Talk:Guild Wars Eye of the North

The froggeth speaks
http://img182.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chat3sz6.jpg

Interesting, we have not seen the end of Gwen

Thorton 10:59, 18 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Hairdressers FTW! I want to change a hairstyle for my necro. Because long hair cover his Vabbian scar completely... So sad. fR0z3n.S0u1 06:54, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
 * OMFG YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! &mdash; JediRogue  [[Image:JediRogueSig.jpg]] (talk |contribs) 15:54, 14 May 2007 (CDT)

I'm scared now. She might bring the Spontaneous Combustion back... -X H K

Norns? Isn't that a copyright breach?
The Norns are a race of villains in the Tad Williams quartet (trilogy in hardback) Memory, Sorrow and Thorn, also known as the Hikeda'ya. If that isn't a copyright breach then maybe the game will take place in Russia: I have seen the river Syr Darya spelt as Syrdar'ya; which coincidentally is almost homophonic to Zida'ya, the Norns' enemies in Memory, Sorrow and Thorn. (I may be wrong in some places) &mdash; Ebany Salmonderiel (Talk) [ Leave a note] 12:48, 19 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Sorry wats norns and all that got to do with guildwars? Jupsto [[image:Feck_Off.jpg|19px]] 12:50, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
 * @Jupsto - An article in the Inquirer referenced "Guild Wars 2" as having playable races, one of which would be called "Norns". However, ArenaNet has stated that some in that article is true, some is false, and much is misleading ... so waiting for more confirmation from PC Gamer magazine.
 * @Ebany - See also Norns, Norn (Creatures), and Norns in popular culture. The name is used in many places, so copyright issues shouldn't be a concern. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 13:04, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Gee Thanks Superman. Jupsto [[image:Feck_Off.jpg|19px]] 13:11, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Thanks for explaining that, Barek. &mdash;[[Image:Alert.PNG]] Ebany Salmonderiel (Talk) [ Leave a note] 13:38, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Actually, I think it would only be a copyright infringement if they stole the story or culture of these other fantasy creatures. The name itself would fall under trademark law and even then the other IP owners would have to show losses from use by GW in order to sue. --Trekie9001 18:45, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Norn is a mythological name. Unless anyone who has been dead for centuries plans on suing Anet, Norns are fully available for free use. - Sunyavadin 03:09, 22 March 2007 (GMT)
 * Indeed. I believe The Norns are the spinners of fate, who weave the destinies of mankind in their web-like tapestries. (Re: Norse mythology, from what I can remember.) - [[Image:Order of the Vampire.jpg|12px]] Threll 20:47, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I hope it's Norn. I have Creatures SOMEWHERE.  I <3 that, especially when you could teach them to swear (Like, when you wave a lemon in front of them, don't say lemon, say shit!)! &mdash;[[Image:BlastThatT.jpg]]Blastedt 20:49, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Norns are from norse mythology

The norns are, yes, from Norse Mythology. They are the three beings who tend the tree that is the world, and are said to create each persons destiny. They will also decide when Ragnarok, the end of the world, is. --Runar Funtime 00:17, 30 May 2007 (CDT)

September 1?
On Play.com, if you search Guild Wars, you will see "CAmpaign Four" and it said that it will be released in September 1, 2007... --Swift Thief 22:15, 19 March 2007 (CDT)


 * According to the links above, Play.com are tricksy hobbitses. -- Dashface [[Image:Dashface.png]] 00:38, 20 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Retailers often come up with the weirdest of realease dates. When they add a product to their system they must include a release date, but as no official date has been announced, they just randomize a day. :) --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 05:38, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

"...Eye of the North, set to hit this holiday..." (quoting Kotaku, http://kotaku.com/gaming/feature/feature-guild-wars-2-gw-expansion-unveiled-244666.php) - anyone has an idea, WHICH holiday is that? fR0z3n.S0u1 01:39, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

It was "hollyday season" if they ment winter hollydays then under you xmass tree instead of new sweater will be GWEN. Biz 02:02, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Hopefully not... or they mean 8 more months of waiting? /doh fR0z3n.S0u1 01:15, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

EYE OF THE NORTH CONFIRMED!
This is VERY early information from people who just got done reading the info

" Sorry for the delay, had to run for a few mins.

Eye of the north is CONFIRMED. GW2 is CONFIRMED!

Just what I remember from reading through once: Gwen is in eye of the north. Eotn is an expansion due 'holiday' time, and will be cheaper. There will be three 'Acts' taking you through different sections (underground network of catacombs, Charr homeland, Maguuma area, Shiverpeaks).

There was a hint at carrying over characters to GW2, but it also stated they take place hundreds of years apart, so...

GW2 will, again, be no subscription fees, but [unfortunately], will have a severly raised level cap (read 100+ or uncapped). Fully instanced worlds will take a back-seat to open areas supporting hundreds of people.

I apologize for this being kind of rushed, but I am in the process of reading it a second time, and summarizing it better. Stay Tuned"

Will update as time passes.

PROOF THAT HE DOES HAVE THE MAGAZINE IS HERE, HE HAS THE MINI!

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10125206&page=15

Thorton 17:12, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
 * \o/ GW became WoW! Hip hip hurrah! Can we have mounts now? --Dirigible 17:16, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

MORE INFO!

Summary:

They are abandoning the Campaign format because it required them to reinvent GW completely for every chapter, and it began to feel 'bloated' to them. The Expansion, and increased timeframe, allow them to do what they want to with the game, without worrying about new professions, or pre-lvl20 content

BETA for GW2 in 2008

eye of the north HOLIDAY 2007 RELEASE

40 new armor sets, 150 new skills (including 50 pve only), 10 new heroes

"extend character development beyond level 20" ~James Phinney~

EOTN will supposedly link GW1 and 2

underground complex of tunnels through all three 'continents' present thus far is revealed.

Three acts: Act1 takes you through 18 underground dungeons to help the dwarves defend against 'the fiery Destroyer', eventually taking you to the Asura and Norns (races) Act2 has three story arcs ranging from exploring the Norns, to the Charr homeland, to an Asura resistance of the Destroyer Act3 pits you against the Great Destroyer

Far shiverpeaks are Norn Lands, Charr homeland is north of ascalon, Asurans are near Maguuma, Tyrian catacombs stretch across the entire continent presumably

GWEN

Thorton 17:29, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

So, GW is now like a regular MMORPG? That sucks. In either case, I want PvP weekend. I forsee it end of this month/beginning of next.--Nog64Talk 17:31, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

&rarr; moved to talk:Guild Wars 2


 * From GWW:EN talk page, *whispers* Gwen escaped the Searing, leaving behind her tattered cape and broken flute, travelled north, grew into a young woman trained in the ways of one of the new classes, and will become a staple of the expansion's storyline. :p — Gares 14:18, 13 March 2007 (EDT) Anyone want to bet platinum that I called it before the release of this newfound information? :p &mdash; Gares 11:32, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * I'm n ot in the mood to bet, but I noticed two things from the photo. 1) Gwen has blonde hair. That photo shows jet black hair. 2) The girl has a small flower in her hair. Hmmmm. Also, have we met any other girls in Pre-searing prophecies? Nhnowell 22:32, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Blonde? I really don't think this counts as blonde: THIS and THIS look dark brown to me. -Sunyavadin 03:39, 22 March 2007 (GMT)


 * My bad, I could've sworn she was blonde, but I did that by memory.

I´m just posting to register that finally, the only lie was from ArenaNet, very dissapointed with the enterprise sell magazines objective. Now is impossible to trust in their communication. The King Arthur 23:57, 25 March 2007 (CDT)


 * They were a whole year off for the GW2 timeframe, and they were wrong about there definitely being a level cap (PC Gamer says a level cap of 100 or no level cap are the most likely possibilities). Anyway, ANet may not have been able to say anything other than the abiguous statement about the article being partially correct, partially incorrect and partially misleading prior to the publication without violating an exclusivity agreement. -- Gordon Ecker 01:49, 26 March 2007 (CDT)

To Include or Not?
Would the information from PCGamer count as official, since Arena Net most likely gave them the information? If so, it should be added to the article. --User:Albinobird 22:10, 20 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Yes, they're an official media partner. Be sure to paraphrase rather than directly quoting. -- Gordon Ecker 22:37, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Someone else would have to add the information then, since I do not have a copy of PCGamer yet. --User:Albinobird[[Image:Albinobirdsigicon.JPG|Albinobird]] 22:40, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

PC Gamer Content
A more complete documentation can be currently found at this link: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2648062

The different races (with pics) and story overview
(This is from GWO, but since their forums require registration to read, copying it here for everyone's convenience.)

Sylvari Characteristics:Naive, curious, gifted Words to live by:"Seize the moment." A young race of nature spirits who have awakened with the rise of a new age in Tyria, Sylvari are beings of light, as yet uncorrupted by knowledge of sorrow, suspicion, or hatred. Sylvari are proficient in things related to magic and dexterity, with a supernatural connection to plants and other an innate empathic bond to each other.

Asura Characteristics:Inventive, condescending Words to live by:"We're smarter than you." A diminutive race from the depths of Tyria, Asura wish to expand their empire to the surface world. Exceptionally intelligent and techinically minded, they use magical skills, stone, and metalworking to create weapons. Asura believe they are destined to rule the world, with the larger, less intelligent races as their subjects.

Charr Characteristics:Fierce, opportunistic, proud Words to live by:"Victory at any cost." A savage race of sentient beasts, the Charr will use any means avilable to destory their enemies: an ambush is as honorable as a fair fight, as victory is what matters. Though Charr have no concept of mercy, they can be protective of those within their tribe.

Norn Characteristics:Individualistic, stubborn, unrefined Words to live by:"Strength above all." A race of shape-shifting half-giants from the north, the Norn value personal strength, victory, and purifying the soul through battle. They revere the spirits of animals and call on them like shamans. Norn can access a skill that changes them into a half-Norn/half-bear, with increased health and melee damage.

Story: EotN's story expands on a storyline alluded to in Prophecies: The Great Dwarf, the patron god of all dwarves in the Guild Wars universe, opposes the Great Destroyer, an entity so fearsome, his name is forbidden to be spoken among the Dwarves. In Eye of the North, you meet and confront the Great Destroyer.

''In the first act, earthquakes reveal the Asuran tunnels below Tyria (the planet, not the continent) and these lead down to the Asuran empire below the earth. There you find out that the Asura are fighting against the Great Destroyer. You go with them, apparently through a magical gate, and meet the Norn. It also says "We're told you will encounter some 'suprises and a few familiar faces' " along the way. So, once you get to Norn-land (my term, not their's), you find out that the Dwarves are gearing up to fight off the Great Destroyer.''

''In the second act, you learn more about the Norn culture, and end up in Northern Ascalon, in (drumroll) the Charr homeland! The Charr homeland looks like Pre-Searing Ascalon, and is not seared like heartland Ascalon. The Charr are unravelling. They are in civil war, and are suffering from the loss of the Titans as their gods. You also learn that the Asura are preparing to fight the Great Destroyer using "their own brand of supermagic".''

