Talk:The Dragon's Lair (mission)

This will need formatting and possible information correcting I guess.

Is it fair to say that Glint is the hardest boss in the game? I haven't completed the Underworld or Fissure of Woe yet, so I can't say how hard they are... In which case, can we safely say that Glint is the hardest mission bonus? I met someone who had tried it 25 times by the time I did the mission! LordBiro/Talk 21:05, 15 Jun 2005 (EST)

I agree that Glint is pretty damn hard, for sure the hardest single critter I've met in the game so far (including a trip to the Fissure). By the way: there seem to be two "Dragon's Lair" mission entries, this one and: Dragon's Lair... --84.175.108.214 07:08, 24 Jun 2005 (EST)

Shouldn't this be "The Dragon's Lair"? That is how it is listed on the map.

I've been in the FoW (but not UW), and I can say that Glint blows away anything there in terms of difficulty. Watch when she uses the skill that gives her +7 health regeneration, it barely does anything! That's how much health she has! The last time I tried it, we had a E/N with Grenth's Balance, and when she used it, she said it was doing 400+ damage, but it really looked like nothing. :( --Big Blue 05:01, 20 Sep 2005 (EST)
 * Glint is the hardest thing in the game, by eons.. Nothing comes close. The Lich Lord is a whimp. :) The other two level 30s, the Dragon Lich and Rotscale, are like Life Pods compared to her! :)
 * She's hands down the hardest single beast in the game, but if you use egg baiting and have a couple of characters with interrupts for Hibernation, she's a piece of cake. Just beat her in a party of 7 with henchie healers today. --Kiiron 18:22, 18 November 2005 (UTC)
 * I was in a party with two awesome interrupt rangers (and my ele was the shutdown mesmer), we took her down in 3 minutes. Dang! It was the proudest I've been since finding my first shard :) The whole idea is once she got to below 50% health, computer stupidity took over. She kept trying to do Crystal Hibernation only to be interrupted by one of us and try again. She didn't even attempt a single hit. --Karlos 03:44, 19 November 2005 (UTC)
 * I think we may have to review the statement of Glint being the toughest thing in the game. After the recent, ahem, "enhancement" of Rotscale, that is. :) --84-175 (talk) 19:06, 16 June 2006 (CDT)
 * I really think Glint's status of "the hardest enemy in the gam" should be revoked. After all, me and an Alliance mate just went in and with the help of 6 henchmen brought down Glint. He was a SS necro, and I have my own build. Basically, the way we beat Glint was: Ignite Arrows, Dual Shot, and Needling Shot, keeping her constantly running away. In fact, I think I will add this strategy. Gimmethegepgun 21:15, 5 October 2006 (CDT)

I can't remember if this is possible since my mesmer never got this far before he bit the dust, but since Crystal Haze and Crystal Bonds are both Hex spells, can Inspired Hex be used to both remove the spells and cast them back at Glint? (I'm asking this because I can't remember if Monster only hexes can be 'stolen' like this.) If not Shatter Hex is always a nice alternative (particularly if it's used on the warrior wacking away at her)
 * I've added a note in the Tips section about Inspired Hex. It isn't useful in the sense you describe, but since you can't steal Monster only hexes, it's very easy to quickly remove all the hexes.--RadiKS 18:00, 18 April 2006 (CDT)

Does anyone know what type of damage glint's fireballs inflict? I'm assuming fire damage, but that's not neccessarily the case. It could be tested out with the various mesmer stances.

Is Backfire really that useful? Crystal Haze seems to have a cooldown of about 30 seconds (I've never seen her recast it before its duration expired), and Crystal Bonds seems to have a cooldown of about 10 seconds (whenever she recast it, Remove Hex had already recharged), so it seems unlikely that Backfire would trigger more than once per casting, and might not trigger at all. Shatter Hex inflicts nearly as much damage with the added benefit of hex removal, and, if the hexes aren't instant cast, Power Spike should inflict nearly as much damage for 2/3 of the energy with the added benefit of interruption.

Changes and addition
Getting rid of the Backfire being recommended in the tips portion when facing Glint. My reasoning for this is two fold. First, only 2 of the skills Crystal Haze and Crystal Bonds actually set this hex off and neither of them are used very often. The second reason is the fact that Hexes and Conditions last half of their specified time against Glint. This was tested with Phantom Pain(constant 10 second duration) and Midnight Signet(15 second duration). The hex and the condition both only lasted half the length they were supposed to. I'll leave the Empathy recommendation due to the fact I have not tested this against Glint myself.

The addition to tips I'll place is about Hexes and Conditions lasting half their normal duration against Glint. While it may be common knowledge, someone looking for tips may not realize this.

