User talk:Azroth/Builds

This section was starting to become too big to stay on my talk page so I decided to move it here to clean things up a bit.

Old builds will be archived here.

Unfinished Builds
These are build which have not yet been given their own page. When a full page is created for them I will add them to the Finished Builds section. Until then all discussions on these builds will be held here on my builds talk page.

Critical Weapon
Low damage and a terrible rune spread. It's pretty much all over the place. But it is a workable concept. &mdash; Rapta   (talk|contribs) 21:51, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

As Rapta says the attributes are kinda messy. If three attributes are used its rarely good to have one maxed, and critical hits should rly always be at 13 if you use any skills in it. One last thing. You fell for a build trick that I did once till I lost horribly in RA. You cant in fact hold an item and dagger at the same time haha. Also with only two actual attacks your assasin will miss out on a lot of damage, since daggers without a skill use do practically wand damage. Your first build uses only 3, but all of them have incredibly low recharge times, so it works. (Not a fifty five 03:04, 5 September 2006 (CDT))


 * Actualy I know that you cant hold both. The idea of the Item Spell wasn't to gain health regen as much as it was to activate and then drop to clean up 3 Conditions.  Gonna change the skills and points around a bit because I found this to be realy choppy in fights due to healing so often.--Azroth 16:49, 5 September 2006 (CDT)


 * And just to get this out there, I know that you can only have one Weapon Spell on at a time. The idea is that Weapon of Warding will pair with Wielder's Boon to give better healing and add defenses while healing.--Azroth 17:53, 5 September 2006 (CDT)


 * The 2 attack skill you got is kinda weak, and i would say swap Vengeful Weapon, constantly casting Vengeful weapon will disrupt your attack flow and you might not able to maintain critical defense. -- [[Image:Ritualist-icon-small.png]] Cwingnam2000 22:45, 6 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Yeah, I know, but the initial idea was based around Vengeful Weapon and it kind of sucks to lose it. Is there any other good blocking or evading skill that could replace Crit Def to keep Veng Weap, or if not, what should I replace Veng Weap with?--Azroth 11:38, 8 September 2006 (CDT)

Ok, what do you think of the new one?--Azroth 16:59, 8 September 2006 (CDT)

Looking good :) I think you're right about the resil weapon thing replacing weapon of warding. Ward is better, but resil lasts longer for your wield boon skill thing. (Not a fifty five 02:17, 10 September 2006 (CDT))

Yeah, no matter which one I end up putting in the final build, the other will go into varients as they tend to be about even. It basicly just comes down to more health regen and +armor while under a condition, or less regen and +blocking for less time. It basicly just depends on the situation, and if the area is condition heavy or not.--Azroth 03:15, 10 September 2006 (CDT)

Knock 'n Shock
The general idea is make them sit down/shut up and die (kind of like an electric chair ':P). The Skills are mostly listed in order of activation (sort of). If you want to leave me any input on this build, please specify if you are talking about skill bar 1, 2, or 3. Thanks--Azroth 00:12, 6 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I also used to play a combination of Frozen Burst & Lightning Touch once. It certainly does rock in PvE. However i mostly brought Elemental Attunement, or i Echoed the Touch and increased it with Glyph of Elemental Power. Also used Blurred Vision for another hex, whenever Burst recharges. Feel free to experiment with that ;) --Ineluki 04:32, 7 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I like the echo idea, but the point isnt so much to spam Lightning Touch or hex the enemy, but to keep your opponent on the floor while zapping him to death (kind of like a tazer). my favorite of the 3 sets I made so far is the 3rd because it lets you Gale them from a distance, then quick warp in with Ride the Lightning and get to work with the rest of your spells.--Azroth 11:38, 8 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Seems ok although I'm not so sure about the Shatterstone variant, I like the other two more. Using Gust, it might be difficult to keep a hex up with only Frozen Burst, perhaps Deep Freeze would be better (although it uses heaps more energy). On the Ride the Lightning build you could even use AoD, that way you've got more survivability, a varient perhaps? --Xasxas256 00:09, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