In the third act, we finally meet and fight the Great Destroyer.--Dirigible 06:16, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Charr homeland, that looks like Pre-Searing Ascalon? I'm already loving this expansion :) --Deadly Lollipop 06:37, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Brilliant, especially if we might have a 40 mission long campaign to cover all this. Edwina Elbert 10:50, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * The Norn and Sylvari concept art reminds me of the style of Tony DiTerlizzi. -- Gordon Ecker 18:34, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Theory: In EotN, we're going to have 5 playable races. There are 5 gods (excluding the whole Abbadon/Kormir stuff, people worship Five Gods). Maybe each race has its own unique abilities based on those of one of the gods. The Sylvarians have the whole nature spirit vibes going on, like Melandru. The Charr are very warlike, like Balthazar. The Norns are shape-shifting, which seems like the whole illusion thing Lyssa has going on. The Asurans are "under" the world like Grenth is, and they're very clever and planning like Grenth, too. The humans help each other out, like Dwayna. Maybe it's just purely coincidence with ANet trying to diversify everything, but maybe I'm on to something.....Nhnowell 20:22, 25 March 2007 (CDT)

@Nhnowell: In GW:EN we will ONLY SEE the other races. They will not be playable. They will be playable in GW2 though. That is... 1-2years from now? Long way but still... what can we do. It is a whole new game after all. prism2525 17:30, 09 April 2007 (GMT+1)

Important headline
Click here. Enjoy the read.--Dirigible 15:29, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Nothing to read :P &mdash; Skuld 15:57, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * /Rage! Give me a min, I'll upload them somewhere else. --Dirigible 16:01, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * This one should work. For some reason Imageshack has ordered them backwards, so might want to start with the last picture. --Dirigible 16:24, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

Most MMORPG's with races give a much more diverse range, if less original. This seems quite original but only 4 races and they seem to be like proffesions also. seems tad limiting. I reckon each expansions will add a race or something, like how before they added proffesions. Jupsto 16:06, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * sylvians = elf like ranger?
 * asuarians = alien/gnome like mages?
 * charr = bestial warriors
 * Norn = celtic druid/warriors. (beorn anyone?)
 * Don't forget humans...--Swift Thief 16:25, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * OH yeah, monks pherhaps? Jupsto [[image:Feck_Off.jpg|19px]] 16:31, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Read the text above those race illustrations on page 30: "A Guide to some of Guild Wars 2's playable races." It says some. And later it explains that A-NET is not telling the exact number of playable races yet, but they're giving us some info on a few of them.


 * This seems to suggest more than 4 playable races, maybe much more... --Deadly Lollipop 19:04, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Also remember that in Prophecies, the Charr you encountered comprised all 6 available professions - you had Charr Axe Warriors, Charr Hunters, Charr Shamans, Charr Mind Sparks, Charr Ash Walkers, and Charr Flame Wielders. In fact, there are very few races in all of GW that are restricted to only one or two classes (hydras being one).  There's no reason that any of these new races will be class-restricted.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] (talk|contribs) 22:06, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * In case you are interested, reproducing the magazine article (ie. scanning it) is a copyright violation. Just a heads up... --[[Image:SmallMapleLeaf.jpg|19px|User:ImbrilShadowfire]] Imbril Shadowfire  23:37, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

Maybe if we put "only read this in case you have a pc gamer subscription" ? :P –Ichigo724 23:51, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

I suppose you could remove it, but it's always there in history. Mods in Guru have been vigilant in removing links. I read it, but I'll be buying the magazine anyway. I want a mini! LoL 132.203.83.38 16:13, 23 March 2007 (CDT)

Well, according to some person on GW Guru, the UK PC Gamer has reached him :) Anyone here got it too ? -- Torins (talk) 15:08, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

On GameAmp there's an article with quotes in the forums. Just search Confirmed, and you'll find it. Also, the Norn do seem like Beorn/Laguz...

/rage
That plot looks crap. Also, 10 new heroes, FIFTY new pve skills, and no new profs!!!! :( &mdash;Blastedt 17:25, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * It's an expansion not a campaign. Remember that we are getting a totally free large update soon. The hard mode. All areas in the game are getting a suplicate version with harder monsters and better loot. Besides, the GW:EN looks great to me in all ways. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 17:33, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Fully agreed. And the no new professions thing is a very positive thing for me. --Dirigible 17:38, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * It not a stand alone game and optional but is the only bridge to GW2 so it’s always up to you either you wish to buy it or not. More professions isn’t always better, new professions after core were something of combinations of current professions whit a slightly different twist, about when they got to paragon ideas dyed up entirely they, end up making near exact copy of tactics based warrior whit a spear. Besides they sed themselves they can’t be bothered making up new professions and rookie areas every 6 months, how ever fresh high level content isn’t as straining to-do. Three Campaigns in Hard Mode and one expansion will have to hold for 2 years, off course upgrades will be common but probably limited. Now that you know that only Greens and Titles will be transferred you might as well work on them. Biz 17:54, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

This really angerd me, jsut as Factions almsot toally diregarded the PvE portion of the game and thus was a crappy game, this game seems to totally disregard the PvP portion of a game and also looks crappy. I wasn't expecting much better from the idiots that made Factions though. I sure as hell won't be playing this game unless I can somehow snag it for free.--68.192.188.142 17:58, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Immediate UAX... A GvG-like PvP mode that'll exist completely separate from the rest of the game (it'll actually be mantained by a dedicated team that has as focus only this mode, and not World PvP or PvE)... No more piles of professions and skills being thrown at the game every six months... How is that not catering to the PvP crowd? True, we'll have to see how that'll actually be implemented, but to say that they're not making an effort is to be completely unfair. --Dirigible 18:09, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

Yeah, it will be like Factions, except GW is a PvP GAME. This, to me, seems like a really disaterous move by ANet. It ruins everything original about GW. There will be some new cool things, but they really f'ed it up. I was hoping for Nightfall after Nightfall for expansions, not this. In other new regarding to rage, RATM is getting back together :P. I really hope they play at Lollapalooza, maybe settle my mind on this.--Nog64Talk 18:05, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

Guild wars is not a pvp game.... That may be one of its best features but everyone under rates the pve part. Contrary to popular belief factions was a decent pve addition with 2 elite missions, 2 warring nations that you could choose sides on both the PVP and PVE side of game, and a decent story line. Nightfall PVE was a bit of dissapointment IMO but that doesn't matter. Not everyone in the game likes the PVP part of it only like many regulars on this site do, so if they dont make a expansion adding a bunch of stuff for the pvp(which you don't know for sure) then don't complain, great changes to the game doesn't help the established PVP player system so what are you complaining about if it will be focused on PVE?-Counter Rant--Sefre  18:57, 21 March 2007 (CDT)]

I and many other bought GW purely for PvP. Yeah we'll dabble with PvE occasionally. But the PvE in GW isn't unique, try starwars:kotor ot many other rpgs, or better ones like oblivion. GW's PvP is the best, if you want storylines n stuff there are way better games for it, out there, basically. Jupsto 19:12, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * I only play the PvE of Guild Wars andenjoy it. It is unique, there is no game with similiar PvE system, and I appen to like this one. It's not the storyline, it's the game mechanics. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 19:15, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Jupsto's comment is proof of my point, the PVP element is not the only element in the game, and many would argue that it's not the best either, just because it has one of the best pvp systems out there does not mean that the res of game deserves to be over looked, like gem said, its PVE is unique, and just cause you don't play it a lot doesn't mean it sucks or its like other games....--Sefre  [[Image:Sefresig.jpg|15px|]] 19:22, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, in terms of PvE, I find the find the terrible storylines and huge amounts of instances cripplingly inferior to WoW and any other pay game, but if adjusted for no cost per month, it's obviously good. That being said, the PvP outshines any MMORPG to date, pay or not, and for that reason, many consider it a PvP game.--Nog64Talk [[Image:Yaaaay.JPG]] 19:49, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * I agree with nog. I dont have that many games with simular style, but try starwars:knight of the old republic. The PvE is also very different in some ways, but it is identical in others. And IMO the storylines in GW are quite un-interesting, the storylines in Kotor are like better than those in starwars films. Of course GW PvE is unique in some ways, but many rpg's are better or at least comparable. GW PvP isn't really simular to anything and is very unique. It's like a sexy fussion between games like counterstrike, which you can just log in and start killing, and interesting, complicated rpg combat, Ie magic etc. not boring guns. A-net are simply the best for insisting no monthly costs, the are changing the future of MMO's for us all. Worth buying just for that. --Hey hey asuras = yoda, anyone? I think GW2 looks like the best game ever, but EotN looks pretty tird since i'm a pvp fan, but the pve in GW2 looks like its vastly improved Jupsto [[image:Feck_Off.jpg|19px]] 20:04, 21 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Okay, let's stop this PvP vs. PvE and GW vs. other games discussion allready. Stay on topic. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 20:04, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

To what Dirigible said, I competely agree. The easiest things to come up with are new melee professions, and melee professions area getting really old. If you look at what some people come up with for new casters, it's mostly tired boring over-used concepts. Heck, I don't think we need more then the six core professions. 24.6.206.115 07:48, 23 March 2007 (CDT)


 * It's probalby because the "warrior" is just so... all-encompassing. I'll bet you a hundred billion ectos that they'll change how the "warrior" archetype works in GW2 so there are multiple melee professions who specialise in different types of equipment. 132.203.83.38 16:15, 23 March 2007 (CDT)


 * All the professions are. Every one of them has a job that they do well. Even our most exotic profession, the Mesmer, has a role in the game. The four new professions all mimic tasks that the six core professions were already able to do, just differen't. Assassins are just more mobile versions of a Deep-Wound Axe Spiker, Ritualists are just a different way to do lighning damage, and an indirect way to Prot. Dervishes are tanks, but with lower armor and better self heals, and Paragons are pretty much just support, but not fleshy. Alt F Four 20:39, 23 March 2007 (CDT)


 * It's already been revealed that Guild Wars 2 will have a lower profession count, I suspect that the Guild Wars 2 professions will have broader concepts with more attributes to specialise in. Scythes and Polearms will probably go to Warriors, while daggers, spears and brawling weapons (such as claws or brass knuckles) could go to either Warriors or Rangers, Ranger is probably to get any non-spear ranged weapons. I think they'll probably trim the caster count down to 4 (probably merging Ritualist and Necromancer, with the leftover fragments going to other professions), however it's also possible that they'll merge them into 1 to 3 really broad, diverse professions (like D&D's Cleric and Wizard, Dungeon Siege's Combat Mage and Nature Mage, Final Fantasy's Black Mage and White Mage, Diablo 1's Sorcerer or World of Warcraft's 3 pure caster professions of Mage, Priest and Warlock), although I don't think it's likely. The support aspects of Paragons will probably get absorbed by Warriors, Monks, Mesmers or a combination of the above. I can also see Assassin and Dervish getting merged into some melee / caster hybrid martial artist profession (which was the original Dervish concept back when it was a proposed Factions profession). -- Gordon Ecker 00:47, 24 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Oh god no. 3 professions only? No thanks! Sounds feasible for PvE but definately not for PvP! By the way, where did you get the info that there are less professions in GW2? 132.203.83.38 09:00, 24 March 2007 (CDT)


 * 3 professions is rediculously unlikely, I'm just saying that it's theoretically possible (as is dropping professions altogether, although it's been confirmed that GW2 will have professions). I suspect 5 to 7 professions, with no non-core professions. As for the profession count, I remembered things wrong, the PC Gamer article contains no explicit statement on the profession count in Guild Wars 2, I interpreted the article as implying a lower profession count, but that's it. -- Gordon Ecker 21:34, 24 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Where did you get 3 professions ? =) We know there will be 5 races including human one or more. Thats it, nothing or very little as mentioned about eaither every race is its own "profession" or if all races will have all professions, like Charr has rangers, wars, necros, eles and monks. Biz 01:25, 25 March 2007 (CDT)


