapphire. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:36, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * How did rubies drop 200g in the past 6 hours? Epic lulz. I accept, for lack of a better option :P --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  01:38, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Get in-game asap then. Ice Cave. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:45, 12 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Hmm... I still need to fill my Valor Monument, so, how much for those Diamonds? ;) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  10:30, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Diamonds are pretty cheap actually, compared to Rubies and Sapphires. I wish I could have predicted that when I was turning in Trade Contracts. Oh well. When you are in-game we can negotiate, but I think it will be around the 700g mark (iirc).
 * Btw, I have another Sapphire for you, Shadowcrest. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 16:55, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wtb. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 21:18, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Uh, Shadowcrest, yeah, so after Assault on the Stronghold I got distracOH SHINY! I'll try to connect soonish.  And since I now have your IGN, that'll help move things along.  You still need those I'm assuming. --JonTheMon 21:24, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

favicon
is still messed up for me. Unless I am on a special page it is the WWW. It can't be IE since I've already killed and resurrected it multiple times now, along with the cache, temp files, etc. Help? (T/C) 07:56, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It hasn't worked for me since Wikia took over, actually. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 08:06, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * It mostly works for me in FF3. Look at the page source of the article you're viewing, somewhere near the top you should find

<link rel="shortcut icon" href="http://images.wikia.com/gw/images/6/64/Favicon.ico" />
 * Go and load http://images.wikia.com/gw/images/6/64/Favicon.ico now, do you see the correct icon? If not, your browser has the wrong one cached, reload it.
 * Do you have custom JavaScript rewriting the icon? IE7 only sees the correct icon after the Wikia Javascript has updated it, before that, it shows the explorer icon. --◄mendel► 08:13, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The correct icon displays for me at that link. My .JS does this:

I never see the IE icon unless I am editing a page or such. I see the Wicked Wikia W while looking at pages normally; and the GuildWiki icon when I am on a Special: type page. (T/C) 11:38, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Now I broke it completely and I never get any icon except for IE Error on normal pages. :( The normal Favicon will show up briefly sometimes, and also appears when I am not logged in. But I prefer the .png image that I have listed there, since it's bigger, clearer, and transparant background. The favicon has whitespace background. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 11:50, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I now get different icons depending on what namespace I am in - Special, Main, GuildWiki... This isn't cool. Maybe it's time I converted to FF. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 12:16, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't recall using any .css or .js hack to change my favicon, myself. However, it is usually the swords-and-shield, and sometimes switches to the Wicked Wikia W. Using FF 2 here. Still, I prefer FF over IE, for several reasons. One being the tabs-on-startup: I start where I left off the other day. It's lovely. Don't know if IE has implemented that by now, but when I switched it hadn't. And you get ABP/ChatZilla. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  12:20, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I see one problem - the URL in your JS doesn't exist, .../6/66/... should be changed to .../6/64/... &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 15:15, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I know. I don't want the 64 image though...and now, Wikia changed something where images are stored in some totally new place, which is like nocookies.wikia.net or such. So I dunno how to get around that redirect and find out where the GuildWiki icon.png got moved to. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:20, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Dr, the 404 stems from the fact that Mediawiki wikified the apostrophe; remove that from the URL and you'll find it is quite valid. Entropy, get IcoFX (it is free) and make a transparent .ico of your .png and upload that. See Favicon. --◄mendel► 15:36, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Read that, does the .ico extention make all the difference? Since I am very sure that .png is also supported, and I know that it was working just fine for awhile. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:46, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * You can link that way, just not off-wikia. Maybe we ought to try displaying other wiki's images: http://images.wikia.com/guildwars/fr/images/b/bc/Wiki.png
 * Anyway, I was thinking of replacing the wiki's favicon with something transparent, if possible, not just yours. w:c:fr.guildwars actually has one. --◄mendel► 15:56, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * *beep*ing apostrophes. >.> &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 16:07, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Yay, it works now! .ico format is the key I guess. Thank you Mendel - that program is awesome considering it's free. (T/C) 20:12, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/ ftw. Free software for almost any task, selected by an internet community that values free software that is also free of ads and worse. :-) --◄mendel► 00:13, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * ...Incredible! :O Are you sure they won't kill you now for revealing their secrets to the Wikimasses? :D [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 00:26, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

It seems to have broken again. I get (!) Errors every time I load a page, and the IE icon only. Also, the ads at the bottom flicker repeatedly like "Electric Soldier Porygon". Maybe it's time to give the Internets a rest. (A bit earlier I got the Varnishing Gurus error too) (T/C) 01:59, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Also, my JS stopped loading. (T/C) 02:18, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Ono.
I failed sanity check. Mostly because the hidden message went in the summary bar and not the page... Entrea   [Talk]  14:49, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Also, 110 kb archive moar.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  14:51, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * GZ, if you played Pokemon Gold or Silver you'd get the reference. Varnishing Gurus and stuff is cool.
 * WTB 200k archive. Set a new record. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:54, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I did play Gold, just a really long time ago, so I have no idea what the Rouge Doll did.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea    [Talk]  14:59, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * ROCKET ADMIN wants to battle! I dunno, the pose just reminded me of one of those encounters. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:17, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Ban
"(I just know someone is going to be offended by this.)"

Intentional En Pee Ae. <3 --- -- (s)talkpage  20:05, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * fr srs. Inspired by Talk:Unsuspecting Strike [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:12, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Hey!
"whenever i attack, the damage i do is does was 70. even though the assassin can do the dps, warrior can. should i or shouldnt?" <font color ="#73C2FB" size="3px" face ="mistral">Lost-Blue 00:35, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wut? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 00:46, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * This not joke. If you joke, I lefting wiki. <font color ="#73C2FB" size="3px" face ="mistral">Lost-Blue 00:48, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * English, Mother radiation! Do you speak it?! 4srs, cnt ndrstnd u [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:00, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * MINE FACE! <font color ="#73C2FB" size="3px" face ="mistral">Lost-Blue 01:18, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

:O
I forgot I was going to post this earlier, but...So I log onto my Monk today, who had capped all Prophecies Monk elites. And he was missing Shield of Regeneration. I know he had it, it's the first elite you can cap in Prophecies for Monk. But...it was just...gone. Still unlocked on my account and everything. I had to go recap it. :\ It's not cool because what if Guild Wars randomly forgets that I capped, say, AoB? Or something in endgame Factions/Nightfall? I don't want to have to do that all over again... (T/C) 03:06, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Aob equals Blinding Flash. Done. Or Weakness, with, say Withering Aura on a Ranger, who can also interrupt his Balth Rage (ouch + heal != good) and CVic. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I know, but it's a waste of my time still. Game shouldn't "forget" my elite skills. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:45, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I've unlocked Expel Hexes at least 3 times now :< And I'm sure I unlocked WoH earlier than ~1 month ago (I feel so awesome. The last elite I unlock is WoH ,after 30 somewhat months :P ). It's so annoying.. but not much you can do against it I suppose >>" --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:50, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Oh so it's not just me...I wonder if it has anything to do with then they change a skill, buff or nerf, or change functionality...maybe that breaks something. Or their databases are just really poor. I wonder how the Elite Skill Hunter track is affected? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

wtb idears
User:Entropy/skills

Give me a skill icon and I'll make some new skill out of it in a day or two. I'm trying to practice with Photoshop and this is much more entertaining than those tutorials. Post below. (T/C) 03:02, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