Does the Dragon Egg aggro thing still work even though they nerfed the gear and stuff?


 * no, it does not

Map
I was playing through this mission yesterday, and for the first time I realized that the different areas are actually all part of the same larger map - I spotted Forgotten Cursebearers off in the distance when I was in the Facet of Chaos area, then I realized that you can see the Forgotten Gate Keeper from both of the first two facets. Since I'd never seen or heard of anyone else making a map of this mission, I took it upon myself to create a compass-screenshot map of this area. &mdash;Dr Ishmael (talk|contribs) 16:51, 27 August 2006 (CDT)

November 21st Update
I quote from here: Fixed bugs and made improvements to the following missions: Nahpui Quarter, Dragon’s Lair, Riverside Province. This update seems to of changed the range of the portals to bare minimum. Double check with me if you want but I am removing part of the warning.

Oh... actually jsut ignore me

Have to agree with this. Portals require you to practically walk into them now. Go ahead and remove the warning. Entropy 18:31, 29 November 2006 (CST)

Two things...
a) "Glint is by far the hardest creature in the game"

Bringing it up again. Let's compare with the other hard things in Prophecies. Difficulty to reach? Bonuses? What kind of group is needed? How long will the fight take? How dangerous is the foe?
 * Glint - Easy, shouldn't even have any deaths. An hour max.
 * Rotscale - Generally needs a runner to reach in a timely manner, so it can actually be harder and/or take longer. Time variable.
 * Lich - Somewhat difficult to reach, even with a good party, as you actually have to pay attention to what you're doing. At least an hour.
 * Glint - 10% Morale boost from all facets. No deaths.
 * Rotscale - 10% Morale boost plus other bonuses if you have favor.
 * Lich - At best a 10% Morale boost, though this can be a bit hard to pull off due to the nature of the mission.
 * Glint - PUG that has a monk. Need 1 interrupt. Full hench is fine.
 * Rotscale - Pretty well coordinated and experienced human group. Can't hench. Need heavy prot monk, constant Dazed or Interruption, or other specialized roles...
 * Lich - An above average PUG with two monks. Probably no special roles needed. Full hench works.
 * Glint - Not very long. Perhaps 20 minutes or less?
 * Rotscale - Several hours.
 * Lich - Depends on how many times he decides to respawn, anywhere from 20 minutes to 40 minutes, I'm thinking.
 * Glint - Not very. A Prot monk and a Heal monk can keep anyone alive indefinitely versus Glint. Crystal Haze won't be cast below 90% health and is easily removed. If Crystal Hibernation is not interrupted, a mere stalemate results.
 * Rotscale - Even under heavy interruption and such, quite dangerous - high potential threat level. Can wipe out even a Warrior in two - three hits.
 * Lich - Uses Unholy Feast and normal attacks deal 100 damage or more, but not very dangerous overall. More of an attrition battle; deaths unlikely.

So, yeah. In comparison Glint is either easier or as hard to Rotscale or Lich. Therefore she's not the hardest thing in game. Only thing really going for her is Crystal Hibernation but what good group doesn't have at least 1 interrupt.


 * The difficulty in reaching Rotscale and the Lich, and also their companions has nothing to do with whether those creatures are more difficult or not. Yes, you can devise a strategy to defeat Glint, but also to defeat the others once they are alone.  The only thing you need to know about the Lich is to deliver the killing blow only when he's on the dias; you don't need any sort of strategy whatsover.  I've never lost against the Lich, only beat Glint once in about 10 tries.  No comparison there.  Don't know about Rotscale, but I doubt he has the health of Glint but may have the advantage of attacking often when Glint instead chooses to cast an interuptable skill often.  Oye 00:26, 13 January 2007 (CST)


 * Glint has been soloed before. She is that easy. And your information regarding killing the Lich is incorrect, though that's irrelevant. In any case, Glint is a complete wimp. Entropy 22:17, 4 February 2007 (CST)


 * Ihave to disagree about the "several hours" for Rotscale. Granted that I did not actually killed him ; but :
 * it takes about 15mn to reach his place.
 * you can get rid of all his companions in less than 30mn ; I know that : I've soloed this with my assassin. A full group should be able to achieve far better.
 * I doubt the fight against any single monster could thus last for more than one hour! before ten minutes, it should either be close to death, or you know you cannot kill it (that the case with my assassin ; I cannot kill him, he cannot kill me).Yves 14:17, 6 March 2007 (CST)

b) About Alternative 3

Greater Conflagration is not available all the way until Hell's Precipice, the very last mission in the game. :S Also, it is not "by far" the easiest way to win. Jagged Crystal Skin is not very dangerous. It'll only have some effect if there's someone standing right next to Glint - aka if there is a tank in the group. It is by far easier to remove the stance with Wild Blow than to waste your Elite slot on Greater Conflagration, which btw has no other use in the entire mission. By far, what is most important is to carry at least one interrupt to deal with Crystal Hibernation. To a lesser extent, hex removal is useful but not 100% necessary.