The Shatterstone variant provides the dmg in a bit more of a spike style because of the 3 sec delay on half of the dmg. Its interesting, but I admit not the best of the three on its on, but it may have team spike potential depending on whether or not it performs like a spell or a hex when multiple copies are put on a target at once. I'm looking for another Water Spell that could be used for a similar amount of energy with the Gust variant, and when I find one that would work I'll update it to include it as a variant. AoD is pretty :). I never thought about the possibility of another profession because my points are already spread across three attributes, but AoD doesn't need any points and would be nice for getting in and out quickly where as Ride the Lightning is only good for getting in(If only it did dmg as well *sigh*).  I'll definitely add this as a variant, thanks for the tip.--Azroth 13:55, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

Vampiric Aura
The idea here is to do a lot of armor ignoring damage relatively quick by pairing the effects of Vampiric Spirit and Dark Aura with the spells and 10% sacrifice skills of Blood Magic. To maximize effectiveness, lure your target away from the group so that VS will only have one choice for a target. Dark Pact is the arguably the best spell in this build because of its low energy cost, low casting time, low recharge time, and because it triggers the effects of both VS and DA.--Azroth 23:36, 6 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Why Elementalist main? -- [[Image:Ritualist-icon-small.png]] Cwingnam2000 08:00, 8 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Mainly becuase the +3 energy cost of spells from VS cant realy be handled by any other classes energy management (trust me, I've tried). Also, with the Aura of Restoration varient you get better health management than with other classes (besides monk) since all the spells have pretty good casting and rechange time {man Dark Pact works well with this :)}--Azroth 11:38, 8 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Good idea using VS and DA together. There are a few problem however. First of all with all this adjacent things its hard to get dark pact to trigger VS and DA to hit the target if he is not slowed. Secondly, ele is good in the short run, but in the long run energy storage is not very good without an elite of that sort. One thing you might want to look into is a n/me with inspiration magic. Lastly, you can dump a few skills to support this inspiration magic. e.g. you dont need both touch and wallows: you can spam dark pact and wallows back and forth with little if no (due to aftercast) delay. Secondly strip enchant isnt needed (tho it is useful): nothing stops lifestealing skills and only SB/Shadow veil can stop the rest or even reduce it. Dont underestimate inspiration, channeling alone will give you +1/spell because you get in touch range of your target. (Not a fifty five 14:56, 8 September 2006 (CDT))


 * I'll look into it and get back to you on the viablility of that.--Azroth 15:11, 8 September 2006 (CDT)

Ok, the only Inspiration spells that seemed good for constant energy management were Power Drain, Power Leech, and Spirit of Failure. All others had either to long of a reload, or cost enough energy that the gain would be insignificant. Channeling would be nice, but to maximize dmg on your target you want to try and pull them away from the main group so that VS will only target them. Therefore you won’t get much energy return out of it. Power Drain is only really effective if your target is a spell caster, so it will only work half the time. Power Leech is an elite so that wont work. And finally Spirit of Failure will only give you a return 25% of the time against melee opponents. It’s sad, but none are really a dependable source of energy, if you consider that you'll be spending 8 or 13 every 1 or 2 seconds.  If you think of anything that would be better at energy management let me know.  As it stands, [[Energy Storage might not be the easiest to refill, but it will at least hold out for a good 60-80 energy easy.--Azroth 16:32, 8 September 2006 (CDT)


 * lol funny idea, I dont know if its viable at all, but have you considered a r/n "touch vamp spirit" for expertise?
 * nm counter that, VA wont work on skills grrrr... (Not a fifty five 03:10, 10 September 2006 (CDT))

Yeah, plus no other spell or skill recognises the +3 energy cost from VS as part of the cost of the spell its attached to. So even if Expertise did apply to spells, I doubt it would have any affect on the +3.--Azroth 03:17, 10 September 2006 (CDT)

My suggestion here would be to put in Jaundiced Gaze and Blood of the Aggressor instead of Shadow/Lifebane Strike as you've suggested, but keep Aura of Restoration to counteract the additional life sacrifice (plus I love it with spell spammers and it makes use of your energy storage attribute points). If you want to put in Strip Enchantment, consider taking out Dark Pact as it seems less efficient than Blood of the Aggressor, and you only need so many spammable spells. -- BrianG 12:13, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * The E/N version of this build is old. Its only there so that people can see what the build looked like originaly and what it looks like now.  The N/any set is the current one.  The E/N version proved to run into energy problems around the second or third kill and was scrapped as a result in favor of a N/any version which could better manage its energy.  Shadow/Lifebane Strike are optional realy as the other 3 spells can be spammed and do equal damage, and can be replaced with Consume Corpse or any other form of energy management.  As it stands though beware the trap I fell into with this build initialy.  And that trap is...Energy Storage is not energy management!&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]]  13:59, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

