Talk:Zaishen Coin

Disambig
I'm not sure I like this being a disambig page. I'd rather see it as a summary type article describing all 3 types of coins, where they can be obtained, who collects them, and what the conversions are. I already added the last as notes. Currently you have to go to each coin's article to find that info, and usually you'll be visiting more than one, if you need to know how far you are from getting the item you want, and do the math on conversions, since you always start with copper. And the article names themselves are a pain to type out, I redirected Zcoin here, making it easy to find time and time again, and a perfect place for a quick reference type page. Any thoughts? Objections? RoseOfKali 05:06, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Agree, how, what and why about the Zaishen Coins can be explained here, explaining how to get them and what collectors want them, instead of keeping this on each seperate page...-- [[Image:merty_sign.gif]]-- ( talk ) 07:21, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Value of Zoins
I did some quick computations to compare the value of the 3 types of zoins to each other and to trade values. (See picture.)   &mdash; Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 19:31, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

Observations

 * at 31.7g/zoin, Heavy Kit Packs are the most expensive item by a factor of 3
 * at 9.5g/zoin, Perfect Salvage Kits are a great deal (to use or sell) (unless you want a kit pack)
 * at < 5.0g/zoin, scrolls and title points are the worst deals

Computation

 * 1 Zoin = Copper Zaishen Coin
 * [gp] &amp; [Cu] = net gold &amp; zoins (converting to Silver (Ag) or Gold (Au))
 * Buy/Sell = merch values
 * Trade = average(Buy, Sell) OR average(common WTB, WTS) OR average(recent gwauctions.org)
 * Implied Trade Cu = (Trade Value - [gp])/[Cu] AKA zoin value after [gp] costs
 * colors =  worst (red) @2.8/zoin – best (green) @9.5g/zoin , midpoint (yellow) @4.7g/zoin

Examples

 * HEP cost 7500 zoins + 2350 and trade for around 240 → (240k-2.35k)/7500zoin = 31.7 /zoin
 * Urgoz scrolls are WTB 100/WTS 200 at merch and cost 50 copper + 10 → (150-10)/50 = 2.8/zoin

Comments
&mdash; Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 19:31, 4 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Nicely done! Didn't bother getting into all your computations and conversions, but the end result is: get HEPs until you have one on every character, every mule, and then sell the rest (yeah, right, maybe in a decade ^_^). :P Good to know what's worth it and what isn't.  Thanks! RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.png]] 22:38, 4 June 2009 (UTC)


 * The value of equipment packs may fall with time, once most of the players who care have what they want. Quizzical 22:43, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, but it'll be a while before they drop 2/3 of their value. And what's with the DIV/0's?  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.png]] 23:04, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
 * ah, glad you are reviewing :-) I don't have trade data on those items, so can't compute an average value.  &mdash; Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 23:24, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Flame of Balthazar is 1k faction. 5k faction = zkey = 4k.  FoB = 800g.  1k faction can also be used to unlock a skill, when skill tomes are avg 600g, and skills are 1k from trainer, which again leads to 800g avg, so it seems like a reasonable estimate for something that's never traded (not that I've seen, anyway).  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.png]] 01:36, 5 June 2009 (UTC)


 * FoB 800. ty -> translates to about 7.3/zoin (pretty good for non-kit packs).
 * btw: at gwauctions, normal tomes seem to be selling for < 400g each.  &mdash; Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 02:40, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Really depends on profession. Most people still charge high for Mo/E/N/Rt tomes, Me/A are cheapest at like 200g a piece.  But I've only seen in-game, don't shop on sites.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.png]] 04:06, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Zoin
Why would anyone use this as a shortened version of Zaishen coin? It's such a moronic abbreviation. No other Zaishen anything is shortened like this; everything else is zwhatever (zchest and zkey to name a few). Why would you remove the "c" from zcoin? Have you ever said it out loud? It's ridiculous. It's like calling blinding surge "burge," primal rage "page," or mending touch "mouch;" it's stupidity in word form. (Talk) 03:29, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Because the zchest is the zest.--Łô√ë [[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg|Roar.]]îğá†ħŕášħ 03:36, 22 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I guess I'm a moron (I suspected as much already; it's nice to have confirmation of same :-). I like short, silly, shrunk pet-names for things in the game. Why use the bi-syllabic, z-coin when a single syllable will do? Why spend 5 letters when 4 will do? (and one wants to reduce before reusing or recycling).
 * Zaishen Coin: Zoin
 * Zaishen Mission: Zish (doubly moronic, contracting the already contracted, Zaishen Mish)
 * Zaishen Bounty: Zounty
 * Zaishen Combat: Zombat
 * None of which improves upon my favorite, non-Zaishen moronity: Going Postal (for leaving pre-Searing Ascalon). With tongue-in-check and no apologies,  &mdash; Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 04:59, 22 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Zombat sounds like it should be an amalgam of zombie and bat. Quizzical 05:03, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
 * People actually do call Primal Rage "prage" and Blinding Surge "bsurge." [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 05:20, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Zombie bats to you, zombie wombats to me. RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.png]] 16:33, 22 June 2009 (UTC)


 * There's a difference between 'pee-rage' and 'prage', though, and I haven't heard prage at all (same goes for Bee-surge).
 * Zombie wombat.. Zwombat.. Zwembad? --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]] -- (contribs) &emsp;(talk)  16:45, 22 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I've seen prage and bsurge quite a lot, and I don't even play GvG or HA where they're used most.--[[Image:El Nazgir sig.png|Talkpage]]El_Nazgir 16:49, 22 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I meant on voice chat :P Felix either misread Page and Burge, or he meant voice chat. For his sake, I hope it was the former :) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]] -- (contribs) &emsp;(talk)  16:55, 22 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Right. Take the word "absurd". Remove the "a", leaving "bsurd". Bsurge is pronounced in a very similar way. -- Snog  rat  17:28, 22 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Take the phrase, zen koan, and remove the Z, E, K, O, A, and two Ns; you're left with  &mdash; Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 21:01, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Remove F, not E, to get &mdash; . -- ◄mendel► 21:26, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
 * A bit late to respond perhaps, but I was giving other examples of people using a first letter of one word and then the full word in an abbreviation. Thus, zCoin, rather than zoin should follow from Zaishen coin; since prage follows from primal rage rather than "page," and bsurge follows from blinding surge rather than "burge." Further, zmission, zcombat, zbounty, zquest, zcoin, zkey, zchest, etc. should follow from zaishen ____, rather than z + ____ - the first letter of ____. [[Image:Entropic.png]] (Talk) 00:36, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Never too late to join in the fun :-) I took your point; I don't happen to agree. I like the zound of zoin better than zcoin; it runs more trippingly on the tongue or keyboard IMO. ( I hesitate to point out that many might find the initial comment as going beyond giving examples of consistent zaishen alternatives. It contains value-laden terms (not once, but thrice) about a choice made by fellow players and wikians. )  &mdash; Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 18:17, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Let us just be grateful that these quests, etc., were given to the Zaishen and not the Xunlai, eh? -- Snog  rat  18:26, 23 June 2009 (UTC)