I'll change the note to say it's an idea to consider trying. But it's definitely not an easy way to do the mission. Entropy 01:44, 24 December 2006 (CST)


 * Addendum: actually it's not even an "alternative", in light of the others listed. The other alternatives are truly alternate strategies - an AoE flee exploit and a Trap spike. This is just a recommendation to bring a specific skill. I'm going to just incorporate it into the rest of the article instead. Entropy 01:52, 24 December 2006 (CST)

Necromancer
Signet of Sorrow. Period. No other skills needed (rest for other parts of mission).

Let a pet (or party member) die next to glint, and have the W tanks stay there, next to the pet, keeping her attention. Once pet or party member is dead, keep them dead (no res/comfort animal). Start spamming Signet of Sorrow, which as a signet, has no worries about exhaustion or energy depletion, and with a corpse nearby, no recharge.

With 3 heroes and 4 henchies, I killed her in less than 5 minutes, probably more like 3 to 4. This was with Soul Reaping at lvl 11. With 2 Necros spamming this Nightfall skill, it wouldn't be a far fetch to say you could kill her in 2 minutes or less. Queen Schmuck 22:31, 6 January 2007 (CST)


 * Bahahahaa! Now, THAT's a good idea, and totally pwn's Glint status as a "hard mob". Although I think I've beaten her faster than that. :) Good suggestion, it should be included in the article! Entropy 22:34, 6 January 2007 (CST)


 * And it's not even elite, so you can bring along Spoil Victor, too. >.> &mdash; 130.58 (talk) 00:36, 13 January 2007 (CST)

Death Nova
Pointed that Death Nova is cast at Death Magic 0 in the Facet of Darkness. Glenn 12:38, 29 January 2007 (CST)

Ascalon Warriors
What's with all those corpses of Ascalon Warriors in the Domain of Energy Degeneration?? -- Nova   --  (contribs) 17:48, 17 February 2007 (CST)
 * Corpse exploitation targets. 8P  Queen Schmuck 17:50, 17 February 2007 (CST)
 * Haha, but why don't they make it like... something that makes more sense? Like, Elonian Warrior or something. And plus, I think the first time I did this mission, I got there fast enough to see the Ascalon Warriors fight.. and then die... ?? -- Nova  [[Image:NovaSmall.PNG]] --  (contribs) 17:54, 18 February 2007 (CST)

2 sigs of cap?
I removed the 2 sigs of cap note but it was added back? Wtf? The only elite that we'd want first-timers to have without speccing into the attribute accordingly would be GB. Don't give noobs 5 skill slots to work with >_> –Ichigo724 20:15, 20 February 2007 (CST)


 * I see little harm in the note. Many first-timers will do the mission and attempt the bonus halfheartedly, knowing they need a better build or team for it. Those folks carry two Sigs to save from having to make more trips later on. Dragon's Lair is an exceedingly easy and safe place to cap six different elites, one from each class - I don't see a reason not to take two Sigs if you're not planning on defeating Glint the first time around. And if you are, then you will be smart enough not to take sigs of capture. That would be like taking an SoC along on a Rot run (I know he's not cappable but it's the concept). Have a little more faith in newbies... besides, it fixes DP. :) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:49, 21 February 2007 (CST)


 * Besides, the note says you may bring two signets. It doesn't tell anybody that they must. It reminds people of an option they have, which might not be obvious on first glance. I vividly remember my frustration when I noticed I should've saved my signet for Gladiator's Defense, instead of blowing it right in the beginning for Shield of Regeneration back when I first did that mission. ;)--84-175 (talk) 07:20, 21 February 2007 (CST)


 * And I remember going through here the first time on my Warrior, with no SoC at all. Then I came back in six more trips because I never thought about carrying two at once. So, yeah. ;) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 07:22, 21 February 2007 (CST)

Ugh, fine, even more reason to go with henchies or guildies in stead of pug's there now >_> –Ichigo724 09:51, 21 February 2007 (CST)