03:06, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Go look at Category:High resolution skill icons; it's being filled right now, and these images make for better photoshop fodder. --◄mendel► 03:08, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I was just looking through that, but so far I'm only thinking of redoing Avatar of Skywalker because I messed up the flesh/armor portions (he has bare arms). Hi-res icons are good to work with but resizing them to skill icon-size I find often kills a lot of the minute details :\ @Felix - Ok [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:12, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Definition: a HTML element that is triggered by a semicolon at the start of a wikitext line. --◄mendel► 03:20, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Plisska. User:Entropy/skills/Contemplation of Victory. The armor was the most difficult part to do anything with, it is so dark and featureless in the icon. So I had to improvise. Next!
 * [[Image:Ferocious Strike.jpg]]? [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 04:11, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * A challenge, that icon is quite explicit and "busy" already. But I will see what I can do. :P [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:40, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * User:Entropy/skills/Rage Against the Machine. I cheated and made it an effect instead of a skill, but I thought it fit better like that. That's the last one for today, wtb Zzzs. Leave me one more to do tomorrow. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:28, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Golden Fox Strike.jpg]] You knew it was coming. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 07:52, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Dwayna's Kiss.jpg]] --◄mendel► 10:43, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * (ri) On the subject of Photoshop, don't forget that a good number of users here are already quite skilled... I'll bet if you posted a random Photoshop question on your talk page, you'd get a few answers pretty quickly. (from me at the very least.)
 * Also.
 * [[Image:Agony.jpg]]
 * I'm sure that has some uses, eh. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  14:24, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, I'm aware of that. But they aren't usually the ones active when I am active, so I forget. Here is a question for you: have you ever found some combination of effects which will "GuildWars-ize" an image, to look like a skill icon? Sometimes you can make a really nice icon, but it is terribly obvious that something in it doesn't belong because it just stands out too much. Also, wtb easy way to remove some of the excessive color overlay on skills. I know they are colored based on profession, but some are really hard to edit because of too much R/G/B/some other color mixed in everywhere.
 * @Felix - you don't fight fair :O [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:36, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * GW icons look really flat (imo), and have few varying colors (Necro skill use green/black mainly, for one. Warriors black, orange and yellow). The Contemp. of Victory image has yellow, black, bright blue, pink.. Oh, an easy one: [[Image:Healing Breeze.jpg|30px]], to compensate for Felix' meanness or something like that. Yeah. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:44, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I like to try and add more color variation without going too wild (Image:Hara-Kiri Ritual.jpg is a bit too colorful). But you're right, maybe trying to "flatten image" is the key. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * A good way to make an image less blue or whatever is to manipulate the color channels separately (much like gamma, but with curves). You can also selectively reduce contrast that way. Don't ask me how that's done on PS, though. --◄mendel► 17:03, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * ...That's a good idea. I don't know why I didn't think about that. Probably since when I was making icons yesterday I hadn't slept for 24+ hrs. :p [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 18:30, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

@Mendel - User:Entropy/skills/Black Speech. Liquify and Warp are fun. (T/C) 15:56, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * [[Image:Vampirism.jpg]]<-- Uh-huh.--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 20:11, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * NOT cool, man. >.< [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 00:30, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd go for a "douse" like thing if I were you. But then, I'm not as preverted as the average guild wikian. &mdash; Powersurge360  00:32, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Blessed signet (lulz), Succor, Restore Life, RoJ and Smite Hex were the ones I saw that would be cool. Zealot's Fire if you're really bored and feeling ambitious. Also, wtb umbrella page. Also, <3 Light Arrows for the reference. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  00:46, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * For that many you should've used a mini skill bar lol &mdash; Powersurge360  00:47, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Then I couldn't use given &redirect=no links. I'm having difficult actually coming up with skills for these :P  --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  00:52, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I have a lot of requests now, so you'll have to be patient. :\ [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 00:53, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Patient Shadowcrest is patient. I've looked at all the ones you've made since Light Arrows (I think- wtb link to User:Entropy/skills more), since that was just too great for words. Reading what you come up with is interesting. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  00:57, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

@Felix - Shadowdancer Ritual. Also, big link is big. (T/C) 02:14, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

@Marco - Blood Runs Red. My hand, your face! (That's how we roll in California) (T/C) 03:32, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

@Jio - Panic at the Disco. It's a fun icon and I wish I could be more creative in modeling a skill after it. (T/C) 04:33, 16 September 2008 (UTC)


 * GuildWars-ize? One suggestion would be to "colorize" the picture; press Ctrl + U to bring up the Hue/Saturation sliders, then check off the Colorize button. You can match to a profession in that way.
 * Another trick would be in the Filters; you can use things like "Cutout" to simplify edges and whatnot, kinda emulate the simpler skill icon designs perhaps. There's a few other filters worth messing about with as well.
 * And a bit of an expansion to the first suggestion; if you copy the entire icon, then paste it again as a duplicate layer, you can colorize it, then tone down the opacity a bit (maybe 75% or so). That way, you change the general color of the whole icon, but you can retain a bit of the other colors you might have in the image (in case you don't want the entire image to be just blue, for example). With a second duplicate layer like that, you could also erase little bits of it to let effects from the previous layer "shine through" (say, if you wanted to use a "Cutout" Filter, but not on the entire image). --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  14:18, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks Jio, I'll keep that in mind next time I get a heavily overlaid icon. Maybe will do that for the Battle Rage remake...
 * By the way, folks, I really do appreciate some kind of commentary/critique on these, no matter how trivial. While the main purpose of this is to exercise my creativity and Photoshop skills, it is always nice to get feedback on your work. (Besides, seeing as it's you suggesting the icons, I would imagine that you are at least semi-interested in the final product...) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:00, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

@Viper - Dian Keto's Signet. It's actually a pretty fuzzy icon even at hi-res, so I took the logical route and smashed it into a signet :p (T/C) 01:44, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * In that case, I will mention that I like the gold necklace you gave him in the "Panic at the Disco" icon. I thought that was a clever touch. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  13:37, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you :) He also has neon Chrismas lights on his other necklace, but you can't see that without going back to the hi-res size icons. :p [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:45, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Thought you'd do something like that (making it a signet). Not a lot more options, with just a floating Ankh, I suppose. Imo, it looks like an azure, fossilised (or is that with a Z?) Ankh, and looks good in that perspective :) So, I conclude: Good job. Now if only the skill was balanced ^^' Possible 201hp heal on a 1/2 cast, 5 rech, no cost? And affected by Mantra of Inscriptions.. Wow. Strong. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  13:48, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I appreciate it! But, it is a 1 second cast (easier to dshot), recharges slower than WoH (without MoI), and heals for less overall because of Divine Favor. I had a "you lose 5 energy on the conditional heal" but then in comparison with WoH it would be way too hard a choice. WoH really does need to be (slightly) nerfed. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:45, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * As you said yourself, Divine Favor goes to complete shit when your elite is in no way, whatsoever affected by it. Thus, it has a 1⁄2sec activation timer in any serious build using it, making it actually quite a hell to DShot, let alone not be overpowered. Because it's free, you can actually gain Energy with it, thus fuelling PS/SB just that bit more. Sure, it takes a slot on your Para, but hey, they're always the toolboxes of the party. I suppose this completely supports your theory of starting off overpowered beyond recognition to somewhere along the lines of balance, even though that second step may or may not ever be taken, since most skills still have a huge AoE effect. Sure, they can be interru.. Wait, not really these days, unless you carry a convenient disabling effect. Of course, in the hopes they're not wailing on you with certain skills. I'm rambling on too much again. Sorry for littering your already long talk page with a lot of links and rather meaningless conversation. Have a nice day :) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  20:31, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I appreciate litter, it helps me to...no, wait. :\ Hmm. Maybe I should bind it to Divine Favor so that a Mes can't outheal a Monk. That's the biggest advantage, I guess...But if it is tied to DF, then only Monks could use it, and it becomes inferior to WoH since it doesn't get the DF bonus, especially if I try to balance it by adding in a conditional -5 energy...etc. Hm. I guess Izzy's job can get difficult sometimes.
 * About huge AoE effects, I consider them justified if they also detriment your own party. The times when it doesn't matter is the times when you don't need that kind of power...for example, you can repeatedly use Solar Flare to wtfpwn everything, and keep coming back at 60% DP. However if you are Vanquishing it's pretty bad idea, and it doesn't work in PvP (you'd get a "draw"), and in most missions and some hard quests it would be suicide. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:06, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You could actually use those skills to vanquish quite easily, because you can just bring one character as a portable rez shrine.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  22:15, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Any other res would work too. But they would need to always stay out of the earshot range, and so in certain areas that would cause problems, I think...Also would not work in, say, Junundu. There are also a few monster that could take the damage and not die, such as Destroyers I think, and some bosses etc... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:24, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Run 2-6 E/Mo's with PS and Solar Flare. Other two can be life insurance. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  22:31, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Maybe I should make it "easily interruptible" or "have -40 armor while casting". [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:34, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * PS -> Glyph of Sac -> Solar Flare. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  22:40, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Gah. I guess the skill just needs a rework. :\ [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:54, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Without combos like that it's an interesting skill, nice idea. Maybe Izzy's job isn't as easy as everyone says it is after all. (Yeah I know you just said like the exact same thing somewhere else :P) --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  23:09, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Lose all effects. You cannot be Enchanted. . And yes, balancing is quite hard with so many skills... --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  12:39, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