Dark Aggression
This is designed to not heal because to finish the combo you need to get below 78% health. Besides that this build does about 400dmg just in additional dmg alone.--Azroth 18:04, 14 September 2006 (CDT)
 * One full combo can kill a target with 100AL.--Azroth 20:38, 15 September 2006 (CDT)
 * Hmmm...this is better than I thought. Managed to get a glad point with it in RA, then lost against a touch ranger team.  Needs a little fine tuning but there may be some real potential here.  Opponents die so fast they can’t really react to your popping in.  Needs work to become affective against kiting.--Azroth 17:17, 16 September 2006 (CDT)

Critical Displacement
I found this to work realy well in PvE.--Azroth 22:12, 17 September 2006 (CDT)

Jagged Master
Never ending Minion bombs along with poison and disease.--Azroth 16:34, 23 September 2006 (CDT)

Kite-Data Drain
The name of this is a throw back to .Hack// The idea is to completely shut down an opponent with conditions, leaving them easy pray for the rest of your team.--Azroth 00:58, 24 September 2006 (CDT)

Team-Key of Suffering
Need to test this out.--Azroth 18:19, 25 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Clever idea. I have an Me/N Curses/Inspiration build planned for one of my Nightfall slots, perhaps the Keystone half could be tailored for a Mesmer primary?  If so I could help you test it.  The loss of the extra Curses points would hurt, but Fast Casting would be more useful than Soul Reaping. -- BrianG 12:25, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Might be possible but the Soul Reaping from the Necro Primary gives you a good energy management signet as well as a signet that can be spammed once you run out of instant recharge skills for you elite. If you can think of mesmer skills that can replace these then I can add the Mesmer primary, otherwise Fast Casting would be nice but energy would be a problem.&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]]  13:16, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
 * True, I forgot that Signet of Lost Souls was from Soul Reaping. But there are options from the Mesmer line, Keystone Signet + Ether Signet might take care of energy management, and Leech Signet might also be useful. Not sure if this would be better than a Necro primary though. -- BrianG 13:40, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

Immovable Object
A variant of a build I'm using.&mdash; Azroth    01:05, 26 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Not sure if I get the point of this one. Why add points into Air just for an elite that does a small amount of damage and blinds?  With Kinetic Armor and Armor of Earth I doubt you will need to blind opponents.  Plus, remember that Crystal Wave and its duplicate remove conditions, so you will either be wasting those 2 slots or wasting your elite slot. -- BrianG 12:18, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * :P duh, man I feel stupid. But in my defense I did write this at 1:00AM. The real version is the one my Griever Ragnarok is using back on my user page.  That one actually works.&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]]  13:12, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Hahaha no problem man. I did check out the build on the main page and it looks good.  I might try it out actually since I'm getting bored with my Elementalist's Stone Dagger Renewal-like build. -- BrianG 13:31, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

Revitalizing Haste
This build can cast monk spells in 1/4 of the usual time, allowing skills like Ethereal Light to be used with no worry of interrupts, while boosting the power of the healing spells effectively. Words of Comfort can be used to give great healing if your up against opponents that use a lot of conditions, or Divine Spirit can be used to get about 15sec of energy reduction of spell costs to allow the monk to fully take advantage of the speed with which it can cast spells without having to worry about energy costs. This can be of real use if facing a lot of AoE. In contrast, Healer's Covenant can be used to lower the spells cost but will increase casting time and lower healing per spell.&mdash; Azroth    22:34, 26 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I've been playing through nightfall with a monk so I decided to take a look at your builds. I liked this one and then looked at the talk page for Healer's Boon, and noticed that there has been a recent correction to make this skill increase the healing for all party members when used with Heal Party.  So you may want to consider that skill.  On top of that, since I'm playing Mo/E, the first thing I thought of was glyph of lesser energy.  Using this you could spam heal party twice for free, with only a half second casting time for each. -- BrianG 23:36, 5 December 2006 (CST)
 * Hmmm the glyph would also be useful for 2 quick, free castings of Renew Life to revive dead party members. -- BrianG 23:39, 5 December 2006 (CST)


