GuildWiki:Requests for adminship/M.mendel

=== M.mendel (talk &bull; contribs &bull; edit count &bull; RFA page) ===

I think that he has shown many qualities that a good admin should have. He has shown a great interest in bettering this wiki and putting it back "on top". I think that having mendel as an admin could only turn out great! -- Shadowphoenix  18:23, 29 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Candidate, please indicate acceptance of the nomination here:

I am flattered to be nominated here, after a mere 2 3 months on the wiki, and my share of raising controversial issues.

However, this RfA catches me unprepared; maybe it comes too early. Today I am still in shock over seeing the wiki through the default skin, and was thinking of announcing that I would refuse to edit any pages that have ads in the page body (banners top and bottom I don't mind, as long as they don't come with a fake header - as the bottom ad currently does -, and a sidebar ad would be ok even if the sidebar has to expand slightly to 300px) because I don't want my work presented that way.

Besides that, I probably could support myself only with reservations: a mere 2 months on the wiki, holding minority opinions on certain issues (how much that'd affect my adminning is anyone's guess), likely to use "undelete" more often than "delete".

I hope you can understand that, on the whole, I wouldn't mind if the RfA was shelved for another month.

A month has come and gone, I'm still here. So I guess that's good. Yes, I would like to be an admin. It helps with "power editing": editing Mediawiki namespace, being able to move more than 2 pages at a time, being able to delete my typos and false starts myself is going to be directly helpful.

There remains the issue about banning. As you all know, I am the voice of moderation here, believing that in the long run, mediation and pushing for a compromise are going to be more effective than wielding the banstick. I've been discussing this for as long as I've been a registered user on this wiki, and I'm likely to keep raising these issues whenever they come up, whether I'm promoted or not. Is there compromise in sight? Maybe.

--◄mendel► 06:07, 30 July 2008 (UTC), amended 06:26, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

Please discuss the candidate's qualifications on the talkpage, and consolidate the summaries below:

Supporting arguments

 * I had been mulling this over for the last day or so trying to figure out exactly my position on this. I love your diplomacy and the fact that you are very personable, and on top of that, you're extremely knowledgeable of the way things work. You can go in and fix the code, and then later explain with excellent eloquence why the change was made and what exactly was done. You generally do the right thing and make the choice for the betterment of the the unrepresented and timid voices over (occasionally) the majority of the wiki's opinion. It is for these reasons that I support this RfA. However, I feel I must point out the problems I do have with this, and why it took me so long to decide exactly whether or not I would support Mendel. The main reason is that I feel that he point out that policies should be changed by abrasive example. Rather than logically stating his case, he will occasionally seek out the embodiment of the problem and then put up a mock argument (which is by all means believable and might, in fact, be genuine) using points taken from current policies on why the rational decision should be made. The only real example I can think of is the Acorns fiasco. But, as I said, he may have had an entirely different reason for doing such. &mdash; Powersurge360 Violencia   07:16, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm supporting Mendel for adminship, although I can understand the reasons why others are a bit opposed to it. First of all, his contributions are good, well thought, helpfull and