 * The part about 3 professions was just an example of how far they could go if they decided to boil the professions down into a few broad archetypes. For all we know, Guild Wars 2 could have more than 10 professions, but the general tone of the article makes it sound like the count will be probably be 10 or less. I'm pretty sure Guild Wars 2 won't narrow the Warrior concept to only one or two weapon types as an anonymous poster suggested earlier. -- Gordon Ecker 02:06, 25 March 2007 (CDT)


 * I think the opposite is more likely, that Guild Wars 2 will deal with redundancy issues by introducing a single "Melee Weapon" attribute for Warriors. And my impression is that each character will receive one or two bonus skills unique to their race in addition to whatever they would normally receive from their primary and secondary classes.  I doubt ArenaNet would shut down access to a class simply because you picked the "wrong" race at character creation -- that's inconsistent with the way they have structured Guild Wars to date.  -- Tansor 16:18, 26 March 2007 (CDT)


 * The really nice thing about that option is that they could add new weapons like flails, polearms and throwing knives without interfering with the attributes. -- Gordon Ecker 17:38, 26 March 2007 (CDT)

50 pve ONLY and more pvp+pve

The racial skills are almost entirely confirmed by gaile or someone, but I forgot where I saw it. One expample: Norn shapesfhiting. I hope they have less professions with more attributes and a heck of a lot more attribute levels, say up to lvl 50 instead of 12. I thought sin and ritualist were good ideas, and dervish and paragon were ok. Paragon should be merged into a healer type thing. I think that they should personally destroy the monk idea and give everyone some self heals, with that paragon-monk hybrid I mentioned before acting as a healer and supporter that still can attack pretty well. Not a Paladin (like in WoW), but something cooler... Alreajk 20:26, 15 April 2007 (CDT)


 * Thats GW2 isnt it? Simply having attribute "50" instead of "12" will not make it ~5 times stronger, just a greater number, same for higher levels being level 100 in GW2 doesnt mean you will be stronger then level 20 in GW1 =D
 * Anyways, IF you really think about it, what sets professions apart is Apearence, Armour and Primory attribute, looks will change when armour changes, so first and second can be scraped, primory attribute might not even exist in GW2... so there is nothing that stops them from simply making peepl choose armour over different professions. Biz 02:54, 16 April 2007 (CDT)

Titles?
Wondering if there will be any new titles available in EoTN. On the face of it it looks like some long standing regulars might not even be included: Could you see yourself being called "Protector of The Eye of the North"? Similarly, the Cartographer titles would be awfully cumbersome too. Granted, these were always tied to a continent and not a campaign name, but with the many disparate locations being mentioned I do not know what you'd end up 'protecting' or 'cartographer-ing'136.8.1.100 09:54, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * There will be both new missions and areas to explore in EoTN, and as such it seems logical to assume that there will be Protector and Cartographer title for that expansion too. --Dirigible 10:02, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * ERROR...Logic Does Not Compute...ERROR. Sorry Mr. Spock, but there is not a single instance where sub-terrainian locations have counted towards Explo. So what we're left with are far-flung bits of Tyria. Already have the max title for Tyria.196.207.47.60 11:02, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * They don't need to say "Protector of The Eye of the North"... they can very easily make up something, (completely made up example: "Protector/Cartographer of the Lost Lands") which would cover these different regions. Sure, maybe the subterranean locations might not count towards the explorer title, but so what, neither does the Realm of Torment which is a huge chunk of the NF campaign. I think you're over-thinking this thing. :) --Dirigible 11:14, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Mate the land isn't called "eye of the north", the same way factions isn't called cantha. the lands played-in in EotN will have a name like elona, cantha or something. Although alot of its underground and soem of it far shiverpeaks.. or something. Don't worry.Jupsto [[image:Feck_Off.jpg|19px]] 11:33, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Over-thinking is what I'm good at. Here's what I'm thinking... Lets say the dungeons are excluded, right? And there's no TUT island (which made up roughly 30% of NF's explorable surface) Now you've potentially got a really small area which has to constitute 100% of something. That's why I say we're unlikely to see another Cartographer title. And lets not forget, this is an expansion, not a full campaign -hence there will be less content. I'm going to go out on a limb here and estimate no more than 10 co-ops... which is hardly worthy of a Protector title. None of which bothers me I might add. Going to have enough on my hands with Guardian and Vanquisher, whatever that turns out to be.196.25.255.194 15:02, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Because it is an expansion rather than a stand-alone means it will not have less content. In fact, it is just the opposite. With out the tedious task of making the low-leveled area or new professions, they are able to make the same amount to explore excluding the Asuras' tunnels. This means, with more area they will most likely have more missions than the previous campaigns. <>Spark 19:07, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

Gwen
Anyone notice how Guild Wars:Eye of the North's initials spell Gwen? Guild Wars:Eye of the North

Surprised nobody mentioned that... XD - -S ora267  17:56, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Surprised its been mentioned about 40 times already. &mdash;[[Image:BlastThatT.jpg]]Blastedt 17:57, 22 March 2007 (CDT)


 * I thought that very same thing when I read this... My husband was like: "Ohhh, it's just a coincidence."
 * But I don't think so. -- RavenJWolfe [[image:RavenJWolfe-Icon4sm.png]] 00:19, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

so are you saying the the evill guy (the great destroyer or W/E) (in this case girl) is gwen? Zorgix 04:52, 5 April 2007 (CDT)


 * C1 was not called Leech or C2 Shiro, C3 Abbadon, so I dont see the logic of having GWEN as end boss... not to mention She wasnt even alive when Dwarfs banished Destroyer and his name. Biz 10:06, 5 April 2007 (CDT)

i just had to say somthing ridiculous because this is ridiculous i dont think they woke up one day and said our new game will be called short for gwen or somthing Zorgix 10:37, 8 April 2007 (CDT)

Lol, why would no one notice that when it stays in the head of the main article? Sir Bertrand 07:58, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

Spoiler warning: stat!
Well, I'm extremely frustrated. The campaign is ruined for me now and no spoiler warning was provided. The best thing about Prophecies (my favorite campaign) was that the story unraveled, you constantly found yourself in larger, more heroic matters that you expected. Anyway, the point of this rant is that this article needs the spoiler warning and I don't know how to find the template (I'm pretty new as a wiki member). can someone with the know-how please put it on here asap, so others that didn't want to know the story yet can enjoy their ignorance? -- User:Demonic Peaches
 * Roger that, Houston. We can confirm that a spoiler tag just landed smack in the middle of the article. Send in the helicopters, this might be the event of the century! --Dirigible 19:06, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, I ahte it that the whole plot was spoiled. :( I loved discovering the plot myself. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 20:04, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * But I'm sure all the little WoW and Runescape kids are happy. Short attention spans and ADHD disorder. Or whatever you call it... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 20:07, 22 March 2007 (CDT)


 * WTH?!? Virtually every article is a spoiler by this definition.  If you go to an article titled "Guild Wars Eye of the North", it should be self evident that an overview of the storyline is going to exist.  Spoiler tags should be reserved for givaways of important plot twists, not just because something summarises the general game progression. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 20:38, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Just put a spoiler tag on the main page. Problem solved? 132.203.83.38 21:07, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * That has been seriously suggested before :P Turk Nagona 21:18, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Ruined the whole plot? The info on the page is about the same amount you would see being ran around on local channel in on of the starting cities. IF you honestly think those couple lines ruined the plot of the expansion you must have ADD, it may outline the general plot but all those couple lines do is partly fill in a couple missing parts from the first campaign.--Sefre  [[Image:Sefresig.jpg|15px|]] 21:34, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, it'll probably all be in the manual. -- Gordon Ecker 21:56, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

I dont think that adding the spoiler is SO hard... any way like said, its a very little part of the plot. lets say the in the faction campaing it would say: 1. discovering of the pluage 2. finding where did it come from 3. trying and make the kurzicks and the luxons stop their way and help you 4. killing shiro. will that give away all the campaing? you wont know what is the plauge how do you stop the war of the luxons and kurzicks who is shiro... Zorgix 10:47, 8 April 2007 (CDT)

April 1st
Does anyone else think that this might be an elaborate April Fools day thing? Or at least hope so? Kite Firewind 22:09, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * That they published in a magazine? If it is theres gonna be a pissed off PCgamer staff--Sefre  [[Image:Sefresig.jpg|15px|]] 22:10, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, I was thinking that PC Gamer might be into it too. Doesn't the information seem to be leaking out a little too much? Kite Firewind 22:12, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Doubtful, but don't think too much into it. It wil be a few years before the game is even ready for a beta, let alone release. Things will change by then. - [[Image:Candle.jpg|12px]] Krowman (talk • contribs) 22:13, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Doubt this is bs. I'll know when my pc gameplay arrives; I doubt other mags would be in on it (if pc gamer would be in on it) –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 23:18, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * The magazine article is definitely confirmed and ANet has confirmed that the information in it is correct. April fools aren't done half a month before April 1st. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 23:33, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Huh? The Guild Wars website says that the magazine goes on sale on April 3rd...but I guess I shouldn't trust the official website, if all this is out already.Kite Firewind 19:45, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Subscribers get it early. -- Gordon Ecker 19:48, 23 March 2007 (CDT)

This isn't a campaign, so...
...I submit that it doesn't belong in a campaigns infobox, nor should anything else involving "campaigns" be posted related to this. &mdash;Tanaric 01:31, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * It still is a campaign, even if it is different in nature from previous installments. It is different in that it is an expansion, rather than a stand-alone product. If not a campaign, then what is it? - [[Image:Candle.jpg|12px]] Krowman (talk • contribs) 01:42, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * /agree with the Krow --Deathwing 01:44, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * /thirded. :/ –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 01:46, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * It's an interesting issue. On one hand, it isn't a "campaign" in the same way the first 3 were: it's not standalone, it's not for all levels, no new professions. On the other hand, it's undoubtedly the fourth GW "installment" and people will think of it that way. I wonder if it's just a question of semantics (and if so, we can change wording to include GWEN in any list with the first three). Is the wiki's use of the word "campaign" defined as a standalone level 1-20 game? Or could it be understood as any distinct product that adds to GW? Personally I think "campaign" is flexible enough a word to include the latter. But would "Chapter" or some other term would be better? So, GWEN is an expansion chapter, the other three are standalone chapters, but all chapters are part of the same overarching story. — HarshLanguage [[Image:qswearing_small.png|HarshLanguage]]
 * I would agree with Harsh Language. This is just a semantic debate.  I don't think it is really going to shape anyones opinion of this installment if we call it a Chapter, a Campaign, an Installment, or an Expansion.  All that needs to be conveyed is that this is a distinct installment, beyond that, I don't really see how it matters... =/ Defiant Elements  (talk ~ contribs) 01:56, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * As for what I would guess Tanaric would see as problem areas, see Template:CampaignsNavBox and Campaign. The Campaign page in particular does have some sticky wording issues. We also need to see how Anet will refer to GWEN. — HarshLanguage [[Image:qswearing_small.png|HarshLanguage]] 02:05, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Hmmm... perhaps then we should choose a less connoted word for the time being until something more substantive can be chosen based on what Anet calls GWEN. Perhaps just call it an installment for the time being and leave it at that?  Defiant Elements  (talk ~ contribs) 02:09, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I don't see why it wouldn't be a campaign by the common RPG definition of the term. We could change the navbox to say "campagins and expansions", "installments" like Defiant suggested or "releases" like the official wiki uses. An interesting bit of trivia from the PC Gamer article is that the "campaign 4" they started working on last summer actually developed into Guild Wars 2, with work on Eye of the North starting later, which explains why there have been no updates on the progress of campaign 4, and why Eye of the North is taking so long. -- Gordon Ecker 02:43, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Hmmm... I was beginning to wonder about that. Thanks for the trivia update Gordon.  Defiant Elements  (talk ~ contribs) 02:52, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Whenever I see the 'C4' abbreviation, I always read that as 'Chapter 4'. It's the fourth chapter in the saga, and it did (will) not end up being a full blown Campaign like the others that came before.[2c]136.8.1.100 05:11, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * And also it doesn't take too great a leap in logic to work out that this now-cancelled Campaign 4 was going to be called Utopia. hadz 09:34, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
 * LoL, I didn't even think about that, I think most of us just forgot about it. Maybe it could've been the other way around though. Like an expansion called Utopia and campaign 4 was going to be GW:EN. Of course, maybe Utopia will be used for a future expansion. We just don't know :P 132.203.83.38 16:17, 23 March 2007 (CDT)