hold the rit res urn or drop a Restoration beforehand then. There are just so many different kinds of loopholes. <font color=#555>Ezekiel <font color=#AAA> [Talk]  13:18, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Lose all effects, and it summons a Frozen Soil. That's just excessive though. I will pull an Izzy and do Functionality changed to: [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:07, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Wanna turn this into a skill for me? . Had the idea for a long time, but I'm so lazy. &mdash; Powersurge360  00:07, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It's Hamstorm, what else could I do? Also I am pretty sure it's been made before. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 00:16, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You could give it an amaze-tastic skill effect. And hey, I'm pretty uncreative, leave me alone. As far as I know, no one's made an icon and given it a real effect beyond "For 1-5 seconds, you suck at GW". I looked, although half-heartedly &mdash; Powersurge360  00:18, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * "Lose all effects, and it summons a Frozen Soil." The frozen soil would die immediately when the skill completes (though restoration would too), and Restoration bypasses frozen soil anyway iirc. :P --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  00:24, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Poll
I can't vote, but it's rather obvious that Ilsunder would win, since he has HP-ignoring instant kill fire boulders. 23:18, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You left out Kuunavang :(
 * If an actual fight is what you're asking for, Ilsunder's fireballs would indeed kick major ass. If the fireballs don't count, then I'd have to go with the Leviathan (simply because it sounds hard, I haven't ever done the Deep). If you're basing it off coolness factor, Glint :P --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  23:23, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, we still need to Deep with you. Leviathan is pathetic actually, he has no skills. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 23:26, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Leviathan deals OMGWTF damage even though he has no attacks; and the Reborn Irukandji respawn infinitely, who spam Disenchantment spirit. Have you ever killed him, Felix? I've only heard of like two or three people who have said so...Ilsundur's boulders would make the fight an automatic win and that wouldn't be fair. I forgot Kuunavang yeah... I have a hard time remembering every single hard monster in the game. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:22, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, we kill him most runs just for fun. He dropped a blue bo staff once, which we treasured. The article seriously makes him out to be much worse than he is. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 01:25, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Hahaha. I'd like to see this legendary Bo Staff some day :) I am also kinda disappointed because the article makes it sound like a really cool and dangerous monster, but I guess the cake is a lie after all.
 * One question that I still can't answer is, what is the biggest monster in the game (aside from Abaddon)? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:33, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Frostmaw tops Maw, but I don't know if she's the biggest. Also, +Frostmaw. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  01:37, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * And Cyndr is kinda small. What about Jormungand? I've never seen him. Frostmaw is also rather wimpy compared to others, unless she comes with all the other pop-ups. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:39, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I've never fought him either, but he looks smaller than frostmaw from the picture. Also, want to be able to see the people on your userpage, I can't be bothered to click edit every time I want to know if you have a thing :P --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 01:42, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I do not understand. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:15, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Leviathan is bigger than Frostmaw, and I think only Abaddon tops that. Jormungand is ~Maw's, if not smaller as stated above. +1 for Mallyx, btw. Apes with big domoge... And he drops a green Banana Scythe. Come on. Can't top that. Besides, Hexes/Conditions are rather gg against him, iirc he heals for 500 per? Good luck. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  12:37, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * So I guess the Leviathan is definitely the biggest creature in the game except for Abaddon. (I don't like to include Abaddon because he's basically a giant wall >.>) Someone should try and get a better screenshot for size comparison next time they are in The Deep...one that's like the [[Image:Maw The Mountain Heart.JPG]] screenshot, that REALLY shows the size. :> Actually, I'd also say the same for Jormungand and Frostmaw - it's hard to tell how big they are exactly.
 * Mallyx is very strong, but are you sure he could take out Shiro from Factions? Or N.O.X.? My thinking so far is that Shiro would end up near the last foes since he has the Impossible Odds and the other skill which gives him great survivability unless you've got very strong anti-melee - which none of the others really have (eg. Shadow of Fear, Reckless Haste, Price of Failure, Spirit of Failure, blind, etc.) However if he entered Meditation of the Reaper he would be dead soon. And if N.O.X.'s Bit Golems are ignored - which they may be since most don't aggro - then he would whip out a N.O.X Fire for 1000+ AoE damage. But even barring that, no strong anti-caster hate either like Daze.
 * I had Kanaxai and Cyndr the Mountain Heart on the list, but I realized they would be automatic winners because (1) Kanaxai needs to be knocked down, which few can do and (2) Cyndr could only be damaged by Lifesteal, which I think only Shiro has. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:01, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

(RI) Unless one of the othert bosses has massive interrupts or Daze spamming, count NOX as +1 from me (stupid broken votes) Entrea   [Talk]  23:50, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Words of Madness, Entrea. I can get a proportion shot of Leviathian one of these days, but iirc he's not larger than Frostmaw. Viper's memory can't be trusted since he took Channeling Magic on a smiting monk. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 23:54, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Ok, Abaddon has daze, but he's a pushover in any other respect, so he'd be SCREWED if NOX knocked at his door. [[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  00:00, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * And now: Ahoy, mateys, it be International Talk like a Pirate Day (roundabouts England). Throw on yer bandanas and party, ye scurvy dogs![[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  00:01, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

In response: "Mallyx is very strong, but are you sure he could take out Shiro from Factions? Or N.O.X.?"

Ofcourse he can take on N.O.X.. If you compare damage output, Mallyx goes far and wide beyond him for as far as my memory serves me. Besides, N.O.X. has to channeltank Mallyx for 10 seconds to deal ~300 damage (approximation, don't know AL of Mallyx). Wooptydoo? Another fun thing is NOX Phantom (or w/e it is). Hexes against Mallyx. lold. NOX is enchanted by the Rectifier golems, thus NOX will get a skill disabled (Banish Enchantment). Oh, and Mallyx + Impossible Odds'ing Shiro is gonna be great. Shiro strikes all Nearby foes. Mallyx draws everyone adjacent to him. Obaby.

Felix, shut it already.

Shiro would be rolling if he'd enter Meditation, actually. He'd wipe out almost every Bit Golem, thus basically nullifying NOX, and dealing armor ignoring, life stealing damage to the others. Unless he's Wild Smash'd by Mallyx, that is. --- -- (s)talkpage  18:49, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * But Nox could knock Shiro out of mediation in a matter of seconds. Nearly all of his skills do at least 500. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 19:00, 19 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Depends on who he's knocking. Remember there are ~30 bosses fighting in an area (probably roughly the size of North Kryta Province). Random comment: The Meatwad-king would be rolled. Monsters lack attributes, and that's about the worst he can do; screw with attributes. He doesn't even hit for an insane load of damage, and has a low amount of HP. Same goes for a lot of these, actually. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  19:06, 19 September 2008 (UTC)


 * There is always the off-chance that one of them gets ignored, and then may win. Shiro could spam Echoing Banishment on Mallyx. :> Remember that if N.O.X. builds up enough Bit Golems, he can reach damage in the thousands. It is all a matter of chance. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:47, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Age
Arn't you like 22 now? <font color ="#73C2FB" size="3px" face ="mistral">Lost-Blue 01:43, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I am 18 [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:15, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Young'un :p --BeeD 10:01, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I know. It works to my favor, because if I was older then the argument "you did pretty well for having the entire Wiki dumped into your lap before you were even 18" would be moot, and more would be expected of me. :\ [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Add Kanaxai
Please? -->Suicidal Tendencie 16:21, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, btw, I did read the above, but he looks damn cool so I won't give up hope. -->Suicidal Tendencie 16:23, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * But he'd basically win automatically, so that's not fair. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 17:21, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