 * Don't give noobs 5 skill slots to work with. There are 8 skill slots, so you will be giving newbies 6 skill slots (if they choose not to carry a rez) and then when they cap their elites, they will most likely have 3 elites to work with. I always carried 2 sigs if need to and beat Glint nearly everytime with hench (she's not that hard if you know what you are doing), before the intro of heroes, because I hate PuGs and I don't like asking for help. &mdash; Gares 10:07, 21 February 2007 (CST)
 * Everyone should have a res in a normal pve pug.
 * All secondary elites capped there besides GB would be near useless unless specced into.
 * I know glint isn't hard, but it is for first-timers. I remember how satisfying it was to beat her for the first time ^^
 * –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 10:16, 21 February 2007 (CST)
 * Carrying a res in a PuG, yeah, that's automatic. I was speaking from a full hench standpoint. I can't stand PuGs and I don't carry a rez with full hench unless I think I might need it. In Dragon's Lair, I don't need it.
 * You are right about the secondary elites, though Glad's and SoR can give you some help. Glads with a 5 sec limit to block 75% of attacks and SoR to give you +3 regen and 40ar for 5 seconds, but SoR isn't worth it unless it's dire since its 15erg cost. And I remember my first time killing Glint, suprisingly it was after 3 or 4 failed PuGs and I went to hench. That was a long time ago. Ahhh...memories :D &mdash; Gares 10:41, 21 February 2007 (CST)
 * Ah, yeah, agreed when going with henchies. I always grab PuG's when there are people available, I think it's more fun. Might as well play a single player game if I'm only henching :/. Took me a few tries to kill glint as well, I capped MR on my first go there, since I'd heard about it being there (before I even knew of the wiki, it was only a few weeks after guild wars was released though, with half my R/E bar filled with ele skills ^_^) Ah yes... I think I even have a screen of my first time killing her, me and my party were so happy we stayed at the corpse for nearly 5 minutes...lol ^^ –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 10:57, 21 February 2007 (CST)

I hope this has settled. :P My opinion is pretty much, the 2 sigs of capture can add up to making the mission & bonus even EASIER once you cap the two elites, + helping you out later in the game. The elites there are pretty uber, too. Also, the mission is very easy, even with henchmen. All I did was help the henchies co-ordinate the attacks and interrupt Glint's Crystal Hibernation. The henchies did the rest of the work for me. Not one henchman died. It was my first attempt to complete Dragon's Lair with henchies, too. I think even a complete noob could do this mission with henchmen. -- Nova   --  (contribs) 15:36, 21 February 2007 (CST)
 * Thing is, not everyone has interrupts on their bar, which pretty much means kthxbyestefan&thom. –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 16:18, 21 February 2007 (CST)
 * Hero/Hench party is pretty easy w/o interrupts. See  above.  If your character isn't a necro, bring one of the necro heroes.  (Granted you'll need Nightfall to do this.)  --Rainith 17:06, 21 February 2007 (CST)
 * Like you said: you need NF to do that, which not everyone has. –Ichigo724[[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 17:45, 21 February 2007 (CST)
 * ...not everyone, but especially newbies. :P Yeah, but my point isn't doing it with henchmen, but that it's just not that hard. -- Nova  [[Image:NovaSmall.PNG]] --  (contribs) 18:02, 21 February 2007 (CST)

Image with henchies and heroes
Note: Melonni had wild blow, which made up for Stefan's lack of it. Acolyte Jin was a touch ranger. Moo Cow Extreme
 * Dun mean to rain on your parade, but Glint's been soloed before...not a huge deal anymore to do with hench, or heroes. She's officially no longer hard. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:20, 26 February 2007 (CST)
 * The improvements to henchmen AI mean that the bonus for The Dragon's Lair and both the mission and bonus of Thunderhead Keep aren't as hard as they used to be. --220.233.103.77 01:35, 26 February 2007 (CST)

No vanity pics on article pages
Put vanity pics in Talk page if you want to show them, or better, on your user page. Berek beat me to it, but here is the image the user was putting on the page in various places. Queen Schmuck 23:26, 27 March 2007 (CDT)


 * No idea why it was being put on main page. I only moved it here so the user might know why it was removed from main page.  Thanks for the cleanup.  :P  Queen Schmuck 23:32, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
 * heh - sorry about the confusion ... was actually cleaning up image for the section above this one. Looks like there's an older version of that one in history relevant to the above talk though. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 23:33, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
 * EDIT CONFLICT: OH! I see what you are saying, the image above this one, of a monk standing.  Yeah, see my note on the talk page for that pic.  I suggested it be renamed or deleted, way to ambiguous.  Queen Schmuck 23:36, 27 March 2007 (CDT)


 * I see now, thanks for the help guys. Added some details which were suggested, and a signature to the picture. Hope this works better! Cheyenne 23:09, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
 * Oye, sorry, had to fix a small thing in the description of the picture. It was a SS who helped us not a MM. My mind is still stuck on my MM I have been working on, lol. Cheyenne 23:39, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
 * No problem. BTW, Wild Blow her Jagged Crystal Skin stance to keep the tanks fighting.  :P  Queen Schmuck 01:41, 29 March 2007 (CDT)