 * No one ever said that Guild Wars Utopia was cancelled. The exact words from ArenaNet was "It actually was used as a project name for an unannounced project, but we do not intend to use it for a product name."  Frequently software writers will have in-house development names for products, then later the product gets an official name assigned to it for retail use.  In this case, my guess is that Utopia was likely the in-house development name for either GW:EotN, or Guild Wars 2; but, that's all it is, a guess.  Someone could ask Gaile Gray the next time they see her in-game if they really care to know for sure if that name was related to one of these.  --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 16:24, 23 March 2007 (CDT)


 * As I understand it, Utopia was originally the in-house project name of the next campaign and, as has been stated, it eventually evolved into Guild Wars 2. That being said, it could easily be seen why one would think Utopia was cancelled, especially after reading the PC Gamer article, which states: "You read that right:  Guild Wars Campaign 4 is cancelled--and so are all future Guild Wars campaigns.  Finished.  Done.  Gone for good." --Emelend 16:36, 23 March 2007 (CDT)

Gaile gray confirmed that there will be no montly fees for Gw eye of the north and gw2

check gwonline.net on forums ;)

EN =/= Campaign Four
It seemed sort of confusing, but just to make sure- is Campaign Four synonymous with this expansion, or not? -- Beliefs Cloud Thoughts. 12:16, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes, this expansion will be the 4th part of the storyline. So therefore, it will be "Campaign Four", it just will not be a stand-alone product like the other 3...of course, that is just how I see it. --Deathwing 14:18, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Keep scrolling down to for more on this. It's a difference of wording, really. But as Deathwing said, it's still the fourth installment of Guild Wars, whether you want to call it a "campaign" or not. And when you see someone refer to Campaign 4, they are talking about GW:EN, yes. — HarshLanguage [[Image:qswearing_small.png|HarshLanguage]] 18:43, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Although the "real" campaign four developed into Guild Wars 2. -- Gordon Ecker 20:26, 25 March 2007 (CDT)

This is not campaign 4, but is actully Expansion #1, and sadly there will never be a campaign 4.--TheDrifter 21:42, 26 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Don't lose hope yet. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 21:46, 26 March 2007 (CDT)

Template Idea- Please comment
I made this one after I saw a similar one on Wikipedia. I still need help making it smaller though. I suggest addding something like this to the bottoms of the different Guild Wars Games.
 * Beautiful, I suggest we use it. --[[Image:Blue_Arrow_Left.PNG]]Zathic 21:09, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I very much dislike the use of the graphic images in the navigation toolbar. I'm surprised you saw one like this on Guildwiki - I thought they had a policy or guideline against the use of images in the nav bars.  But, that's a different issue.
 * As to the differences here - I don't see a need for the "released" and "unreleased" text for this project - there are few enough in it, that it's unnecessary (sp?) clutter. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 22:28, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Looks good. Sirocco 23:53, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Drop "Released" entirely. And instead of "unreleased", I'd suggest something like Eye of the North (Fall 2007) and Guild Wars 2 (2008-2009). If possible, put the dates under the titles. Or if folks think the dates are too long/too specific, perhaps insert "Future releases: " and then list GWEN and GW2. — HarshLanguage [[Image:qswearing_small.png|HarshLanguage]] 02:47, 26 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Thanks for the input, I had something better before, but it was sorta messed up, and I'm not really good at making nav boxes or tables. Alreajk 19:03, 26 March 2007 (CDT)

Will anyone please add an expansion logo (resize it and stuff) to the box? fR0z3n.S0u1 01:36, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
 * For the GW:EN-logo have a look at the Kotaku page --- : Jill Bioskop X ( T | C )  04:13, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

Newly designed one. I think its ok, but still needs a little work to make it more appealing. Feel free to take this one and change it up as much as you like. New Campaign Template:

Alreajk 17:13, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

omg
i cant remeber where but i seen somthing that said you cant take your guys from factions,nightfall,and proficys to here and the other way anyone know if this is true???? &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.89.72.155 (contribs).
 * No, you can. The whole game/expansion doesn't allow new character creation (it's not a stand-alone title, and has no new professions), from what I've heard... you can ONLY take characters from the other games over. You might have been reading a thread on GWOnline, or Guru... they announced GW:EN and GW2 in the same thread. There's talk that you can't transfer characters from the Guild Wars games to Guild Wars 2... that may have been what you saw. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jioruji Derako.> 01:39, 26 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, you can't transfer characters to GW2, but you can/must transfer to GW:EN. Defiant Elements  (talk ~ contribs) 01:45, 26 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Good, I can play a fourth storyline on my ever-so-uber-pwning Ranger without making a new character to try out professions. Nhnowell 20:42, 26 March 2007 (CDT)

Collectors Edition
Do we know if they're gonna be doing a collectors edition for this? RebelliousUno 05:33, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Not yet we don't. --[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  07:50, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

Guild Wars: Eye of the North Logo
I found this in a website, is this an official logo for the game? http://kotaku.com/photogallery/gw2/1629486 &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 88.5.156.190 (contribs).
 * Yeah.. they are http://www.guildwars.com/press/releases/eyeofthenorthgw2/Biz 16:39, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
 * And I'll answer your question in advance. No, we can't use it, unless it shows up in the Fansite Kit section on the Guild Wars website. We have a policy like that. :P &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 17:34, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Some one just posted logo used on guildwars.com in the article, not 100% sure but I think I recall Gaile mentioning something about stuff off their site could be used in fansites whit out being inside fansite kits. Biz 16:25, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Not quite... umm... there was a pretty big discussion around the release of Nightfall about out Wiki image policy somewhere... somewhere... ...anyway, i  personally  believe that the EotN logo can be used, though not THAT logo, but a standard one with a white/black/transparent background, since it's a 100% sure It'll be in the kit sooner or later, and the only reason why it's later is because the kit isn't updated often :( &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 21:15, 28 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Barek was right in removing the image from this article. We can only use images they allow fansites to use, which is currently only the contents of the fansite kit/gallery. As far as I know, the only website allowed to use any GW.com content is the official wiki, which is obviously not a fansite. &mdash;Tanaric 22:16, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I asked Gaile about this when Nightfall came out. Here's the what I posted from her reply.  In short, anything in the gallery is okay to be used (not just the fansite kit portion of it); and content from the rest of the site can be used after requesting permission.
 * I sent Gaile an email on this a day or two ago, as this wasn't the first upload of the image. I haven't gotten a reply yet, so I'll try contacting her again. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 23:19, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

holiday season ftl
Can we have the scheduled release date as something other than the 2007 holiday season? You know for the 60% of players that aren't in the US :| I'd do it myself but, you know, I'm not American and I don't know when your holidays are! --Xasxas256 20:56, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Generally "holiday season" means late November to early December. Christmas/New Years time.  --Rainith 21:32, 27 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Ho! Was thinking it was standing for summer... §: TůζipVõrζąx Talk 03:49, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
 * i think there are quite a few shinto holidays in june, but i'm not sure --Honorable Sarah [[image:Honorable_Icon.gif]] 03:53, 28 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Heh, that's the point. Not everywhere is "holiday" = "christmas season". Quite a lot of people use "holiday" synonymously with "vacation time" and suddenly a relatively fixed time frame becomes completely useless. :D --84-175 (talk) 05:28, 28 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Well it is an American magazine. -- Gordon Ecker 05:45, 28 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Anet used the term "holiday season" in their press release, too. Sure, they're an america based company, but they have a worldwide clientele. --84-175 (talk) 16:48, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Makes sense... Holiday season (read: Christmas shopping spree season) is a favorite game-release time. Wish it wasn't such a good release time... to tell the truth, I don't really think I would mind if they decided to release the game a little earlier. Just saying. -- Jioruji Derako.> 04:50, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Heh, S.T.A.L.K.E.R. could have been released 5 years ago but then it would be crapy looking serius sam knock off and not the jewel it is today. They acctualy have to make the game before they can sell it, given less time there will naturaly be inferior quality and less content and that isnt something that is worth few months of wait. Biz 05:18, 28 March 2007 (CDT)


 * True, the extra wait means less bugs on release day. But there are plenty of games that simply get delayed for a few months just so they can release at the peak of shopping season, and that's something I could do without. Either way, it's not like anyone will be bored while they wait, hehe. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jioruji Derako.> 18:25, 28 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Look at it from a marketing point of view, when will most Americans be buying a bunch of expensive products? November-December. And would it be better to release it a couple months earlier and have the game sitting on the normal game shelves, or have it on the new releases displays where it would be seen by shoppers? They want the most money and releasing a game at the holidays is usually a sure fire way to increase profits. Besides, if you look at the xbox 360 when it first came out there were a bunch of problems, they probably could of been avoided if microsoft hadn't rushed it out for the holiday season, I'd rather get a product with as few defects as possible then one with problems skipped when the product was released earlier then it should have been.--<font color="Black">Sefre  [[Image:Sefresig.jpg|15px|]] 19:40, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Just to back up my original statement, here is a quote from the MSN article:
 * At the end of 2007, ArenaNet will ship the final installment of what has become the “Guild Wars 1” set of games.