WTB Nifling's Staff
Name your price. (T/C) 17:22, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * bit tough, PBAoE spells > shadow form, remember trying on my 55 and getting pwned.... maybe 600 smite... I'll try later, but i'd like one too just for the awesome mister Monday Refrence Roland Cyerni 20:24, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * yeah, took 45 mins to work through the self healing centaurs...then he stupid incubs killed me along with a symbiosis spike. Maybe if u wanted to take 2 hours and go vewy vewy carefully, but thats just to get the the boss, gl trying to ge a dop out of him. Looks like our on ou own m8 sry Roland Cyerni 21:43, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * o_O I was hoping someone already had one on them, didn't expect you'd go out and try to farm one. (No one selling it on GWG either) I appreciate the effort though! [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:22, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * was wanting one badly too anyways... if i figure a way out ill farm ya one too ( maybe get a quote reward (or some money...?)) Roland Cyerni 22:52, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I would pay any price you want. A Droknar's Key could be up to 10k for an equivalent stats but wrong skin. A purple/gold perfect req9 Smiting Staff + Black dye + Enchanting mod is also not cheap. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:00, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * k, gotta farm it first so be prepared to wait bout 1.5 months :) Roland Cyerni 23:01, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Farming it shouldn't be to hard, just go from the central transfer chamber to the battledepths then up into varajar, short walk and only some griffons and elementals on the way. a perma-shadow sin could probably farm him, beware of signets tho. hmm have to see where my sin is.. suddenly got interested in GW again <font color="FFOOFF">Kurtan 23:36, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * PBAoE and signets and ridiculous amounts of pop-ups. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:55, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * PBAoE aint that dangerous, but shock is. which the wizards happens to carry i just realized (again) <font color="FFOOFF">Kurtan 00:00, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Shadow stepping into the mob to get silver armor to hit him is brutal... ive even tried in, out, wait for them to come after me with shock, then restepping in. Just doesnt work for me. +2 1337 skills if you can tho Roland Cyerni 01:52, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Greens suck. I'll see if I can make you a real Smiting Staff. 01:40, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * If you can get a gold, req9, Smiting Staff, 20% recharge on spells, 20% recharge on Smiting Prayers, +20% Enchanting, and +5 Insightful...and dye it black...well, be my guest. o_O You can then sell it for 100k+Ectos on Guru I bet. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:07, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Try 20k... most common skin and mods are most common. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 02:12, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Can one use Unyielding Aura to avoid the popups? --◄mendel► 06:50, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * recheck what Unyeilding Aura does in PvE, not quite sure what you're trying to say. Roland Cyerni 16:46, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * If you die yourself near the entrance and let your heroes forge ahead and res you via UA when they arrive, it's been reported that pop-ups don't pop up. --◄mendel► 20:33, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * UA res is earshot range these days, Mendel. Gl with that. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:25, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Since when is perfect req9 golds, insightful, enchanting, aptitude not attitude (iirc), and Black Dye the most common mods/drops? o_O [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:14, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Only the Black dyes aren't common. The rest isn't expensive at all. Insightful = 1-2.5k, Enching = 3-10k, Apt not Att = 5k (some idiots try 15k, tho >.>"). --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  19:18, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * That looks pretty expensive to me. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:21, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * 9-17.5k isn't that much. 7k for the dye makes 16-24.5k. The skin is worth... crap? Hard to find one, probably. Comparision; One Destroyer Wep is about as much. 5k for Onyx (500ea), 6k for Diamonds(600 ea), 7.5k for Granite (one stack), 1600g for Iron (16ea is reasonable), 5k Craft. That's 25.1k. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  19:34, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * That's two pieces of Elite armor...or a bunch of Heroes fully equipped...or 25 new skills. So to me that's a lot of money. I also happen to think that the Smiting Staff is the best skin for, well, Smiting staves. Destroyer weps are ugly anyway. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:12, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I personally use a Winged Staff for the Holy damage... although I also have a 15^50 customized Frog Stick. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 23:15, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, the Holy damage is an important factor - for Junundu if nothing else. (Flailing holy wander, zOMG) I was going to get the Ferverborn Staff because that's sold commonly, but I think the Winged Staff skin just can't measure up to the leetness of the Smiting Staff skin...dyed black...in America. It's got no magic hoodoo animation etc. which I find pretty. Also, your Frog Stick is no match for my Shaman's Rod. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:23, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You might be surprised... I read somewhere, perhaps on GWO during my brief stay there, that 15-20% of a party's damage comes from wanding. Even if that statistic is flawed, there are no armor bonuses vs. Holy, and there is one fact one armor that's weak to it, and even for a primarily PvE monk, undead foes are common enough and you often have the leisure to wand when monking in PvE. Wanding for 60 just makes you feel really good, you know. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 23:28, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I was agreeing with you :) Tormentor's insignia are nice...and in PvE I wand while waiting for RoD to recharge. Smite monk usually has tons of time to wand, since all those skills have long recharge...
 * Also, now that you have me thinking about it I would want to replace all my Hero Monk's weapons to Holy. But then they'd need tons of mods which I cannot afford. :\ [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:33, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Only reason to USE a smiting monk nowadays is for their staves, smiting is only slightly above using wastrels collapse as a snare Roland Cyerni 00:33, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Smite Monks are still very proficient damage dealers, imo. I <3 my Meleemonk <3 Ranged just isn't that strong, due to lack of firepower. And the Smite Hex/Cond combo rolls undead, since they always use Hexes and Conditions, and take a load of dmg from Smites. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  09:23, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Henchment
I know my sense of humor is somewhat strange, but could you kindly not delete my userpages? I thought it was funny ("sarcastic" didn't even cross my mind), and was hoping it'd come to be used as a term for enchantments badly placed. If you feel it is a dig at you (which it wasn't meant as), feel free to remove the two links; I placed them there as attribution only, and it is of course your prerogative to refuse attribution. --◄mendel► 17:58, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Bah. Do whatever [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:24, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

A New Hope
Yo Entrophy check this out http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10325642. tell me what you think. - Miki
 * Now, I may not be Entrophy, but all I see is "make Henchmen suck less" (yeah right, they're designed to suck) and "give us more money for less work whenever we do certain missions." That seems like a kind of pointless idea to me, and I doubt it would do anything to the game except perhaps causing a bit of economic upset.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  03:56, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * "Reward time spent in the game" by making hench skillbars to player specifications. Funny, I thought that was how GW rewards playing with friend: by not having to take henchies, but freely customizable heroes! --◄mendel► 05:46, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * And the OP is ugly too! Bashing Entropy's friends without offering any suggestions builds cameraderie, right? [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 05:50, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I only met this guy today, so I hardly know him. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 06:58, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * There was no personal attack intended. You're right, though, I could have phrased my criticism more politely. About the "offering suiggestions" part - the guru thread seems to state that the OP finds it unsatisfactory to play GW. Since many other people do not, I can only surmise that the reason lies with the OP - many people find that after a time they get bored with whatever game they play and move on. It's the course of the world. If all you're playing for are rewards you're not satisfied with, I suggest reexaming your attachment to the game. Lest this be understaood as "bashing" again, I mean it when I say that this is perfectly natural - to fall out of love with a game you've immersed yourself in, and I intend no personal criticism by suggesting that this might be the case here. --◄mendel► 08:45, 19 September 2008 (UTC) & 08:50, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

is it my waning attachment to the game that makes me want to change it so badly? perhaps but i think that a lot of the changes might be warrented. u were a bit right about my feelings about the game but that is not the real problem here. -Miki
 * I will read this today. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:14, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Okay, here is my point by point response. Your points are on the first line, after the bullet "*". Mine are on the next line, after the indented bullet "   *".

Prophecies

 * add both normal and elite armor for the Assassin, Ritualist, Paragon, and Dervish
 * I don't like this idea since those professions are not native to Prophecies. On the other hand, the Deldrimor Talisman may be traded for spears and scythes, so...meh.


 * Change henchmen skill bars
 * Can't do that, the henchmen must have skills from their native campaign only, plus Core skills. Instead I would do the following:

Stefan

Little Thom

Devona

Alesia

Lina

Mhenlo

Reyna

Aidan

Claude, Eve

Dunham

Orion

Cynn

Factions

 * add celestial and zodiac skins for scythes, spears, and paragon shields
 * ZChest only, since those aren't native to Factions


 * triple the reward for the challenge missions. the reward for beating a record or any special drops from the mission will remain untouched
 * Agreed, most people do these just for fun or boredom or farming the special drops (armor fragments) - this may revitalize them. Dunno about triple though, maybe just double?


 * add faction rewards for completing missions on both kurzick and luxon sides. 500 faction in normal mode and 1000 faction in hard mode.
 * Agreed - FFF/HFFF is way too boring, as is mindlessly vanquishing, this would give a slower but less boring alternative


 * add both normal and elite armor for the Paragon and Dervish
 * Not native to campaign, and they already went out of their way to add the unique weapons in Divine Path


 * Change henchmen skill bars
 * Can't do that, the henchmen must have skills from their native campaign only, plus Core skills. (However, let us assume that Aidan, Cynn, Devona, Eve, and Mhenlo can use skills from all previous campaigns, as they are in each.) Instead I would do the following:

Devona

Lukas

Seaguard Eli

Talon Silverwing

Aidan, Daeman

Zho

Yuun

Aurora

Cynn

Argo

Kai Ying

Headmaster Vhang, Kisai

Eve

Su

Brutus

Sheena

Erys Vasburg

Lo Sha

Seaguard Hala

Aeson

Professor Gai

Chiyo

Emi

Panaku, Mai

Nika

Redemptor Karl, Seaguard Gita

Danika

Sister Tai, Taya

Urgoz Warren

 * add celestial weapons to the drop list of monsters, chests, and the end chest
 * would make them entirely too common and make farming Nahpui Quarter worthless, maybe just add a chance for golds of the end chest to have them


 * change the end chest drop from what it is now to: 3 gold/green items, 6 ambers, and 500 kurzick faction on normal mode and 6 gold/green items, 12 amber, and 1000 kurzick faction on hard mode
 * Faction is nice, but leave the rest as is


 * add Kurzick Blessing to area
 * hell yes

The Deep

 * add celestial weapons to the drop list of monsters, chests, and the end chest
 * change the end chest drop from what it is now to: 3 gold/green items, 6 jades, and 500 luxon faction on normal mode and 6 gold/green items, 12 jades, and 1000 luxon faction on hard mode
 * add Luxon Blessing to area
 * see above


 * add a crafter who crafts gold versions of endgame skins and remove endgame skins as drops from Urgoz and the Deep
 * nowai, they are already heavily price deprecated, this would totally destroy it and make them meaningless

Nightfall

 * triple the reward for the challenge missions and increase the drop rate of hero armor. the reward for beating a record will remain untouched
 * Agreed, most people do these just for fun or boredom or farming the special drops (armor fragments) - this may revitalize them. Dunno about triple though, maybe just double? Armor fragment drop rate should be adjusted so that you always have an equal chance - supposedly the chance decreases the more pieces you find.