well explained. I dare to say that there is no other contributer that is that helpfull to newcomers, respectfull of pointing out mistakes and are always willing to explain his actions in a decent, well-thought way. Although others might disagree, I like the way he points to things that might contradict, the use of policies and other things that nobody actually was considering, until Mendel pointed it out to them. Wikidrama ? maybe, but a good way to think about what we are doing here, what the role of an admin is, the role of policies in order to get a better understanding and agreement how to deal with this ever changing wiki and users. Good discussion doesn't break communities, it only makes them stronger. In the past months, I couldn't help getting the feeling that a lot of 'old' wiki users/admins/contributers/whatever do have some 'elitist' way of work. Rejecting changes without explaination, not helping newcomers but scaring them off, making bold statements in discussions in line off 'this is what we always do, I don't want to discuss it'. By choosing Mendel as admin, I think we have a good counterweight for this behavior. All admins being Mendel like would be a disaster (or change Mendels name with any other Admin), but one will be good for at least reflection, conscience and objectivity to all that matters here.-- [[Image:merty_sign.gif]]-- ( talk ) 09:53, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Since mendel has already turned down the nomination, I won't waste my time with a lengthy comment, but I will say that he certainly fulfills Auron's desire for "movers and shakers" on the wiki (even though he may not move/shake in the direction Auron wants...). Like others, I am a little concerned about how often he would reverse the decisions of other admins (un-banning and un-deleting), but I feel that's a minor issue that could be worked through as/if it happens.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 13:32, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * --[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 17:36, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, you've done a good job, I can see the reasons, but choose to support you on your good actions that you have done so far! Random Time  10:20, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Now, i understand that it is considered bad form to bet on the outcomes of rfas, but i really want to. I predict that mendel won't get in. Now that the violation of acceptable protocol is out of the way, i support Mendel for admin because, although i disagree with his approach to many things, he is always willing to explain his points and debate opposing arguments without the whole thing degenerating into a flame war. This suggests mendel is able to use an Admins right of arbitration in a content dispute appropiately. Secondly, mendel seems to have vast technical knowledge of wiki code and everything else code and thus can perform the admins role of advising other users and acting in coding related matters effectively. That leaves the admins powers of ban/del/prot. Personally, i don't see mendel using delete much (acorns, anyone?) - but we have other admins for that and he can continue his weird page-adoption schemes. Protect is hardly ever used anyway and its fairly obvious when its needed, i don't think any special qualities are required before we trust someone with that tool. As for banning, pfft, banning vandal's isn't particularly complicated and mendel's willingness to debate matters of disagreement suggest he wouldn't go around banning his personal enemies (does he have any?) or whatever. Therefore, going by the "an admin is just a user with extra tools" tack taken by our esteemed bureaucrats in various arguments, mendel is perfectly qualified for adminship. --[[Image:Cobalt6.jpg|50x19px]] - (Talk /Contribs ) 18:53, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Opposing arguments