Bolded for emphasis. --Rainith 23:23, 28 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Heh, I belive you, allright. Just being bitchy about the use of americanisms. ;P --<font color="midnightblue">84-175 (talk) 02:25, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Calling it the "holiday" season is so common here in the US it's unsurprising it was used. It's deeply entrenched, both in business use ("holiday sales figures") and in common use ("Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas" or "Happy Hanukkah"). And Anet probably wants a little bit of wiggle room on the actual date, too. But still, something as generic as "fourth quarter" (which I think is pretty universal in business terms) or just "late 2007" would have been better considering the international playerbase. (And it could've been worse: if they'd used "Winter" it would have really been confusing for some countries!) — HarshLanguage [[Image:qswearing_small.png|HarshLanguage]] 04:32, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Financial quarters depend on the industry- I'm fairly sure in some circles, "fourth quarter" isn't the same as in the gaming industry. But it is standardized there, afaik. It's kind of funny, even though I intellectually know that in Europe (well, specifically France, as I learned it in French class, but apparently at least Belgium as well) "holiday season" could be considered summer, I never really thought "holidays 2007" might be really ambiguous. Heh. &mdash;Aranth 12:46, 29 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Mmm.. quite disturbing: here (in Europe, Belgium for me), Holidays period is July-August, when school's year have ended and when most of the people are going to holidays.. and another thing: in Joystick #192 (April), in the GuildWars' article, they writing summer 2007 (page 12, I can scan it if you want).. &mdash; <font color=#477391>Corsaire  [[image:Corsaire_Signature.gif]] 05:21, 29 March 2007 (CDT)


 * There we go. Q.E.D. (I'm actually fighting the urge to lol here). :D --<font color="midnightblue">84-175 (talk) 05:51, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Guild Wars: Bringing People Together from Across the Globe Since <insert appropriate local date identifier here>. (TM) — HarshLanguage [[Image:qswearing_small.png|HarshLanguage]] 05:58, 29 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Another site here (in french) telling that GWEN is comming summer 2007 (the very last words).. ;) &mdash; <font color=#477391>Corsaire  [[image:Corsaire_Signature.gif]] 08:44, 29 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Well if French say it, then it must be true. Biz 08:58, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I don't say that's the truth, but.. that's what they're telling here.. ;) &mdash; <font color=#477391>Corsaire  [[image:Corsaire_Signature.gif]] 09:10, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
 * There is a bit of a mess around release dates untill acctual date comes and every one changes their sites postfactum, like game.co.uk taking preorders on C4 before they know the name of it September this year instead. Biz 10:20, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

Well, don't get me started on their assuming that we all use the Gregorian calendar... :P --Rainith 16:53, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I use the Canthan Calendar, which syncs perfectly with the Mouvelian Calendar and Dynastic Reckoning, except that the year begins mid-season for some reason (and therefore not on day one). And, even better, in 1582 CC there's ten days missing from the 5th of the tenth month to the 14th of the tenth month. I think Shiro stole them. -- Dashface [[Image:Dashface.png]] 21:14, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

This all reminds me of that song... It goes like, "We're all going on a summer holiday..." hum hum tam ti tam... --84.49.225.3 21:05, 2 May 2007 (CDT)

New heroes
In this it says there will be heroes of different races (Asura and Norn I think) if those are in I would love a Charr hero :D The Asura hero is probably an Elementalist or Mesmer as it says they are smart and good with magic. Norn is probably a Warrior, but could be a Ranger. But Charr are so awesome, I'm glad they are finally adding more of them, also, it seems they are the highest level area. (GW:EN starts above the maguuma jungle and heads over norhtern shiverpeaks to northern ascalon, home of the charr.) <>Spark 19:47, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
 * I would personally love a Sylvarian hero. They look like Rangers, or possibly Monks or Elementalists. And they're quite pretty as well (check out the artwork in te PC Gamer article next chance you get). --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] <font color="#237d00">Jioruji Derako.> 00:45, 2 April 2007 (CDT)

Pc GamePlay
Rough (personal) translation of the (dutch) mag I have a subscription for:

Article
The MMORPG Guild wars has been on our hard drive since april 2005. Prophecies was a real Classic and Factions and Nightfall were also on the mark for the millions of Guild Wars-fans who were all too happy they didn't have to pay a monthly fee for these games (unlike many other MMORPG's). As such, Guild Wars offers a lot of MMORPG playing pleasure at a low price and that's surely one of the main reasons of its success. But the formula's getting old. After Nightfall, we started to wonder how the Guild Wars series would evolve and if ArenaNet could keep the formula of a new continent and two new Professions each campaign interresting. All in all, we were wondering more and more about the future of the Guild Wars series and took the bull by the horns and asked our questions to Jeff Strain, producer and co-founder of ArenaNet and lead designet James Phinney. The answers were more than surprising.

A new evil and many new victims

We found out that ArenaNet doesn't have one but two new Guild Wars games in developement, namely Eye of the North and Guild Wars 2. Eye of the North is the first expansion to the Guild Wars universe and isn't a standalone campaign like Factions or Nightfall. As a gamer, you have to own at least one campaign (Prophecies, Factions or Nightfall) if you want to play Eye of the North. The story behind Eye of the North is as follows: the Guild Wars areas Tyria, Cantha and Elona are plagued by huge earthquakes. These earthquakes reveal several passage ways to gigantic underground complexes or dungeons. As a gamer, you can swiftly explore these Dungeuns and will soon make contact with the Dwarves, who are in a life or death battle with the ancient enemy named The Great Destroyer and his companions. Besides that, you'll also get to meet two new races, the Asura and the Norn, who will also play a big role in Guild Wars 2. The Asura are an extraordinary intelligent and inventive race that dominates the underground of Tyria. However, they think that the time has come to make their way to the surface and expand their territory. Actually, they had been working on subtly recreating the Maguuma Jungle (Prophecies campaign) and started to build huge temples here and there. The Asura are proficient in magic and very good at making objects from rock and steel. They are small in statue, but make up for this with their solid confidence that they will soon - as the most intelligent race - subjugate all other races. The other races beg to differ. The Norn are completely different. They believe in pure strength above all and have as a slogan "Only trust the might of steel". The fact that they're Half-Giants who can shapeshift to gigantic beasts might help that. Norn decendants strongly believe in the individual, in pure strength and cleansing the mind by honorable combat. the Norn don't have leaders but Heroes, to which other Norn decendants look up to. the Norn honor the spirits of dead animals, which gives them something Shaman-like.

New Areas

Eye of the North offers four new regions: namely the Charr Homeland, the Dungeons, the Far Shiverpeaks and the Tarnished Coast. Of course, we remember the Charr from the Prophecies campaign and this time you get to explore their home land, which lookss a little like pre-Searing Ascalon: with an abundant and magnificent nature including green fields full of little flowers, wonderful waterfalls and trees bathing in beautiful fall colors. In this home land of the Charr, one thing you get to look for is a lost Ascalon Legion. The underground dungeons, of which there are 18 planned, offer wonderful catacombs excavated by the Asura, Dwarves or other (hostile) races and vary from rock formations to excavated igneous rocks in which there's still a trail of flowing lava to ice caves and tunnels excavated in glaciers. These Dungeons are inspired by the many dungeons in nightfall who were stocked full of traps. Many of these dungeons will be unrelated to the story, have a high difficulty and can just be explored when you encounter them on your journey. Basides these dungeons, there are also the Far Shiverpeaks, a nearly uninhabitalble area full of pointy rock formations and big icy fields where the Norn live. Last but not least, the Tarnished Coast borders the Maguuma Jungle and is considered uninhabitable by the inhabitants of Kryta (Prophecies). As such, it's the ideal hiding place for the Asura, who are on the run from The Great Destroyer.

Watch yourself!

All in all, in this expansion, the battle against the Charr continues and you can support the Dwarves, Asura and Norn in their battle against numerous problems which will once more deliver a bunch of quests. Important to know is that ehe entire Eye of the North expansion is meant for level 20 characters. As such, you won't find a training island like in Factions or Nightfall in Eye of the North. The expansion won't deliver any new Professions, but will however make for around 150 new skills for the 10 known Professions, of which about 50 will be Player versus Environment exclusive. These skills have special traits, such as having a bonus versus a certain type of enemy (for example Giants), skill so powerful they would unbalance Player versus Player (PvP) fights or skills you simply wouldn't need in PvP such as Disarming Traps. Also worth mentioning is that this expansion will take over the Nightfall Heroes system and will introduce 10 new heroes. And because some eye-candy is necessary as well, this expansion will offer 40 new armor set. Want to know more? We thought so, so we put producor Jeff Strain on our Dwarven Grill (not too well done, he still needs to be able to finish the game), after which he was eager to answer all of our questions.

Interview
'''PCGP: ArenaNet is suddenly going for an expansion and not a stand alone campaign. Why?'''

Jeff Strain: Well, because we think the Guild Wars world has by now grown large enough that the already offered Professions are more than enough. In stead of adding new areas and new Professions, with this expansion we want to return to the story and atmosphere of the Prophecies campaign and mainly add a lot of content for the highlevel players. This expansion is also the connection between Guild Wars and Guild Wars 2. The Asura and Norn will be introduced and this will be playable races in Guild wars 2 and the battle between the Humans and Charr will be an important theme in Guild Wars 2 where the Charr will also be a playable race. Also, this expansion will introduce the big evil that will threaten Tyria in Guild Wars 2.

PCGP: To make things clear, this expansion has a strong link with the Prophecies campaign, but that won't be in the same package, I assume?

Jeff Strain: No, the new areas are on their own and are lovated North of the areas in the Prophecies campaign. You won't be able to just walk from the new areas to Ascalon. After all, you can also play this expansion if you just bought Factions or Nightfall.

'''PCGP: 'Eye of the North will also have Heroes. What do you think of the criticism that Heroes encourage a singleplayer experience, while Guild Wars is actually an MMORPG?'''

Jeff Strain: Well, I can understand that, but we're actually offering both possibilities and that's very important for an MMORPG. Look, playing with Henchmen or Heroes will never give an advantage in our game. You can't collect more loot, can't get more experience and can't get through the game faster. An AI Healer can't come near what a human player with a Healer can, but we make sure that, if you want to, you can take Henchmen and Heroes and experience and interresting singleplayer experience.

PCGP: Will this expansion use a new 3D-engine, an improved Nightfall engine or maybe even the Guild Wars 2-engine?'

Jeff Strain: Eye of the North uses an improved Nightfall engine without changing the system requirements. If you can run Nightfall, you'll be able to play this expansion.

'''PCGP: Guild Wars players always talk about Prophecies as a real classic; but with Factions and Nightfall we noticed some criticism, while these campaigns had huge improvements such as better PvP-arena's and a better salvage system. Why do you think this is?'''

Jeff Strain: Well, gamers were all over Prophecies and the problem we had is that we had to make sure there was a delicate balance between new elements and offering 'more of the same'. Because every campaign had to be standalone, we offered a training island, an entire new continent and new Professions and skills and with that we scattered the Guild Wars players over the continents and added a lot of complexity to the game. This is something we don't want to do anymore. Don't get me wrong, we're very proud of the improvements we made to Factions and Nightfall, but we think enough is enough and we should focus on improving the excisting continent and work on something new and that'll be Guild Wars 2.