 * add a crafter who crafts gold versions of Forgotten skins
 * put him at the Throne of Secrets and it's OK


 * add normal armor for the Assassin, Ritualist
 * not native to the campaign, but maybe they could add it just to Consulate Docks


 * change henchmen skill bars
 * Can't do that, the henchmen must have skills from their native campaign only, plus Core skills. (However, let us assume that Aidan, Cynn, Devona, Eve, and Mhenlo can use skills from all previous campaigns, as they are in each.) Instead I would do the following:

Devona

Timera

Mhenlo

Kihm on Istan

Kihm after Istan

Aidan

Abasi

Cynn

Herta

Eve

Odurra

Sogolon

Gehraz

Domain of Anguish

 * increase the current gemstone drops from the completion chests to 2 - 4 - 6 - 8 in normal mode and 3 - 6 - 9 - 12 in hard mode
 * increase Mallyx chest drop to 3 drops in normal mode and 6 drops in hard mode
 * too many. Give 500/1000 Sunspear and/or Lightbringer points instead

Eye of the North

 * make polymock pieces account based
 * That would be VERY nice


 * add a crafter who crafts gold versions of Droknar's skins
 * That would be okay, except all the skins pretty much suck :p


 * change henchmen skill bars
 * All rules are thrown out for Eye of the North. So let's do:

Devona

Mhenlo

Aidan

Cynn

Eve

Lina

Lo Sha

Talon Silverwing

Herta

Zho


 * increase the reputation points at the completion of the dungeon by 3 times
 * That's a LOT for the first time completions - you could almost reach Rank 3 in one go. Dubious. Maybe just triple the faction for repeat clears.

Arachni's Haunt Bloodstone Caves Bogroot Growths Darkrime Delves Heart of the Shiverpeaks Oola's Lab Ooze Pit Raven's Point Sepulchre of Dragrimmar
 * increase the drops for the following dungeons to 2 in normal mode and 4 in hard mode

Catacombs of Kathandrax Frostmaw's Burrows Shards of Orr Vloxen Excavations
 * increase the drops for the following dungeons to 3 in normal mode and 6 in hard mode
 * too many. Instead, every player gets ~3-10 plat based on how hard the dungeon is


 * Vanquishing: increase the gold and experience for vanquishing to 15 times the monsters
 * sure, the extra money is trivial right now


 * Traders: add a weapons modifier trader and a normal tome trader to towns, outposts, cities, and guild halls (not elite tomes)
 * Tomes trader makes skill trainer obsolete. Mods trader always a welcome idea, if old.


 * Titles: change the treasure hunter and wisdom titles to account based and this goes for their benefit as well. for those that have multiple characters with chests and wisdom we will simply add your totals up to make the new title.
 * Would make A LOT of people QQ heavily, and a lot of other people VERY happy. Hmm.

Hall of Monuments

 * allow people to change display orders any way they see fit not a random ordering like it is now
 * yes plz


 * allow Tormented weapons, Deldrimor weapons, Droknar's weapons, Zodiac weapons, Celestial weapons, and gold versions of endgame factions weapons to be displayed
 * I heard Tormented will be added. I think all endgame weapons (those that require a trade thing, like Amulet of the Mists etc.) should be able to be added. Maybe gold crafts too...I can't see anyone complaining about that.


 * for endgame greens to be a bit easier to obtain allow endgame rewards to be reacquired after beating the final missions in hard mode
 * Interesting idea. I dunno if that would be good or bad. But there should definitely be a reward for beating the final missions in both modes. I think that it could be a big bonus to faction, reputation points, sunspear/LB points, or such...one time only. Or just experience and money.


 * add a statue for completion of Tomb of the Primeval Kings and for the Titan Quests
 * Tombs is too easy to get (B/P), Titan quests no one does anymore, but maybe that would be a nice idea

Heros and Henchmen

 * make it that when the party engages the enemy, frontline charges in first while the mid/backline spreads out
 * give the heros and henchmen better aoe detection so that they know where the aoe is and how to escape it quickly
 * make it that the frontline won't stray too far from the backline. no more then slightly beyond earshot.
 * H/H in general just needs more options. AoE I definitely agree with - you can always flag them out manually, but that will move the whole party, etc...However, they can only be made so smart.

Overall though, I think that you are too concerned with the economic aspects of Guild Wars' decay. Tweaking the hench would be nice for the PvE junkies, but they don't really need it as you can H/H nearly everything the way they are now. More money, faction, drops, etc. is meh. I think the biggest problem is with skill balance and new content. New content keeps a game alive, but we know there will be very little while they develop GW2. So then there is skill balance...but that is a very difficult topic.

"rewards for time you put in" - well...I mean, you should still have to work to get rich. But at the same time, there are definitely some dungeons etc. that are a total waste of time in terms of profit, since no one wants the greens etc. I have one additional suggestion: Make all storyline-related dungeon instances like Heart of the Shiverpeaks, where you get access to the completion chest at the end. So you would get it for Warband of Brothers, A Gate Too Far, and Finding the Bloodstone. (T/C) 05:46, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Hey
I wasn't snapping at you, but I knew that people didn't care about it when I wrote it, I just felt the need to put it somewhere. Don't take it as an insult that I had second thoughts. &mdash; Powersurge360  07:32, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * In the same regard, you don't have to feign sympathy with a pretentious sound-off. I'd like to be missed, I guess, but only if it's genuine. &mdash; Powersurge360  07:34, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh. Well, it is very late all across the U.S., so I doubt that any "people" would even have had the opportunity to see it yet and care or /care. But you're right, this probably wouldn't have been an appropriate place anyway.
 * For what it's worth you have my sympathy and also my empathy...I've been in a similar situation once. Well, no, make that three or four times. On both sides of the equation.
 * I apologize if I came off as insincere or pretentious. The Internets is a bad place to construe emotions. Maybe I was throwing too much light too grandly on something best kept in the shadows...but my intentions were quite serious and heartfelt, I assure you.
 * I die a little inside...GuildWiki dies a little...every time a user leaves. So even if it is just me to say so, I will miss you. (And if you will excuse me one cheap potshot, at least you left for something a little better than WoW!) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 07:44, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Mockery
I can't believe you wrote revision 1384240. Please examine your sleep pattern. --◄mendel► 09:33, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, Father Gregor. You seem upset. I do not understand. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:47, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Not upset, just concerned for you. I can't recall you posting text that could be considered mocking (intentional or not), although I must admit I don't know you that long. Your posts are usually more thought-out than that, so I wonder what changed. The only hint I have to what's going on is what you wrote the other day, and the posting times, and the knowledge that sleep deprivation can change a person's personality. --◄mendel► 06:50, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * "Your concern touches me like a dagger, but I am more than capable of handling this situation." I wrote what I wrote in full faith and credit, truthfully and heartfelt, yet you seem to think I was mocking. Whatever.
 * And I'm serious about GuildWiki is becoming too much social networking site, largely because of my own fault. I'm not doing any more references and I am going to try to stay focused on Guild Wars-related issues. Spam--; = gud. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:14, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Sigh. Ok, clarifying again: I do not think that you intended to mock PS360, I wrote that your text came across as such, and that you usually take care that it doesn't especially when you intend to not mock. The "situation" isn't my concern, you are. And my daggers may be blunt, but that means they oughtn't to pierce. Btw, User: is for networking. --◄mendel► 19:43, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I guess we will have to agree to disagree, because even though I re-read it several times before posting I saw no evil. Sleep is for the weak, as Prince Rurik always says. Also, the only reason the userspace exists in terms of networking is to improve communications flow and workplace efficiency towards the mainspace. Wikis are not places to be supersocial and fill up your friends list. Spam is spam.
 * You can argue semantics and stuff, like "how a community needs some sociability, and that is good because it keeps us together", etc, but that gets complicated quickly. The simple truth of the matter is that I spam too much and all these dumb polls and contests are meaningless. But I do them anyway for attention and entertainment. How selfish of me! Such a distraction to other users! Bah. At least it hasn't caused any WikiDrama. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:12, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Enter.. me. -- R [[Image:RPhalange star.png|18px]] Phalange  21:25, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

whole new level?
Nothing new under sun: http://www.google.com/search?q=%22hijacking+to+a+whole+new+level%22 yeah, I'll stop stalking your talkpage. That's what you get for inviting people to research all your potential references. --◄mendel► 09:45, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Ahh, you hijacked my section and parked in my talk page. NO ONE reads my talk page anymore!--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 19:00, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm just that ebil. ^_^ Mendel - you're starting to take this reference thing too seriously, you are actually creating references when I intended none, and you've missed almost all those that I did intend. >.> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:47, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Mendel= negative points?--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 21:08, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Researching the references that you do intend is boring. --◄mendel► 06:50, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The point was to know them without having to look them up. They are all very easily Googled. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:14, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