 * Yeah, all my monk heros use that glyph. Now that it effects two spells it rocks!!&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]]  21:20, 6 December 2006 (CST)


 * Hahaha yeah, now every build i look at, i think "glyph of lesser energy?" and i've started actively looking for 15 energy skills to make better use of it. I really love how the spells still trigger the attunements too, i never noticed that before. -- BrianG 21:48, 6 December 2006 (CST)

Hey, what do you think of the following skills used with Healer's Boon/Holy Haste? (If going for a more Heal Party style build): Divine Healing, Divine Intervention (with the amount of healing this provides, the bonus should be pretty large, so not only would you save them you'd also heal them considerably), Release Enchantments (if cast when your enchantments are almost ended, would the healing be worthwhile with only 2 enchantments dropped?) -- BrianG 12:59, 7 December 2006 (CST)


 * Hmmm...I see what your going for with the whole heal party theme, but there are several problems with how these skills work. First off, the 30sec reload on Divine Healing is kind of long, and could result in you being without a heal at a critical time.  Second, to get the full effect of the heal, you would have to let your allies loose around 300hp, which needles to say is risky even under the best circumstances.  Third, The "in the area" effect means that you'll have to get much closer to the action than most people would like, and will make a perfect target for the other team.  Be them humans or NPCs, everyone loves to punish a monk for getting to close to the action.  Fourth, Divine Intervention is an Enchantment, and will clash with Holy Haste.  Finally, even with the healing boost, the healing resulting from removing 2 enchantments just isn't enough to really warrant the addition of Release Enchantments.  I'm sure there's a much better skill you could fill that slot with.  Thanks for all the feedback, and if you think of any other skills that might work let me know, but these just don't have much synergy with Healer's Boon and Holy Haste.  Plus, and I'm not sure if it was fixes, but DH might not trigger the effect of HB as, last time I checked, Heal Area didn't trigger as it didn't target or something like that.&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]]  16:36, 7 December 2006 (CST)
 * Nevermind, that glitch was fixed.&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]] 16:41, 7 December 2006 (CST)
 * Yeah I was just going through everything carefully to check for synergies. I forgot Divine Intervention conflicted with Holy Haste so never mind about that.  The recharge of Divine Healing does suck, but I was thinking of it as more of an emergency backup to Heal Party, if things are getting dangerous and the foes have managed to push into range of the monk (in which case your allies should also be in range of the spell).  You definitely wouldn't want to purposely wait until your team's health was low enough to get the full benefit.  Not sure how often this would be useful though.  For Release Enchantments, with 2 enchantments plus the bonus, the healing would exceed a standard heal party (without bonus), for only 5 energy.  Its probably not worth the hassle to have to worry about the timing of it though.  One skill which I think would work nicely is Remove Hex, which usually frustrates me due to the 2 second cast, but which would be considerably improved with a half second cast. -- BrianG 17:08, 7 December 2006 (CST)


 * Sorry, but that wouldn't work either. Healer's Boon and Holy Haste only work on Healing Prayers Spells.  Since Remove Hex is unlinked, it would still have a 2sec casting time.&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]]  13:08, 8 December 2006 (CST)
 * No apology neccessary, thanks for your help in pointing out what i missed. Its too bad the hex removal is unlinked though, i really hate the 2 second cast time.  Since the spells have to be healing prayers, that means the bonus won't work for divine healing or release enchantments either, since they are both divine favor.  So it seems there isn't anything else to find that will synergize well.  I'm still going to cap Healer's Boon though, as I like the glyph+heal party idea.  Plus, its a lot more interesting than most monk elites that are just stronger healing spells.  Thanks again for the help, I'm just learning monk so my skill knowledge is not quite up to speed yet. -- BrianG 14:32, 8 December 2006 (CST)

Holy Covenant
This build can cast higher cost area healing spells more easily by lowering the costs of the spells and cutting the casting time of the spells in half. This is great for supporting allies that clump together like back line casters, but also leaves your team open to AoE Nuking.&mdash; Azroth    22:34, 26 September 2006 (CDT)

Holy Light
This build can provide full party healing or conventional healing depending on what the situation calls for. This makes it slightly more versatile than some other monks and allows it to adapt and change as the battles does.&mdash; Azroth    22:34, 26 September 2006 (CDT)