I'll do the GW2 article as well later today. –Ichigo724 09:26, 30 March 2007 (CDT)


 * Nice. Sirocco 12:59, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

New PvE skills
I'm most interested by these. Avatar of Kormir, anyone? --Yohoho Mouse 06:48, 2 April 2007 (CDT)


 * That's quite a possibility. But why PvE only? Hmmm Sirocco 08:05, 2 April 2007 (CDT)


 * "- Skills would be simply too powerfull for PvP" - cant recall exactly where Ive seen it.
 * Instead of making skills that will become overused in pvp at first and then nerfed to hell, they make some things PvE exclusive so they could make harder areas with out making it impossible for avarage player. For one I wouldnt whant to be hit by Lightbringers Gaze spike or try to beat 3k hp wurm who can be resurected back to full health by any of his buddyes, would you? - Biz 08:18, 2 April 2007 (CDT)


 * See Celestial Skill 67.162.10.185 14:15, 2 April 2007 (CDT)


 * I understand that if the skill is too powerful for PvP it would be PvE only. But the question is, why make Avatar of Kormir overpowered to start with? It'd be a little dodgy if all the other gods were represented in PvP except Kormir. Sirocco 17:14, 2 April 2007 (CDT)
 * That would be a spoiler(as is this message) How would a player explain how the commander of a army all of a sudden become a god if the player never beat nightfall. --<font color="Black">Sefre  [[Image:Sefresig.jpg|15px|]] 17:43, 2 April 2007 (CDT)


 * It could be in the Eye of the North manual's timeline. If it takes place a few years after Nightfall, there might even be Kormir statues. -- Gordon Ecker 19:02, 2 April 2007 (CDT)


 * I already came up with a few ideas, check it out. --Dark Paladin X 10:47, 3 April 2007 (CDT)

For the Avatar of Kormir skill that pretty much HAS to be in here, I suggest naming it "Avatar of the Goddess of Truth" to avoid spoilers (even if it IS a little long). Anyone who played through Nightfall will know what it means, and it won't give away the name --Gimmethegepgun 18:24, 13 May 2007 (CDT)


 * It's not going to be a PvE-only skill, as, according to the GameSpy dev chat, none of the PvE-only Eye of the North skills are profession-specific. It could be one of the 10 Dervish skills though. -- Gordon Ecker 21:53, 13 May 2007 (CDT)


 * And a Dervish could get that before finishing Nightfall via a Tome? Don't think so. Avatar of Kormir will remain a fanboy skill forever ^^ &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 22:15, 13 May 2007 (CDT)


 * So? Have it called Avatar of Truth, and nobody's the wiser. It's not a spoiler unless you understand where it comes from, and if you understand that, it's not a spoiler anyway. Besides, by the time GW:EN comes around, who will remain that won't know about Kormir's fate? Aside from PvP'ers? Alaris 22:30, 13 May 2007 (CDT)

Alpha testing..
"#
 * 1) ArenaNet sent out the first wave of alpha test invitation emails on January 9th [2]. On December 12th Gaile Gray stated that testing (from the context, implicitly out of house testing) for campaign 4 has not started [3]."

Smooth, Gaile. XD! This means that those test invites were for EotN, which ISN'T a campaign, meaning that testing HASN'T started for Campaign 4, but it HAS for EotN. Right? =P - -<font color="Red">S ora267  21:02, 4 April 2007 (CDT)

Beta Weekend
I was in Kamadan ID 1 on March 28 (I think, some date around that day), and we all had a nice Q&A with Gaile, and soemone asked if she knew when GW:EN Beta Weekend was. She "went to ask" the dev team, and she said that she anticipated a Beta Weekend some time in the next 1-3 weeks. And notice that this weekend, for the first time in a while, there isn't any special bonus (i.e. triple green drop etc.). Likely because the dev team and everyone is spending all of their time putting the last touches on a GW:EN Beta Weekend for the weekend of Fri. Apr. 13 - Sun. Apr. 15. But that's just a guess.


 * Interesting. I thought the huge background download was related to hard mode, but it could be related to Eye of the North. -- Gordon Ecker 19:30, 5 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Ya, put -image in your GW shortcut and you'll see that there's a whopping 35000 files to dl. o_O --Dice 12:37, 10 April 2007 (CDT)

EotN skills preview
Short version of the story, apparently the guys that are in the ATS testing event can see some EotN skills. They are under no NDA, before anyone asks, not that it matters much anyways.

MESMER @  6 fast cast 12 illusion 11 inspiration

Aneurysm 10e 1c 20r - Spell. Target foe regains all Energy. For each point of energy gained in this way, that foe takes 1 damage. Dom Magic

Power Lock 10e 1/4c 15r - Spell. If target is casting a Spell, that Spell is interrupted and disabled for an additional 1 second. Dom Magic

Signet of Distraction 1/4c 20r - Signet. If target foe is casting a Spell, that Spell is interrupted and disabled for 1 second for each signet you have equipped. Dom Magic

Calculated Risk 10e 2c 10r - Hex Spell. For 17 seconds, target foe has 50% chance to miss with attacks but does +10 damage.

Inadequacy 10e 1c 8r - Hex Spell. For 9 seconds, the next time target foe attacks, that attack is interrupted and all nearby foes take 46 damage. Illusion Magic

Logic Bomb 10e 1c 10r - Hex Spell. For 10 seconds, target foe suffers from -3 health degeneration. When this Hex ends that foe has Cracked Armor for 17 seconds. Illusion Magic

Sum of All Fears 10e 2c 20r - Hex Spell. For 25 seconds, target foe moves, attacks, and casts Spells 20% slower. Illusion Magic

Signet of Recall 1c 20r - Signet. You lose all Energy. For 10 seconds, you have -4 energy regeneration. When this effect ends, you gain 12 Energy. Inspiration Magic.

Wastrel's Feast 5e 1/4c 20r - Spell. If target foe is not casting a spell or attacking you gain 12 energy. Inspiration Magic

NECROMANCER @  11 blood 6 soul reaping 12 curses Masochism 5e 1c 10r - Spell. Steal 16 health from target foe for each Condition you are suffering from (maximum 60). Blood Magic Cacophany 10e 2c 15r - Hex Spell. For 17 seconds, whenever target foe uses a shout or Chant, that foe takes 119 damage. Curses Entropy's Grasp 5e 1c 3r - Enchantment Spell. For 5 seconds, target ally's attacks cause Weakness for 5 seconds. Death Magic Putrid Bile 10e 1c 12r - Hex Spell. For 5 seconds target foe suffers -1 health degenration. If that foe dies while under the effect of this Hex, all nearby foes take 25 damage. Death Magic

MONK @ 12 healing 12 divine Balthazar's Signet 1c 20r - Signet. Target foe takes 10 holy damage. If that foe was attacking you gain 1 energy. Smiting Prayers Purifying Veil -1regen(maintained) 5e 1c 8r - Enchantment Spell. While you maintain this Enchantment, Conditions expire 25% faster on target ally. When this Enchantment ends, one Condition is removed from that ally. Smiting Prayers Smite Condition 5e 1c 8r - Spell. Remove one Condition from target ally. If a Condition was removed. Foes in the area take 5 damage. Smiting Prayers Cure Hex 10e 1c 12r - Spell. Remove one Hex from target ally. If a Hex was removed that ally is healed for 102 Health. Healing Prayers

ASSASSIN @  12 dagger, 12 crit, 2 deadly Lotus Strike 10e 12r - Off-Hand Attack. Must follow a lead attack. If it hits, this attack strikes for +22 damage and you gain 17 energy. Dagger Mastery Assassin's Thirst 5e 8r - Dual Attack. Must follow an off-hand attack. If this attack hits, you steal 14 Health. Deadly Arts Misery Signet 1c 8r - Signet. You gain 14 health for each Condition on target foe. Deadly Arts Shadow's Embrace 10e 1/4c 45r - Hex Spell. Shadow step to target foe. For 10 seconds, this Hex does nothing. When this Hex ends, you return to your original location and that foe suffers a Deep Wound for 7 seconds. Deadly Arts.

RANGER @  0 marks 6 beast Rapid Fire 10e 2c 12r - Preparation. For 3 seconds, you attack 25% faster. Marksmanship

ELEMENTALIST @ 0 attributes Glyph of Swiftness 5e 1c 10r - Glyph. For 15 seconds, projectiles from your next 2 Spells moves 66% faster. Winter's Embrace 5e 1/4c 10r - Hex Spell. For 4 seconds, you and target touched foe move 66% slower. Water Magic Glyph of Immolation 5e 1c 10r - Glyph. For 15 seconds, your next 3 spells that target a foe also cause burning for 3 seconds. Fire Magic (note this is listed as fire magic despite the fact none of the numbers scale with fire attribute) Grasping Flames 10e 2c 15r - Hex Spell. For 5 seconds, target foe moves 66% slower while Burning. Earth Magic. Ward of Weariness 10e 2c 20r - Ward Spell. You create a Ward of Weariness at your current location. For 5 seconds, foes within that location become Weakened for 5 seconds whenever they take elemental damage. Earth Magic Shell Shock 10e 1c 10r - Spell. Target foe takes 10 damage and has Cracked Armor for 5 seconds. Air Magic

RITUALIST  Pure Was Li Ming 10e 1c 30r - Item Spell. Hold Li Ming's ashes for 5 seconds. Whilst you hold her ashes, Conditions on you expire 10% faster. When you drop her ashes all allies within earshot lose 1 Condition. Restoration Magic Energetic Was Lee Sa 10e 2c 30r - Item Spell. Hold Lee Sa's ashes for 5 seconds. while you hold her ashes, you gain +1 energy regeneration. WHen you drop her ashes, you gain +1 energy. Spawning Power --Dirigible 14:54, 7 April 2007 (CDT)

EotN skills preview discussion

 * Cracked Armor ? some kind of new condition? If this remains, Look for some war skills =D Biz 15:44, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * "Entropy's Grasp" Entropy has a skill name after her :P.--Nog64Talk [[Image:Yaaaay.png|19px]] 15:48, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * -*AL or -*% AL? -20 AL mb ? Or maybe that crits strike for a ridiculous amount of damage? –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 15:52, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Im thinking same as Weaken Armor but condition. Biz


 * Cool skills, I see they still love using culture references. ^_^ Cacophony sounds more at home on the mesmer Domination line, though. It essentially has the same type of function as Empathy and Backfire. Sirocco 15:58, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Aww... I want an assassin skill named after me :( Seriously though, don't take these leeks to serious. You saw how much changed from Nightfalls PvP Weekend, and retail :P &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 19:04, 7 April 2007 (CDT)

Cacophany is so overpowered. omg. That will instakill any beastmaster or paragon. As if paragons weren't under powered as it is... --  Vallen Frostweaver  21:34, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Die. No seriously, die. Please? –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 21:36, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Did you seriously say paragons were UNDERpowered? Wow. Quit the game. --IxI Raiden IxI 21:33, 9 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Eh?--[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  01:12, 8 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Vocal Minority is cheaper, an area hex and completely shuts down shouts and chants instead of merely punishing them. Gaile Grey has stated here that ANet intends to weaken passive defenses and strengthen active defenses, which is hurting Ritualists and Paragons. I just hope the passive defense counters are intended as a replacement for the current nerfs rather than an addition to them. -- Gordon Ecker 22:16, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah but I don't see an area hex that shuts down casting spells or axe attacks either (just examples). I don't like either one actually (VM or this new one I see) or any skill designed to eliminate the use of a primary attribute, as some professions can't be restricted like that and smacks of imbalance IMO.  But what are you meaning by active/passive defenses? --[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  01:12, 8 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, I agree that Vocal Minority is overpowered. As for active and passive defenses, Gaile Grey referred to "Shields Up!", which recently got nerfed, as a passive defense in the post-Celestial Tournament skill rebalance commentery, and talked about favoring active defenses over passive defenses. -- Gordon Ecker 01:25, 8 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I think passive defences are things like stances and shouts which stay active for a decent duration, without paying any heed to it while providin good defense (like indeed "Shields Up!"), in comparison to things like kiting etc. which are active defenses as they require action from the players' part beyond keeping a shout or a stance going (though the defensive stances are getting buffed, so I could be mistaking). As for the original point, Backfire does similar damage to Spell casting so I don't think Cacophany is too bad, however I'll admit I dislike both skills. I aslo agree that Paragons are getting nerfed too much, as most of the Paragon problems stem from multiple Paragon teams. Akirai Annuvil 07:28, 9 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Vocal Minority is a hex with a 20 second recharge. How2beat? &mdash; Skuld 10:03, 10 April 2007 (CDT)

