User talk:Oblio/Sandbox/FamineHero

Rate-a-build
Please test and vote on {Deleted Link}|new builds]]

Tested:
 * 1) It works. I like it.  Not as efficient as a second player, but that is to be expected.  The whole point is that this can be done "solo" and it certianly works for that.---Milgram
 * 2) I've tried this a few times and like it. I prefer the skills in though...Blessed Signet and Apply Poison have been totally useless for me. Overall it's just as effective as going with a player partner, though a bit less time-efficient. &mdash;Vendetta411 04:41, 4 January 2007 (CST)

Unfavoured:


 * 1) As hero's are inferior to a normal Famine ranger (and bringing NPC's along on a farming run is a bad idea to start with), I have to go with unfavored on this one because the regular 2-man 55/Famine works much better. I really wish more would agree to merge. — Jyro X [[Image:Darkgrin.jpg]] 01:41, 7 January 2007 (CST) (only vote once. :) --oblio)
 * 2) "your vote here"

Merge (kinda unfavoured):
 * 1) — Jyro X [[Image:Darkgrin.jpg]] 12:48, 9 January 2007 (CST)
 * 2) Build works but should be merged. -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 11:17, 8 January 2007 (CST)
 * 3) &mdash; Defiant Elements 17:02, 8 January 2007 (CST)

Discussion
HI I've tried this build, maybe its just me, but I can't get my ranger to cast the bonds on myself. Wondering if there is some trick to it.
 * As with all heroes, disable the skills and then have him cast manually. &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 05:38, 17 December 2006 (CST)
 * I Added 'Useful Hints' to avoid further problems with this. Zspanky 14:32, 17 December 2006 (CST)

I tryed this and it worked fine until i had to take the quest "clear the chamber". I aggroed 2 groups and the grasping darknesses and began to kill them. When their health bars were about 1/4 to 1/2 the way down they scattered and about half of them began to attack my ranger hero(she was far anough away so that they couldn't "see" her and she was on "avoid combat"). They wouldn't stop following her so when the stances ran out she died. Did i do something wrong or is it not possible to get past the darknesses? BrotherGilburt
 * Try to put her away further, you can also first watch the movement of the graps, and put her a bit further, maybe even on the other stairs. If you aggro by accident, cast a Visage on her and HB. Dont use the stances right after another, but when WD is on half, than cast DD. The visages will get their energy down, and let the hero recast Famine, try to keep up. I think this is just a matter of gaining experience. You can watch the movie I made, (below), it shows a good spot to put Jin to not get aggro'ed. Zspanky 09:47, 18 December 2006 (CST)
 * What is the best hero to use ?
 * Acolyte Jin or Margrid the Sly, those are the 2 ranger heroes, doesnt matter which one you take. Zspanky 07:42, 20 December 2006 (CST)

AE Scatters
Famine + SS/SV causes monsters to scatter if affects more than 4 foes. They will stop attacking and go to regenerate or attack other targets. Even your hero can avoid aggroing, it still takes time to kill enemies. It took a long while to kill some grasping in the video sample.--Hydralisk mk2 10:15, 20 December 2006 (CST)


 * Pretty much all farming builds cause scatter. Shield of Judgement, SS, Famine, Triple Chop, Starburst/inferno/flameburst, Traps (if they survive). But it's workable, if somewhat slower than before.--Silk Weaker 10:22, 20 December 2006 (CST)

Does this build work for 55 Heroes and Famine Ranger Players?


 * You are taking the worst example, you can aggro 3 aaxtes everytime, not scattering them. And the graps were 2 groups, you could make a better aggro if you want, so you can take them 1 group at a time. Smiters are in groups of max 5. Its pretty doable. Zspanky 12:55, 20 December 2006 (CST)


 * My monk friend aggros a huge bunch. I just stay out of range-- no issue. I don't get XP, but so what? --Silk Weaker 11:00, 21 December 2006 (CST)

SoA Better?
Just a thought, wouldn't SoA be a good idea since mending is good enough to counter the energy degen in UW?

Just an idea, haven't tested. I will test both later on today however. --Apathy 10:33, 21 December 2006 (CST)


 * Because of the scatters, pulling large groups is less effective, and SoA works well agains large groups, but because healing breeze refreshes faster, I like it better, so I can spam it on the ranger when something aggro's. If you pull a large mob of smiters, they will scatter, refresh energy a bit, and they will start healing, the more smiters, the longer it takes. Zspanky 13:33, 21 December 2006 (CST)


 * As a 55, SoA will reduce the damage taken per attack (5 while under prot spirit) by 5 per attack taken, so no matter the size of the group, all the hits are going to be for 0.


 * My point was that SoA is superior to breeze because it is impossible to interrupt. With the mob size limited its still a better alternative. --Apathy 16:38, 21 December 2006 (CST)


 * Healing Breeze is better when your Hero gets attacked. And you will not get interupted much, because Visages take their energy down to 0, precast it, and than take some hits and recast. You are able to keep up. Zspanky 04:31, 22 December 2006 (CST)


 * Ah true. --Apathy 07:44, 22 December 2006 (CST)


 * So why can't you replace Blessed Aura with Balthazar's Spirit so that you don't need any of the ranger's enchants..just make him put famine, and put him somewhere behind so you get all the drops.