1337 damage
To get 1337 damage the only way i can see( but i dont have time to try it becuase it'll take insanely long)is to use ebon vanguard sniper support on something with a precise amount of armor. since its a PvE only skill this cannot b done in a scrimmage and must therefore be done via death lvling a pet to the right level to have the right armor such that ebon vanguard sniper support would deal 1337 dmg ( this method might not work but its the only possible one i can think of-Rabus 01:54, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You can also tweak the damage with varying levels of Intensity. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 01:57, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Dropping a charged unstable energy matrix next to the indestructible golem always worked fine for me.--mLegion 17:01, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * In the challenge: "Flux Matrix does not count." Cress Arvein [[Image:Cress sig.JPG]] 17:21, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * ^. Also, RI deals >1500 damage to a naked Frenzyhealsig Warrior. Can't be that hard to tweak it right. Now mashing Prog into tiny bits and pieces :D --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  17:35, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Eat your heart out :) --- -- (s)talkpage  17:47, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Coolness! -- - talk 17:49, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * How much armor did he have in the end? <font face = "Matura MT Script Capitals">Silver Sunlight [[Image:SSunlight.jpg|19px]] 18:58, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * -30 AL. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  19:00, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Omg prO! Nice job. :) These screenshots will live forever. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:14, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

''Fame

I'm gonna live forever

I'm gonna learn how to fly

High

I feel it coming together

People will see me and cry

Fame

I'm gonna make it to heaven

Light up the sky like a flame

Fame

I'm gonna live forever

Baby remember my name ''

If you didn't see THAT one coming ^^ --- -- (s)talkpage  19:23, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I was going to make similar reference but thought against it. In any case, now I am thinking how to make a userbox or icon or t-shirt with it. Merchandising rights. ...Maybe ANet would be interested in selling stuff like this. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:26, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

I've been dum; I've always had a screenie of Leet damage (albeit in a different game) ^^ --- -- (s)talkpage  18:21, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * It's too bad you can't get a Hammer or Scythe with 13-37 base damage. :> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 18:24, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
 * But we can ask Anet for one, could be something similar to candy cane weps.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 06:49, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Sadly, I can imagine them doing that instead of spending time on some more meaningful things... :( It would quickly become one of the most sought after items ever. Especially if they made it a Banana Scythe. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Brooklyn Rage
Note to self: stop making long and thought out posts on Wiki with laptop, where those fecking Forward Page -> and Back Page <- keys are, they will erase your hard work. ''Does anyone know how to disable a key's functionality or change it on the keymap, for Vista? I've lost three posts today.'' X( (T/C) 00:22, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Get Firefox. Its ability to save the edit boxes along with the page and faithfully reproduce it on going forward or backward to it in the history has saved me more than once - especially when the wiki decides it doesn't want to save, I can just hit "back" and re-save. --◄mendel► 00:28, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Also, Joey Punch owns Brooklyn Rage. --[[Image:OrgXSignature.jpg]] 00:32, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I've been told so many times over my GuildWiki career to get FireFox, and I am seriously considering it now. For serious! It was one thing with IE unique bugs. It was another with advertisements. But losing my precious screen time edit count...that is taking it too far! (I'm really quite serious here, I could see myself losing a huge tax return form or something, bad!) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:21, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * You can get MC Hammer to shout "Stop! Hammertime!" everytime you press Esc with Firefox, too. Btw, you need to move this page to an archive, and c/po some conversations back. Cleans out the history tab, so each edit takes less Kbs (it saves every revision again for each revision afterwards. Racks up quickly, I bet). Or /screwWikia and just c/p to an archive. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  09:33, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I have that extension!!!! +archive more plz. <font color="Orange">Random <font color="Black">Time  10:22, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Seriously, why would anyone want to hear MC Hammer all the time. I only use Adblock Plus and NoScript. --[[Image:OrgXSignature.jpg]] 10:25, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Org - use greesemonkey and wikied combo - find and replace makes editing so much easier. <font color="Orange">Random <font color="Black">Time  10:27, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I am going for the first-ever 200kb archive and it's almost there. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 18:10, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Obviously other user's spam archives don't count. Anyway, with FF I just us AdBlock Plus and FireBug, awesome extensions. And yeah, once again, you probably SHOULD switch to Firefox, especially for you since it preserves form data. Like right now, I accidentally hit the back button, but just forward and BOOM it's all back again :) --Gimmethegepgun 18:15, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm curious why you're still using IE anyway. I don't really see a benefit coming from it. --[[Image:OrgXSignature.jpg]] 18:26, 21 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Laziness. Or maybe I have been hit with the Web of Inertia. Or I don't like the layout. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 18:31, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
 * This should overcome the laziness thing. Click this then hit enter a couple times and you should be good :P --Gimmethegepgun 18:34, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Ikki999
(Block log) I find the evidence for this block rather scanty, given that the edits weren't malicious (as far as I can deiscern), the user hadn't been warned that bots would be banned (they weren't in the past, run-amok bots get a short duration ban), and there is no evidence that this is, in fact, a bot. ("Ki" and "Ju" pages had been created with similar code by an anon before, have you checked whether it is the same user?). I would readily accept that it's a malicious bot if those edits have been occuring across several wiki wikis. Without talkpage editing priviledges, what avenue does the user have to protest the ban? --◄mendel► 14:38, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Special:Emailuser/Entropy. IRC. AIM. In-game. But what I'm most worried about with this user is the uploading of an executable - you're not supposed to be able to, and for someone to try would usually indicate they're up to no good.  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 15:24, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Not necessarily. It would have been simple to download the file and scan it, then we would have known for certain. --◄mendel► 17:59, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I have done that, and it did not contain a virus. That doesn't mean it wasn't malware, though.  It is a self-extracting RAR archive.  I found this in the "Comments" tab of the file properties window:

;The comment below contains SFX script commands

Setup=Host.exe Setup=Regedit.exe -s -i Reg.reg Setup=Login.exe Silent=1 Overwrite=1
 * I believe that means that once it finishes extracting, it will automatically run all of the "Setup=" commands, and it will do so silently. Looks like it might be a keylogger or password cracker of some sort.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 18:35, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * ^I don't want to take chances with this kind of thing, hence my actions. If you think that was too extreme, then I'll ask you this: regardless of the duration do you think banning was the proper move? In any case, I have very large doubts that 1) this is a "real" user, based on their contributions and 2) that they would even care that they are blocked, much less protest it. (True bots have no user rights, in any case, as they are not users.) Note that Cress had already banned the user once before for "Inserting nonsene/gibberish into pages". I could as easily justify a ban with a continuation of that (although that would probably result in a much shorter ban ofc). The executable worries me, though. Also I find your "the user hadn't been warned that bots would be banned" statement perplexing. It is already somewhat redundant to tell a vandal or troll that what they are doing is cause for a ban...but bots? It's not possible to "accidentally" run a bot. Moreover, past precedents for what other sysops have done against bots doesn't mean much to me. I ban vandal-bots infinitely. That's my personal prerogative...Even if the bot is doing something benign or nonsensical, there is no reason why it ought to be allowed to edit, since at the very least it creates work for other users (to revert the changes) and spams RC.
 * I will look for those pages/anon, and keep an eye on them. If I see them creating more spam pages in the future, they are getting banned...although I might inform them about the existence of the sandbox first, maybe.
 * Btw, this is not grounds for a "slippery slope" (or whatever you call it argument) that "if you'd ban for this little and this subjective contribs, just think what if a real user...etc etc" if that is where you were heading. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:01, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Mmm. I have reason to believe that those IP(s) plus that user may all be the same, in addition to this latest username. It would be a quite a stretch of coincidence if they are all independent. That's a particular edit that they all make - grab some random image and then make it 17-18px. They are all nonsensical edits. They don't respond to their talkpages. I am not going to do anything about them because that was a while ago and they did not continue the actions...Ikki999 did it more than once, uploaded the executable, and after a warning on talkpage (although it was not explicit about such actions) continued with the nonsensical edits. I know that not everyone checks their talkpages and I know that Felix's post could be read such that it says nothing about doing 18px images etc. But still.
 * In the past I have banned some users/IPs for making similar vandalising contribs, which it was quite apparent it was the same person/group of people. I believe that is fully justified, and this is a similar but more drawn out case. If I start seeing more strange usernames and/or IPs who make 17px edits, I am going to start banning them all with no question as suspected socks. They really aren't sandboxing like edits, I think... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:10, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wait, how the hell did he (it?) upload an exe? Why is that even possible? Common sense says it should probably be disabled as soon as possible. --Macros 22:22, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * For reference, Wikia staff noticeboard, but I see Felix already put that on your talkpage. Wikia is on it. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:29, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * We know it is consensus that unflagged bots shouldn't be run, but that user doesn't. So warning a bot operator that his bot does nonsense, and to please contact the management before running it again seems a natural move on our part. With the IP talk, especially if it's hours later, I'm never sure the user really reads it, so Ikki was the first chance to reliably do so. Possibly the login was needed to do the upload.
 * We are agreed that is doesn't look like sandboxing any more, because the user know knows how to do 18px images :-P. As you point out, some kind of ban is certainly justified, and it's the duration that is in question. And that doesn't matter so much if you can contact the admins. I don't assume that a user wants to chat or can use wikimail, but those gmail addresses work, right? I'm going to recommend that then.
 * Scanning the start.exe with a virus scanning might've been interesting, and so would have extracting it with winzip or winrar or some other extraction utitility - that would avoid the automatic running of the setup. I am unsure if that was an attempt to attack the server - as far as I know, they run a unixoid OS, so a file with no extension would have been more helpful there. As it is, what you wrote makes it more probable that this is malware, but it's not certain yet. --◄mendel► 09:18, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Ah, I hadn't noticed there was supected socking as well. Weird attack pattern. Maybe some other wikia wikis see that, too? --◄mendel► 10:55, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Would need to ask Wikia peoples about that, I can't access that kind of info on other wikis. I might do that if they continue, though...it's sufficiently strange, and the .exe being a security threat in any case I am sure they would take an interest.
 * I still think that a user ought to know that in general, running a bot on the Internet is a forbidden thing, and if nothing else it will get all their changes reverted. I have never seen an example of a "blessed bot" which, for example, randomly corrected spelling errors. That would be very strange, and in that case I'd leave it alone (but warn the user that we'll be keeping an eye on them, since bots could go rogue unexpectedly...). The IPs are most likely proxies as they have just one contribution and have similar address, so leaving a talk there is probably useless. The fact that they created an account after Ikki and performed the same sorts of actions probably means that no matter which user talk you left a note on, they will have moved on by then. You do need to have login to do uploads, although only Ikki uploaded, so...I dunno. My gmail is always available, and it works from the Wikimail link (iirc).
 * Ishmael has a copy of the file so he could probably run any further diagnostics that you think would be interesting. I don't know what exactly its intent was, but I do think that whatever it was, it certainly wasn't meant to be a good thing. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I hadn't thought of opening with WinRAR, so... well. It actually only has one file in it, Reg.reg, unlike the three I'd expected from the SFX script I posted above.  Here are the contents of the file:

Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\GamaSoft\MP-Client] "Folder(P2)"="E:\\Game\\CIB\\RYL2"

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\GamaSoft\MP-Client(MY)] "Folder"="E:\\Game\\CIB\\RYL2" "Width"=dword:00000400 "Height"=dword:00000300 "Depth"=dword:00000010 "GamePort"=dword:00004e22 "DlgControl"=dword:02d7030b "QuickSlot"=dword:02d701cd "Status"=dword:02d70000 "Enchant"=dword:00740000 "Chat"=dword:025e01cd "Vertical"=dword:00000000 "ChatDlgType"=dword:00000001 "VisibleFlag"=dword:0000000d "Adapter"="NVIDIA GeForce 7300 GT" "Refresh"=dword:0000003c "InitValue"=hex:00,04,00,00,00,03,00,00,10,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,\ 00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,\ 00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,88,b7,d4,77 "RenderOption"=hex:00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,09,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,\ 00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,03,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,01,\ 00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,\  00,00,01,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00,00 "SiegeTime"=dword:0001005a "StatusDlgExLv"=dword:00000000 "Folder(P2)"="E:\\Game\\CIB\\RYL2"
 * Looks like it's just some registry keys for the MMO Risk Your Life, which looks like it's just another Korean cookie-cutter. So nothing malicious, but still worthy of deletion.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 02:55, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * ...that makes even less sense than if it was malicious. :\ Maybe it's Korean? But that is a big leap to conclusions which tells us nothing. Although the usernames are kind of foreign sounding. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:58, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Too bad there isn't another clue, like a Korean flag on one of the socks' page. Oh well. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:00, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * D'oh! You're right Felix. One of the images used was Korean Flag 70x40. I remember now. Still I wonder if that is just an extraordinary coincidence. But at least we have a hypothesis now. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:05, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Not to mention the registered usernames: Kimsaejung and HANSAEWOO are definitely Korean transliterations, and Ikki might be (I'm not that familiar with Korean, only had time for Japanese). &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 03:11, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Anyone know what these are? From that game perhaps? (T/C) 03:38, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Lol. It's Sasuke's Sharingan Eye, from Naruto. Surprised you've never seen it before, Naruto's pretty popular last I checked. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  03:45, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * If you didn't actually mean Kakashi, you just spoiled the show for me. Good thing I'll never watch it and never read the manga past the third volume. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:49, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Naruto is popular, but I've never got much into anime. Maybe I can watch the abridged series instead. Anyway, does this help strengthen the Korean Connection? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:51, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Not really. It just means he's a fan of Naruto, I would say. Naruto is a Japanese show, and it wouldn't be any more popular in Korea then it is in America and Japan. Not much connection between the pictures and anything else; I would guess the pictures were planned for use on the person's userpage. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  04:10, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, they are probably copyvios anyway. Oh well. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:15, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Archive Imminent
This has finally hit 200kb so I will be archiving in 72 hours, so please finish any current conversations as soon as you can. I am giving a warning since there is so much conversation on the page. :O (T/C) 22:18, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Is it going to be the biggest archive ever? --[[Image:OrgXSignature.jpg]] 22:20, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Reviews of other possible candidates for biggest archive (PanSola's and Gigathrash's in particular) reveal that it may very well be. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 22:27, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I thought there were some spam archives which were larger. Check Warwick's? (Actually, forget I said that, it's too difficult. How's that template coming? >.>) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:29, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * What about Fyren's? I don't remember what it was at before Tanaric archived it for him. --Macros 22:32, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, nice catch. That one is almost 210kb. I had forgotten about that archive...it was quite epic when Tanaric stepped in and basically said "I'm archiving this because I can" and then he actually does it. Only time, to my knowledge, that a user's talk was forcibly archived by Bcrat. :> Still, you see the amount of headers on that archive? There's 166. That means it is made of many many topics over a long time...August 2006 to March 2007, or ~8months...that is over half a year. My talk page, on the other hand... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:42, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * But thanks to this section, you win anyway. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 22:50, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Ya. If I can do what he can do in ~1 month instead of 8, then logically this talkpage would be 1.6 megabytes if I let it last that long. :> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:59, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The magic word (no need for template) is part of the new MediaWiki parser engine - it was released alongside the old engine in 1.12.  Wikia hasn't forced anyone to switch to the new engine yet, although individual wikis can request it if they want it, but they are going to roll it out to everyone in the near future.  There's a page Special:ParserDiffTest where you can compare the way a page is rendered with the old and new engines (the biggest difference I've seen is that the new engine adds a "class='mw-redirect'" attribute to all links that link to redirect pages, could be useful if we ever wanted to trim our use of internal redirects).  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 22:52, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Hey, could that be used for Forum:Coding?? Also, we have 1.13 now iirc, and I was talking about the magic word/template thing which gives a page's size in bytes, not return the URL or whatever. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 22:59, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Right, Wikia is now on 1.13, I was saying that the new engine was first released in 1.12. And I meant , dunno why I typed "NAME". >.>
 * only refers to the name of the current page, so it wouldn't be of any use in creating "?redirect=no" links from a page. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 23:05, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I was talking of the class='mw-redirect' . [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:08, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Ohhhhh... I see. Yes, that would work.  There's a JS function   whereby you could get all links that had   and rewrite them to include  .  Brilliant!  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 23:25, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * You don't have to archive all topics at once either. You can just selectively archive concluded threads, while leaving newer ones unarchived.  That way you won't have to ask ppl to hurry up and conclude their business. -User:PanSola (talk to the [[Image:follower of Lyssa.png]]) 23:13, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * But then it wouldn't be 200kb. I only see one really active thread here too. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 23:18, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * To preserve attribution, I would recommend moving the whole page, then copy+pasting the active threads back here. I did that once. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 23:49, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