Couldn't they think of a better name for the condition other than Cracked Armor? How bout 'Sundered'? Doesn't that sound much better? Sirocco 21:48, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * By the way, I was thinking about 'Penetrated' as well, but I didn't think that'd go down well... It is a part of the naming convention ANet use for armor penetration though... Sirocco 21:50, 7 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Cracked means that overall structural integrity of the armour is weakened but its still holds somewhat, Penetrated would suggest partial destruction in one limited point, Sundered would mean completely ruined. Biz 02:44, 8 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Submerged would mean underwater :) --Deathwing 02:50, 8 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I don't see your point Biz, all 3 words imply your armor has taken damage, it's just that Cracked isn't as strong a word as the others. Come to think of it, if it is a condition how exactly would you 'recover' from it? Magical armor that repairs itself? Sirocco 08:17, 8 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes. –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 21:42, 9 April 2007 (CDT)

Can anyone confirm this IG and add 1..12..16 info? Grima.worm@seznam.cz 10:37, 8 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I'm wondering about the Paragon, Dervish and Warrior skills and honestly doubt the source too. I think that they could be the skills, however I'm not entirely certain... Cracked Armour? I think it's a bit strange there introducing a new Condition this late in the game, though I'm all for it, they haven't ever done this before which makes me question the source. Akirai Annuvil 07:28, 9 April 2007 (CDT)
 * they haven't ever done this before... umm... they haven't released an expansion before either... -- Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 19:39, 12 April 2007 (CDT)

That skill Signet of Recall, that's really a bad skill. Why would you ever use that? It costs more energy than you gain. I really hope they're gonna change it, it just suck too much. Only the degen costs you more energy than the energy gain at the end. Sir Bertrand 14:02, 11 April 2007 (CDT)


 * signet of recall doesn't excist o.O –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 14:05, 11 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, I won't say it's useless so soon, it's not like you've seen all the skills that it might synergize with. Also, these are leaks, we don't even know if these are for real. -- Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 19:39, 12 April 2007 (CDT)

Skill template "preview"
Very cool idea of abusing the template codes ;] Me want more! :D &mdash; Poki#3, 08:05, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Somehow i dont think theese are GW:EN skills ... they look more like hard mode skills Grima.worm@seznam.cz 09:28, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Moving 3000% faster ftw. &mdash;Aranth 11:32, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, that's a pretty fun looking one. [[Image:Torturer's madness preview.jpg]] --Dirigible 16:02, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * What's all this about? --[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  16:07, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * They figured out the template codes for some of the monster skills in either GW:EN or hard mode, see http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10141434. The Torturer's Madness pic above is one of those skills (even tho it wasn't taken with the template trick, it's also from the ATS beta testing, like the profession skills I posted above). --Dirigible 16:11, 10 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Template stuff was removed in a very recent update. Should we leave the info on the template there and change it to say that monster templates WERE available for veiwing, or just remove it entirely? Eronth 20:23, 11 April 2007 (CDT)
 * No, we ATS testers could see the monster skills. &mdash;[[Image:BlastThatT.jpg]]Blastedt 20:28, 11 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I could see it too, but it was removed after a short while in an update. (also, what is an ATS tester?) Eronth 20:31, 11 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Automated tournament system tester. -- Gordon Ecker 20:44, 11 April 2007 (CDT)

"Summer" Release date from gamona.de is incorrect
Gaile has confirmed that the article stating that a possible release date for EotN as this summer was incorrect: http://guildwars.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4794066#post4794066

I have removed this from the article.

Re the 3rd quarter release date
I reverted the change back to 3rd quarter. Gaile noted on the official wiki that the target release was indeed the 3rd quarter of this year. Lojiin 15:58, 12 April 2007 (CDT)
 * No you didn't, I did. And I can verify your statement is indeed true. --[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  16:00, 12 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Well, I'd say we did, though presumably we did it at the same time. I wonder how the resolves those conflicts anyways as I didn't get an edit warning and my edit does actually show up in the article history.  Lojiin 16:11, 12 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, it shows Lojiin. InfestedHydralisk  [[image:Shadow_Prison.jpg|19px]] 17:59, 12 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Does it matter? Sirocco 19:28, 12 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Can I get a link, please? Thanks. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 21:46, 12 April 2007 (CDT)
 * http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Gaile_News Sirocco 22:25, 12 April 2007 (CDT)

template code
removed? skills dont show up anymore
 * Yes, it was fixed. You can see a picture of the skills (from the time they did show up) here, and read more about it here, though there are likely Hard mode skills, and not EotN skills. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 06:27, 16 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Infernal Rage effect HAS to look cool. I mean "Infernal" "nearby foes". Maybe each attack looks like Flame burst or something. Solus  [[Image:DiscipleSymbol2.jpg|19px]] 06:36, 16 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Check my comment somewhere by the end of the thread, to see how the skill was called before :P &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 12:01, 16 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I love that thread. "zomg no grammars" "zomg anet balance pve!!!!!" "i am leaving for wow" &mdash;Aranth 12:18, 16 April 2007 (CDT)

Need to complete prophecies?
Do characters need to complete Prophecies to play Eye of the North? -- Limu Tolkki 13:37, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * You probably need to get to Lion's Arch to enter Eye of the North InfestedHydralisk  [[image:Shadow_Prison.jpg|19px]] 13:53, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Eye of the North only requires the user to own any 1 of the campaigns, not necessarily Prophecies. So I'm assuming there will be an access point from each of the main cities. -- BrianG 14:10, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * What BrianG said. Though, maybe not from "Major city", but definitely from somewhere on each continent. Though it looks to me, like owning and completing prophecies will be beneficial to you in understanding the story, since it looks like an continuation of the events in Tyria. The Dwarves, the Great Destroyer, the Charr, Gwen... &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 16:32, 17 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Yes they will be from the major cities (port cities) I just wonder how they will get a water route up there :| My theory, you go up to the south maguuma coast where the big cave is with the asura and when you get out you are in the foothills of the far shiverpeaks :D <>Spark 18:54, 19 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I don't think it's going to be on the Tarnished Coast. According to the PC Gamer article, act 1 takes place in the Depths of Tyria and mostly involves the Deldrimor Dwarves, and the Tarnished Coast, Far Shiverpeaks and Charr homeland are visited in act 2. I suspect that the port for Eye of the North is going to be a Deldrimor-controlled island, possibly the vanishing island mentioned by Prince Mehtu the Wise, although it could also be a port somewhere along the western coast of the Southern Shiverpeaks. -- Gordon Ecker 19:48, 19 April 2007 (CDT)

Storage Question
If we buy this do we get another storage box from the Xunlai agent? &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.121.95.6 (talk &bull; contribs) 18:19, 30 April 2007 (CDT).
 * Like we know... &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 13:28, 30 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I'm curious as to why this matters. :/ –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 13:28, 30 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Seeing that we get extra storage per campaign, we might get extra storage. It matters for those of us who already filled out our storage spaces. Alaris 14:20, 30 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Its only logical that they will add one more slot of storage, but still sell junk or move less used items to mules and u dont need storage at all. Biz 14:37, 30 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Alaris, you said "per campaign". This isn't a campaign, it's an expansion. We get free character slots, but this doesn't have any, so logic makes me think that the same will be for storage. I may be wrong, and things are still subject to change though... We won't know for sure until the game goes live. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 23:03, 30 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I remember reading somewhat that because this was an expansion, we don't get new storage or new character slots. That may just be rumor, but it's what I heard :/ --Phydeaux 23:13, 30 April 2007 (CDT)
 * I know Gaile confirmed that Eye of the North will not provide additional character slots. I don't believe any explicit statement has been made on storage tabs, and the decision may still be up in the air. -- Gordon Ecker 23:23, 30 April 2007 (CDT)
 * Thanks all for the info. Poki - Calling it an expansion doesn't mean that they have to take everything away! It's an expansion mainly because it requires ownership of at least one campaign to access it, because it provides high-level content. But expansions in other games have often provided extra classes / storage / etc. I was hoping that the same would be true of GW:EN, but I can still hope for storage. Oh well, I really like extra character slots and classes, and I wish that GW2 "mini-expansions" occasionally adds new races & classes as well. Alaris 09:40, 1 May 2007 (CDT)
 * More is not always better, Adding more classes, more skills, more ways to-do things made the game ever more complex, meaning they will have to spend more time on introduction and training areas for rookies leaving less and less time for actual new high level content for those who want it. Besides you pay less for it and still get Campaign level of content minus character slots and new professions. Biz 03:53, 2 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Don't get me wrong. ANet has proven itself worthy of my cash, and unless they do something horribly wrong, I'm in for GW:EN and GW2 collector editions.
 * I always found training areas somewhat redundant, but they don't need to be re-created everytime. In GW2, for example, they might create a common tutorial section where new content is added as they add new professions, new concepts, and you can always go back to it to learn about those new concepts. Just like the Isle of the Nameless training area, it doesn't get re-created for every campaign / expansion, and new characters don't need to go through it. Besides, only new players need the tutorials, and repeat players of even a different profession may opt to skip much of that content and get into the action. I like being able to skip early tutorials and get on with the adventuring with a minimum level and equipment.
 * About new professions, I agree that after a few, you can't create new ones without overlapping with others. I'm happy with that. New professions contribute in two significant ways: (1) style, and (2) diversity. You can't beat the style of assassins, dervishes, or paragons. Also, even though we get a second profession, each profession is a unique mix of functionalities, combining armor, range of effect, energy dependence and regeneration, support role, dps, spike ability, summoning ability, etc. For example, even though the paragon mixes abilities that existed before, the mix created is novel: armored ranged attacker with support abilities. Niiiice. I personally enjoy experiencing these new professions, even if they are only added style and a novel mix of old ideas. Alaris 09:44, 2 May 2007 (CDT)
 * It makes sense not to provide new character slots, as you cannot create new characters in the expansion. You can argue both ways for storage, the official claim is that you get storage for each continent you visit to store the many unique (to that continent) things found there.  You won't visit a new continent, but most likely you will find new unique (to that expansion) stuff.--Per Abrahamsen 11:02, 2 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Tyria and Elona are technically one continent :P. As such, Northern Tyria may also be treated as a separate continent. Since we don't know how the expansion content will differ from a normal campaign we can't say for sure. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 22:14, 2 May 2007 (CDT)
 * It's all speculation until ANet says it. But as far as I see it, for all these features, it's a question of justifiable costs. There will be demand for more storage, but not so much for new characters. So character slots get nixed. Storage, not so sure. There was diminishing demand for tutorials and new professions, so that got nixed too. More demand for dungeons etc, so that went in. I love it when a company listens to the customers, even if occasionally it goes against what I'd personally would prefer. Alaris 22:45, 2 May 2007 (CDT)

The Woman with Blonde Hair
Who is that woman with blonde hair on the cover of eye of the north? It might be a Norn looking to the background, or something evil? Just curious. -- Austy 08:21, 3 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Looking at this and this, which are example of Norn concept art, I'd say definately Norn. Blond hair, blue line-drawing tatoos, Norn. Could still be evil though, much like Varesh turned out to be. Alaris 09:20, 3 May 2007 (CDT)

Absinthe spoons
Totally random, but for some reason, when viewing this article, I get Google ads for Absinthe spoons. Any ideas? :) &mdash;Tanaric 12:40, 4 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Spoons for it, but not the drink itself, eh? Maybe burning sugar and potent alcohol will be important aspects of GWEN. I'm getting a Dodge turck ad right now, btw.--Nog64Talk [[Image:Yaaaay.png|19px]] 18:12, 13 May 2007 (CDT)
 * yea turns out eotn is all about gwen's meth lab. oh and also, there is no spoon. =) -Anon.