 * Strongly opposed. While mendel has undoubtedly been extremely helpful and motivated in such mundane and necessary wikitasks as categorizing, cleaning up and formatting, these are not tasks which require admin tools to complete. Glancing over User:M.mendel/Admin_Criteria, I can move quickly through the criteria that he himself urges existing administrators to consider, and find that nearly every one reflects unfavorably upon him.  Deleting?  While mendel deleting pages is not likely to be an issue, undeleting pages that ought not to exist is an easily foreseeable event.  Banning?  Again, mendel is not somebody who seems banhappy.  In fact, he doesn't seem like he would ban errant IP addresses at all, despite necessity.  It is more likely he would unban IPs that have been blocked for disruption or nonsensical edits.  This is not a tool that is necessary in his wiki tenure.  Conflict moderation?  Two words:  Wiki Drama.  Three, if you want to add "Acorns."  Rule enforcement?  In a 1984 sort of way.  Rules that support his arguments are flaunted and rigidly adhered to, and others are ignored.  Community trust and Ability to compromise?  While mendel is willing to compromise, the situations in which he is willing to do so usually should not have become an issue at all, and are blown out of proportion due solely to his GuildWiki Crusades, which makes community trust an issue.  While the breed of wikidrama mendel creates is rarely, if ever, malicious, and is simply time-consuming and pointless, it is wikidrama nonetheless.
 * In closing: Wall of text.  While perhaps in the future a skilled and capable administrator, mendel has within the last few weeks shown many traits that are not benefiting an admin of this wiki. [[Image:Maui_sig.png]] 09:32, 30 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Opposed. I like the work that Mendel does - he embodies that go-getter spirit which fails to blossom in many users until much later in their Wiki career. Always willing to shake things up, challenge the norm, work on new and experimental things, argue policy...that's great. However, that being said, I have to say that I would not personally trust Mendel as an admin. All inferences of personal bias aside ("what bias?"), I do not like the way he views bans and deletions; while it is true that admins may freely counteract each other, it is highly encouraged that they discuss the issue and at least agree to disagree before taking an action. To give a worst-case picture, I could see Mendel constantly arguing with other admins about retroactively shortening bans and undeleting all sorts of pages just to move them to "Anonymous pages". Now, I'm not saying that is what would happen - but the fact that I even consider it a possibility means that I don't think Mendel is ready yet for this position; and he seems to agree, if for different reasons. To sum up: I think Mendel is a great user with many excellent traits that others could model themselves after; I think he has the potential for sysoption some day, but not right now. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 13:33, 3 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Strongly Opposed Because I'm nasty and vindictive. On the basis of the argument "We can just undelete any screw-ups he makes", anyone is a good candidate for adminship. So Meh. Mendel seems to have an argumentative nature, and takes up policies like GW:YAV and GW:AGF waay too far. Heck, if somone returned with the podax vandal Mendel would probably call for their unbanning, as per GW:AGF. So there. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 14:10, 3 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Mega Oppose I'll have to cut this short because of time issues, so here goes. Mendel is too soft. He's a huge proponent of "can do no wrong" in some cases. In other cases, he'll get pretty argumentative taking it too far and not articulating much of anything other than "I feel that this ___". Feelings are bad. Arguing is bad. Excessive softness is bad. Mendel would be a bad sysop.  —ǥrɩɳsɧƴ ɖɩđđɭɘş  [[Image:Grinshpon blinky cake 2.gif|19px]] 14:42, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I feel that I must comment on "softness" - A so-called carebear sysop is not inherently a bad thing, and actually we don't currently really have any. If nothing else they help to make new users feel more welcome and provide more fodder for discussion and dissent. At their worst they can cripple a Wiki through inaction and beating around the bush on everything. The fact that Mendel does argue sometimes, shows that he's not totally one way or another - he will fight ferociously when motivated. So I'm not too concerned with that. Of course, compromise is always an ideal to aim towards... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:58, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm a carebear sysop, and if you got a problem with that then SCREW YOU! --[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 17:31, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * If you're a carebear, so am I. &mdash;[[Image:MaySig.png]] Warw/Wick 19:59, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Neither of you are, trust me. Also, this is what the talkpage is for. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 07:58, 7 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Oppose *sigh*, glancing over both the support and oppose lists i feel really bad transferring to here, and i would have remained supporting mendel if i didn't come to notice this comment "I'd be likely to retroadjust bans...". I had assumed that mendels opposition to banning would be limited to largely leaving it to other sysops, rather than actually directly interfering with the process. Really, if the wiki is to run properly, the admin's need to respect each others decisions in matters such as banning otherwise the whole process will just degenerate into some kind of sysop war. I don't think mendel would compromise his own principles just to get into the adminship, but as these conflict with the best interests of the wiki as a whole im afraid i have to oppose.--[[Image:Cobalt6.jpg|50x19px]] - (Talk /Contribs ) 18:55, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

Neutral/Double-edged arguments

 * It's really hard to decide whether to support or oppose this. While Mendel is a good contributor, he tends to be fairly confrontational. He usually plays the devil's advocate in a conflict, which is probably a good thing to keep us in check, but also does create copious wiki-drama. It could either be a very good thing or a very bad thing if he got promoted, with no way of telling beforehand.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  04:50, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Some prediction help: having admin tools available would impact my behaviour today in the following ways:
 * Unless there is a clear consensus expressed that we approve of punitive bans (to me, a laughable concept: punishing someone by telling them "you may not edit this wiki" works on very few people), I'd be likely to retroadjust bans that don't accomplish anything (besides "punishment"), so that's an issue that probably needs discussion before I can be trusted with that.
 * I'd undelete more pages to move them to Anonymous pages or the author's space. Probably not a problem.
 * I'd be able to work in MediaWiki namespace. I'm good enough at coordinating changes that it won't likely produce conflict.
 * I think you overestimate how often I play devil's advocate, though. --◄mendel► 07:11, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * (rebuttals to above argument here)