Divine Benediction
This is a new variation of the standard boon prot. By utilizing new skills it can benefit from enchantments getting stripped, as well as being able to provide great point healing for no energy plus the cost from Divine Boon with an easily spamable spell. Add in some of the optional skills and the new condition removal and you have a new twist on the standard boon prot.&mdash; Azroth    22:34, 26 September 2006 (CDT)
 * Heya just wanted to say i wasn't rly gonna comment on the nightfall builds, cause the elites and stuff are gonna get nerfed within like days of the release prolly >.< However, I will say on this one that I tried a boon zealous ben. myself.  It turns out, at least it seems, that boon and divine bonus come before <50% is detected, so zealous only seemed to trigger on like <30%, kinda ruining the idea :(. (Not a fifty five 16:52, 28 September 2006 (CDT))
 * dang, that sucks, hopefully this will be fixed when they nerf everything :P, or maybe they'll just fix this and not do any nerfing :) (I wish)&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]] 17:11, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

Quadmentalist
Ok, I know this needs a lot of work and will have major energy problems but it could have the potential to be extremely powerful. Can anyone see a way to improve the energy management on this?&mdash; Azroth    00:28, 1 December 2006 (CST)


 * I really like the main combo of Shatterstone and Elemental Flame, but I don't know if you'll get the most of the combo by using all 4 elements. Have you considered a Water/Fire version to maximize the attributes for better damage and higher energy storage?  You could use Armor of Mist for defense.  An interesting idea for energy would be to use Water Attunement in combination with Glyph of Lesser Energy.  Then casting spells like Shatterstone and Freezing Gust will actually gain you energy.  If you went heavier on fire, then Fire Attunement along with Glowing Gaze might help with energy.  I think leaning Water attunement would work better though.


 * Glyph of Restoration would work really well, since the recharge matches Shatterstone, but Glyph of Elemental Power is also tempting. I would leave that optional, based on whether you want a self heal or higher damage.  You may also want to consider Smoldering Embers as another trigger for Elemental Flame, a 3 second hex for only 5 energy and the added bonus damage if they fail to move. Hope you like my suggestions. -- BrianG 02:17, 1 December 2006 (CST)


 * Hmmm I thought of one more thing. The fire damage from Smoldering Embers and Glowing Gaze could be used to end Teinai's Prison/Ice Prison, allowing you to snare, and then decide when to end the hex.  Also, if I read the info on Glowing Gaze correctly, the damage is done before the energy gain, thus the fire damage would end ice prison, which would trigger elemental flame, which would then trigger glowing gaze's energy gain.  Hehehe that would have to be tested of course.  -- BrianG 02:29, 1 December 2006 (CST)
 * Meh I just noticed the recharge on Ice Prison is 30 seconds so that's not much fun. -- BrianG 11:14, 1 December 2006 (CST)

Hey Azroth, sorry for spamming my late night brainstorms onto your talk page, I hope you find use for at least some of the feedback. Just thought I'd drop you this link Build:E/any Icy Steamer, which looks very similar to what I had in mind. -- BrianG 12:00, 4 December 2006 (CST)


 * Yeah, that's kind of what I was going for. I wrote this build really late and what started off as an attempt to make a rainbow ele with Master of Magic as the elite got side tracked at some point and diverted to my long standing love of Shatterstone, lol.  My Knock 'n Shock build with Shatterstone is much better now that that skill got boosted and Lightning Touch got a cost reduction.  I'll rewrite this to incorporate its original idea ASAP, and maybe see if a trimentalist with Shatter would be better (Water, Fire, and Air).  Thanks a lot for the feedback, most people dont wander over here that often it seems...or they're just to lazy to comment on any of it :P&mdash; [[Image:Azroth sig.png||builds]] Azroth  [[Image:Azroth sig2.png||talk]]  14:07, 4 December 2006 (CST)


 * No problem. You have so many ideas here that some people might feel overwhelmed to look through it all, but if I see any ritualist or elementalist builds I try to take a look, since my skill knowledge is strongest in those areas.  I haven't looked at the knock n shock in awhile, I'll check out your progress on that.  I've never tried shatterstone before but I like this combo so I'm going to cap it shortly.  Talk to you soon. -- BrianG 19:30, 4 December 2006 (CST)