Is this the end?
Will this expansion bring an end to Guild Wars One? We know that there will not be any more campaigns and probably no more expansion packs, but what other additions or developments or changes can we expect to the Guild Wars One game, over time, after Eye of the North, and further down the road, Guild Wars Two, is released. Does Anet assume that we'll all 'convert' to Guild Wars Two and that we'll all stop playing Guild Wars One? --Legendary 10:12, 13 May 2007 (CDT)


 * Given that many ArenaNet people used to work for Blizzard on Diablo II, and considering that Diablo II is still sold, maintained, and updated even today, a good 10 years after its release, I don't see Guild Wars (One) dying off anytime soon. &mdash;Tanaric 14:22, 13 May 2007 (CDT)

maps
Explorable
 * Thickest Jungle
 * Broken Golem Pass
 * Mill Town
 * Frozen Crevasse
 * Frozen Fort
 * King's Throne
 * Water Town
 * The Fiery Fire That Burns
 * Water Town
 * The Harpy Caverns
 * The Charr Temple
 * The Jelly Den
 * The Destroyer's Hive
 * The Yeti Cave
 * The Wurm Tunnels
 * The Icy Ice that Freezes
 * The Destroyers Cometh
 * The Underground Pass
 * The Dwarven Dig
 * The Cataclysm
 * The Undergrowth
 * The Stone Basin
 * The Ancient Ruins
 * The Heard of the Mountain
 * The Spider Lair
 * The Journey to Normheim
 * Steepe Grasslands

Outposts &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 220.239.104.104 (talk &bull; contribs) May 14, 2007 (CDT).
 * Ruins Outpost
 * Mountain Eye Outpost
 * Mountain Polar Outpost
 * Mountain Town - Traverse map
 * Mountain Trophy
 * Steepe Grasslands Outpost
 * Steepe Overlook
 * Steepe Plateau
 * Marsh Outpost


 * what &mdash;Aranth 15:53, 14 May 2007 (CDT)


 * Formatted post, since it was all 8/. WTF on "The Icy Ice that Freezes"--Nog64Talk [[Image:Yaaaay.png|19px]] 18:00, 14 May 2007 (CDT)


 * It looks like they're mostly placeholder names. The Jelly Den means one of two things. 1. Guild Wars is finally getting slimes (*wants slime minipet*) 2. CANDY DUNGEON!!! Does anyone know where this list is from? It looks like either an alpha leak (which I'm pretty sure we used to have a policy for, but I can't find one right now) or a translation of names from a non-English article. -- Gordon Ecker 18:26, 14 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Yeah, looks very placeholdery. The Jelly Den could also be named after how the walls look or something. Or maybe whoever was plugging in placeholders was just hungry. Also, shouldn't "steepe" supposed to be "steppe"?
 * <3 slime minipet, though. &mdash;Aranth 19:00, 14 May 2007 (CDT)
 * The Mountain Heard is probably supposed to be The Mountain Heart. I have a feeling "Water Town" may be half-sunken Orrian ruins. -- Gordon Ecker 20:57, 14 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Must be an alpha leak as the names look a lot like place holder names. Especially all of the ouposts. :) (Such a small amount od outposts anyway. : --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (gem / talk) 00:16, 15 May 2007 (CDT)
 * NDA disregard and disrespect is what it looks like. Is there a policy against that or something? Alreajk 21:48, 17 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Calm down, peeps. If these are the real names, I'm not gonna play and I'd think Gaile gray came back from a freaky mix of Survivor/Fear Factor. They are placeholders. Blacktide Den's placeholder in E3/Alpha was bayou. There are others. I forget the link to it, but you people should consider stress relief :) . Nhnowell 20:28, 18 May 2007 (CDT)
 * :P Yeah I thought that too, or at least a good percentage. Still, I think the person who posted those should be ashamed of themselves for releasing confidential info nonetheless. Alreajk
 * The whole list looks like a really bad joke, seriously. It's probably some prankster out to see how we'd respond. Look at those names, that can't be serious. >> -- Elveh 13:16, 23 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Agree with Elveh, most of those names look like something you would get from a medieval Dora the Explorer show. Fiery Fire that Burns? Jelly Den? Some of them don't look anything like something Anet would call a place like The Destroyer Cometh and the Journey to Norheim. You guys are getting worked up over something that was made as a seriously bad joke. :\  Marin Bloodbane  ( Talk ) 16:46, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

More Info and Ingame Screenshots
http://pc.ign.com/articles/790/790230p1.html Interesting info & Nice screenshots as well

hmmm...... by the sound of it sounds like the dwarves aregona die which dont want as i want to play as them--roshanabey2 06:35, 29 May 2007 (CDT)
 * I too would like Dwarves (the more races & professions, the better). I don't see why you think the Dwarves will die, if anything, the article describes a few ways that dwarves are involved in the storyline in GW:EN. As far as we know, Dwarves have not been confirmed as a playable race in GW2, but that could still be announced later as a surprise. Alaris 14:25, 23 May 2007 (CDT)


 * Has anyone else noticed that the sin near the Norn has an Elonian face?


 * Dusnt look specificaly "Elonian" to me. Lets just hope Norns dont look that bad in GW2. Biz 15:34, 30 May 2007 (CDT)


 * Well whatever it is it's surely not a Canthan Face. Maybe With Gw:En we can create all the available professions on our account with every campaign :/


 * I think he's just a hero or henchman. Hopefully players will get similar armour. -- Gordon Ecker 02:48, 31 May 2007 (CDT)


 * He could be a henchman but I don't see weapons in his hands and hench have weapons in towns/outposts. So this makes me think that he's a player in a town/outpost.

Overlap between Prophecies and GW:EN?
I've decided to rename this section (previously called: "Waste of money for arenanet and ncsoft and unfair on prophecies players") because it's well known that GW:EN will be about as distinct from Prophecies as any other two campaigns to date have been. The debate can pretty much be safely closed on this one. GW:EN will use new areas, many new monsters, and limited amounts of reuse regarding the continuing storylines of Charrs, Dwarves, etc. But for history's sake, I've left the argument below. Alaris 21:37, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

When i talk about waste of money i talking about the prohecies campaign, because the whole of tyria and more is up for grabs in eye of the north. Its waste of money both for arena net and ncsoft. The only thing non prophecies players(people who dont own it) wont probobably be able to do is go to crystal dessert, apart from that they can explore sorows furnace and kryta and ascalon. Can some one hopefully prove me wrong--roshanabey2 14:44, 22 May 2007 (CDT)
 * I can't prove it, but there is no reason to believe that Campaign 4 will re-use any of the areas from Campaign 1. I expect that "Far shiverpeaks" will be distinct from Northern or Southern Shiverpeaks, and the Charr homeland will be North of Ascalon, not "in" Ascalon. Just like Prophecies and Nightfall are on the same continent, they nevertheless do not include any area that is used by both. I expect that there will be quests you can take to go to the GW:EN "campaign" from either of the 3 campaigns, just like quests to go from one campaign to another. Alaris 14:59, 22 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Sigh, as much as i hate to admit it, Alaris is probably right. I own Factions + Nightfall and i know the map of Tyria. I am quite sure that Anet wouldn't release a game with the same map with the exact places (and monsters, npcs, etc tec0 as a previously released campaign (let alone the first one)--<font color="Red">Kurzspear 15:12, 22 May 2007 (CDT)
 * I'm sure roshanboy is right, they just reskinned all of prophecies and changed the names of monsters...gg anet --<font face="mistral" color="#123456">DEATHWING 15:14, 22 May 2007 (CDT)
 * I'm sure I saw a bundle with GW Proph. and GW:EN together as well as GW:EN on it's own. Maybe that is what you've spotted? --JP 15:23, 22 May 2007 (CDT)


 * IF you own NightFall you probobly have noticed that it unlike Factions is Very close to Proph map, infact some of the desolation is over Thirsty River and you can even teleport into Crystal Desert and see the Statue of Female Knight from NF. Either way, this is as close as it would ever get to old Prophecyes. Biz 16:11, 22 May 2007 (CDT)
 * Bundle of GW Pro & GW:EN? I've have not heard anything about how GW:EN will be packed, and a collector's edition has not been confirmed either (I still hope for one). But here's a few more things I can say: (1) Far Shiverpeaks involves the Norn, so expect Norn outposts, which were never before seen, (2) Charr Homeland is confirmed to be very different from where you meet them in Ascalon and surrounding areas, expect lush greens, and (3) lots of the areas in Tyria in GW:EN will be underground anyway, which is so far pretty much inexistant in the GW universe (except for a few rare exceptions). I'm so excited! Alaris 17:58, 22 May 2007 (CDT)


 * If it did just reuse the Prophecies maps (which it won't), I don't see how that would be a waste of money for ANet or NCSoft. Final Fantasy X-2 reused most of the scenery and models from Final Fantasy X to save time and money. -- Gordon Ecker 20:59, 22 May 2007 (CDT)

no, it would be a waste of money because GWEN playerss will be able to interact with prophecies playes and do their missions and go to their cities blah de blah--roshanabey2 06:34, 29 May 2007 (CDT)
 * I'm sorry Roshanbey, I have no idea what your talking about. Eye of the North will have all new places that won't be directly accessible from places in Tyria. Gaile said that u can't walk straight from Charr homeland to ascalon, you can't go from the far shiverpeaks to the northern shiverpeaks, and you can't go from the Tarnished coast tot he maguuma jungle. I have a feeling there will be someway to get to these places from their neighbors, but not in the traditional sense. They definitely won't be the same locations as prophecies, and they won't overlap. You're getting confused ideas about this expansion. It isn't going to pop a new city in the middle of say, snake dance, or the arid sea. It's not going to reuse old places. It's completely new. Think of it as a continuation on to the prophecies campaign, not just an add on that fills in random places. People aren't going to be looking for an EotN quest in prophecies, or a prophecies quest in EotN. It's simple. Don't rant and complain or doomspeak if you only have a vague, completely self speculated idea about what you're talking about. Thanks. Alreajk 15:03, 29 May 2007 (CDT)
 * There could be NPC-guarded portals like the one between the Arid Sea and Crystal Overlook. -- Gordon Ecker 18:50, 29 May 2007 (CDT)
 * How could a.net waste money in the first place? Their products are pretty rushed as is, and they reuse A TON of stuff. 1 year development for a so-called-standalone campaign is pretty impressive. Plus, if a.net doesn't manage to trick a lot of ppl into buying their products, then they could just close the servers and cut losses. They do have the right to close the server without notice. The only way I see a.net wasting money is, as above, not get enough buyers, or leave the servers up to the end of time. --8765 18:59, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

"If you think of EotN as a story in three acts"
If you think of Prophecies as a story in three acts, the first involves escorting refugees to Kryta, the second involves Ascension, and the third involves trying to destroy some evil foes. That doesn't mean "Act 2" appears on the screen once you complete Sanctum Cay. If PC Gamer had have said "Eye of the North is a story in three acts," maybe delimiting them with "Act 1" et cetera would be applicable. -- Dashface  23:16, 31 May 2007 (CDT)


 * Correct, the PC Gamer article makes no explicit statements about a formal act division. -- Gordon Ecker 00:15, 1 June 2007 (CDT)