The biggest archive that I know of is User talk:Warwick/Archive 12 with more than half a megabyte. See Special:ParserDiffTest/User:Warwick/Archive size for a list (scroll down to see the rendered version). Entering  in Special:ParserDiffTest gives 216,141 right now. --◄mendel► 10:06, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, why did I try to load that? :( That may be the biggest archive of all time, but seeing as 99% of it is from a million of Warwick's signatures I hardly think that counts. I've got pure content here. :>
 * Theoretically, what would happen if you reached a megabyte...or even a gigabyte...on one page? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I imagine there would be a lot of crying and such, but I don't think you'd get much else. The page would take forever to load, obviously, but I've seen the same thing on image-heavy pages (not just Wiki pages). Of course, it's also possible that Mediawiki, or more likely, the database itself, could have a limit on page size. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  02:49, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * FireTock onced created a megabyte of spam on Gigathrash's talk page. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 02:57, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh yes, the dreaded Spam Pyramid template. However, that no longer exists. I seem to remember that Giga's talk had to be deleted or something because of that. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:05, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * This MIGHT be a record of that; I have no way of knowing for certain, though. Image:It's broken the talk page.jpg. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:42, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wasn't. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:51, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Somewhere on the wiki, there is an image that shows Tock's million-character edit. I know I've seen it. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:54, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I know what image you are talking about but I have no idea where it is. If we knew who uploaded it, or exactly when, or where it was placed, that would help some. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:57, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * As an aside I am surprised that I never banned that guy for being idiat. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:00, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It was not uploaded by Giga evidently, and it did spend some time on someone's userpage. He did get banned at least once iirc. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 04:02, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Only legitimately banned once by Jio for vandalizing Maui's userpage 3x. He got permabans when he was changing usernames "for good" but those were reverted when he flip-flopped. On GWW I am sure he would have gotten more bans, because of spamming. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:05, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You mean this image? Spam King IS an alt of Tock, right? --Gimmethegepgun 04:20, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Gimme wins. And yes, that was his alt for a time. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:23, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yep, I do win :P Reverted that million-byte edit in under 1 minute --Gimmethegepgun 04:24, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

(Reset indent) Our page database is 8GB in XML form. 0.2% is Gigathrash's talkpage (Firetock's spam is a mere 16th of that), and Entropy's now 2-year-old talkpage is 3% - that is the size of our current page database (i.e. the size of all articles on the wiki put together). I measure that by using Special:Export. Actually, the number above is an estimate: the download stopped at 212 MB at 2008-09-15 01:59:45Z, there've been over 250 edits since then, adding 175 kB on average, so we ought to be at somewhat over 256MB. Every 4 edits now add another MB. --◄mendel► 09:34, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * This talkpage has only been here for about a month or two. I'm not sure what you are getting at. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:50, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Well in a sense mendel is right; because you've always archived by copy+paste rather than page moving, your talk page's history spans back to October 2006. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 20:35, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * And this is a problem because...? You realize that I couldn't destroy the history or else every single one of my archives then breaks copyright law, for real. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:36, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It's not a problem, I was just explaining. D: [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 20:38, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * This subthread seems to imply that I should care about the size of my talkpage's history, is all I am saying. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:41, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * It is a problem. With each revision, revisions before that are re-stored. Thus, if you have 10 edits to a page, with each edit 1Kb, you have 1+(1+1)+(1+2)+(1+3)+(1+4)+(1+5)+(1+6)+(1+7)+(1+8)= 45 Kb, rather than 10. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  21:19, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I am unwilling to delete my talkpage just to save Wikia some database space. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 21:53, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * No, all you have to do is archive your talkpage by moving, rather than by copy/pasting. Just move what exists so it doesn't grow any larger.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 22:43, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * But wouldn't it be exciting to see how big we can get it before Entropy is executed by the Wikistapo? [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 22:47, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

(Reset indent) Deleting the page won't work; if it can be undeleted it still is in the database. The following things are beneficial: --◄mendel► 23:20, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Archive early and often. If your page is 32 kB long, it takes 32 edits to reach 1 MB, and not 4.
 * Use move archives more often than once every two years to allow people to grab the full history of the page without a 257 MB downlaod that stops 80% through teh first time you try it.
 * The copyright requirement does not state that every individual edit has to be credited; it is common practice to name the group of creators, i.e. if I was to import your user page into a new wiki, I'd probably first store your ?view=credits display on it, and then overwrite that with the current contents, and although that might be overcrediting, it'd credit every contributor, and thus be legal.
 * Well, let's say I move this page - what does someone do then if they want to check the history of one of the C/P archives?
 * This gets archived tomorrow anyway. It will be the last C/P archive since I guess this is a problem. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:56, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The entire history would be moved along with the page, so it would be viewable entirely intact at User:Entropy/Archive666 or whatever. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 02:58, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Fine, I'll put a notice on all the other archives to look there. Grumble. The only thing which would convince me this mattered was if someone from Wikia complained. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 03:02, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wait, Entropy's talkpage is 256MB, which is roughly the same as every mainspace article combined? W00t, you should keep it going, see if you can get a world record for largest single page on the internet. Strangely, it takes only a few seconds for me to load this page. --Macros 13:36, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Try editing the whole page at once, lol. Anyways, the largest page on the Intarwebs is probably a few gigs if not Tbs :P Longest page is a few hundred miles. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:07, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Biggest wiki page then? C'mon, we have to give Entropy something. --Macros 15:06, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Special:Ipblocklist
Maybe I just do not get the concept, but could someone explain to me why some our users show up in this log with very strange names? Like LordBiro becomes "Motorcitymagic", and RT becomes "CrazyHand"? (I realize that this is a new conversation so I will extend the archive date 24 more hours...) (T/C) 05:50, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I do not think it is supposed to do that. It only does it to blocks made before may. WTF?  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 06:22, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * An intriguing mistery indeed...[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 06:52, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * LOL @ "Usuck.com blocked MP47." It seems like the system got hacked or something.--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 21:36, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I noticed this a while back, and this was Kyle's answer. Say I was User #32197; when we moved into wikia, I wasn't #32197 anymore, I was #124634. Therefore, any blocks performed by me since before the wikia move are now given the name of the user with #32197, not my own. For example, I am fairly confident Entropy is Ares, though her username is most assuredly not Ares. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest  21:42, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * So, Entropy is the greek goddess of war, Wow! And you figured that out by looking at the Ipblocklist...Amazing! I'll go watch RC and see what I can learn.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]<strong style="color: black;">reanor 21:52, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Well that solves the mystery. Thanks Shadowcrest! [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

running a bot on the Internet is a forbidden thing
Since when? You usually run a bot on your machine, and there's no difference between a program that you write yourself that accesses the net from a program somebody else wrote. --◄mendel► 09:02, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't understand your statements. I don't run bots on the Internet. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:55, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It was a general "you", i.e. meaning "people". People don't run a bot "on the internet", they run a bot on a computer connected to the internet, and if it's your computer, it is perfectly legal. (There is no legal distinction between a bot you wrote yourself and Internet Explorer). "Botnets" aren't legal because the computer owners are usually unaware that their computer receives commands from elsewhere to send spam or do a DoS attack. --◄mendel► 23:20, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Technicalities. If I run a vandal-bot on my computer and I am connected to the internet, and I am using it to vandalize GuildWiki, I don't care what U.S. law says is legal or not legal about that. I'd get banned and no excuse has to be given. Vandalism is vandalism. Even if you're not being explicitly malicious, a truly automated bot can hardly be a "user", and thus they don't deserve the same rights as a real person, etc etc.
 * How is Internet Explorer a bot?
 * I highly doubt the current attacks have been due to undetected malware etc. which runs on some person computer's somewhere. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:56, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Exuberance!
--Gimmethegepgun 17:30, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * : D Cress Arvein [[Image:Cress sig.JPG]] 18:21, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
 * If I ever meet him, I'll Ctrl + Alt + Del him.
 * ...no really, I have issues with 12 year olds playing GTA for example...however I firmly believe that it is the PARENT'S responsibility, not the government's, to keep these things in check. If you can't be arsed to do the research and check what your own kids are playing, then you have no right to infringe on many millions others' happiness by demanding video game laws/bans/etc. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 19:54, 26 September 2008 (UTC)