Blessed Signet
What the hell is it for? 6 energy? --Silk Weaker 08:55, 25 December 2006 (CST)

Maybe SOA instead of BS ? --Benoit Flageol 02:12, 27 December 2006 (EST)
 * You could change it for res if you like, or any skill you prefer. 85.154.2.145 13:13, 30 December 2006 (CST)

yea change BS for anything pretty much. A res is the best idea since if the ranger dies you cant get him back up so the run is over.

Change Mending and Essence Bond?
Sry, was my fault, seen it ;)

Advantages?
You can order the hero to cast famine then move him out of the radar sight so you are sure to get all the drops. > lol ??? If the ranger move out of the radar we loose his enchant... mmmmhhh. Maybe the monk can bring Mending and the hero ranger bring Essence Bond so the ranger gain more energy if you want him to attack with Apply Poison one Aatxes and if you put the ranger out of the radar you dont loose mending. --Benoit Flageol 02:16, 28 December 2006 (EST)
 * This is a preference, if you like it you can use it, but the apply poison isnt really needed. 85.154.2.145 13:11, 30 December 2006 (CST)

Merge?
Couldn't this be merged with by adding the line: "the ranger can be replaced with a hero."? -- Oblio (talk) 04:23, 31 December 2006 (CST)


 * The enchants are different, better.


 * That doesn't explain why it shouldn't be merged. --Silk Weaker 05:40, 31 December 2006 (CST)


 * My take on echants are that every 55 has their own pref, and it doesn't really matter. I think the key is that the monk brings Sv/Av and the ranger brings Famine and some bonds. The rest is trivia. oblio 16:30, 31 December 2006 (CST)


 * I agree with the merge. And if no one disagrees in about 2 days, I'll make it happen. — Jyro X [[Image:Darkgrin.jpg]] 02:26, 1 January 2007 (CST)


 * It could be merged, but this combination makes hero-use very easy. I dont like to be dependant on other players, therefore, the fact that I can use a hero for these build, makes this the right build for me. But about merging, you got a point there. Zspanky 03:41, 1 January 2007 (CST)


 * One Jyro does the merge, just add an entry on your preferr'ed ranger hero on the talk page. I still need to do something like that for my 55 build (as I dont care for the one on that page). -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 11:01, 1 January 2007 (CST)


 * I disagree with the merge. While this setup involves two builds, it isn't a team build, it is a solo build.  The skills are somewhat different to reflect that.  Also, the discussion focuses on how to run this as a player/hero combination.  If you were to merge the two you would be making it very obscure and basically hidden from someone doing anything less than an exhaustive search for solo UW builds.---Milgram


 * I agree with you Milgram, this was actually the point I was trying to say xD Zspanky 05:32, 4 January 2007 (CST)
 * Well, it is either a team build or a solo build (i admit i'm not sure how best to classify. Currently, it has the team build category (though it shouldn't because it is unvetted- that should be commented out). To me, every "solo+hero" build is just a tweaked team build (tweaked such that the hero's can be dumb). I don't know the right thing to do, and will probably post something on the general builds discussion page about it in terms of policy. I lean towards classifying them as team builds (I don't know that people search for "solo" builds that require help). -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 09:39, 4 January 2007 (CST)
 * I certianly understand the dilema. I think if it stayed in team builds with its current name it would be where it belongs.  I guess the thing to consider is where are Hero Battle builds going to show up (other than the HB page)?  Are they going to have a place in the Tested Builds page under Team builds?
 * If you do merge this build into the 2 player, you would effectively kill the "hero farming" idea. It would almost never be seen accept by people looking for "me and my buddy" builds.  I personaly had no interest in Redux but I saw the name, and was curious.  I tried the build and I like it quite a bit.  If it was a footnote in Redux, I would have never seen it.  If I had somehow come accross it, I would have basically had to re-invent the wheel as far as the specifics of running it with a hero.--67.186.242.16 14:11, 4 January 2007 (CST)

(resetting indent) Discussion on categorization is Build talk:Main Page please comment there if you have opinions on policy regarding hero+human. ty. -- Oblio (talk) 15:07, 4 January 2007 (CST)


 * Jyro doesn't want to touch it without wider consensus. I lack the decisiveness of a Rapta, so I'm just putting a merge vote up there. -- [[Image:Ranger-icon-small.png|25px]]Oblio (talk) 11:19, 8 January 2007 (CST)

From looking at the discussion and the vote, it is apparant to me that the majority feels as though this article should be merged. I merged the article by mentioning the note about a hero in the main article. If you wish to elaborate on the note, please feel free to do so. I have put a deletion notice on this article however since it is now useless. — Jyro X 15:31, 9 January 2007 (CST)

Categories
I removed the categories (again) on this until it is tested (thats standard policy). I don't know what went on with them in terms of revert's, but policy says they stay off until tested. We'll see what goes on with the merge stuff. I posted something to the builds talk about the problem in general (of how to categorize hero+human farming). pax. -- Oblio (talk) 14:40, 4 January 2007 (CST)

Rebirth?
``` ok i tested it and it works good but what does the starter mean buy " if you die use rebirth then use resurect chant on your self??? &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by lilnate22 (contribs).
 * When the 55 dies, he will have 1 HP when resurected. Rebirth brings the player back with 25% HP, meaning 1/4 HP.  GW rounds this down to 0, so the 55 insta dies.  However, the body is brought to the feet of the ranger.  Then the ranger uses chant, rezing the 55 with up to the ranger's HP, in this case 1 HP.  The 55 can then transfer to the -20 offhand. &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by Milgram (contribs).