User talk:LordBiro



Archives


 * 1) May 2005 – May 2006
 * 2) Nightfall Profession Icons


 * /Archive 1

Leave Me A Message
Hi, its Aleski, thanks for letting me know about the report a vandal page. Merci beacoup :) -- Aleski

Hi...i was just wondering if you could maybe make an icon for me like you did for Gem. Just a hyperish once would be nice. You are awesome. Thanx!

&mdash; Hypernecrofear


 * No, that was a one off. And yes, I am awesome.  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 01:33, 27 June 2006 (CDT)


 * Sorry LordBiro, I didn't mean to start a trend. :) --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] 03:18, 27 June 2006 (CDT)


 * Don't worry Gem, I can't even think of a good icon for myself!  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 03:21, 27 June 2006 (CDT)


 * I can tell. Btw, you ARE a awesome! --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] 03:22, 27 June 2006 (CDT)


 * Why thankyou, Gem, you're not bad yourself ;)  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 03:25, 27 June 2006 (CDT)

I know this is in response to old content, but I have to point out that "Who else thinks we should start GuildWiki is not a pipe?" has had me laughing for about 10 minutes now. -- Oblio


 * lol :) I'm glad you liked it! :D  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 11:17, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

Uum hi Mr. LordBiro this is Naf i cant edit a page because you said i vandalised and i swear i havent is this a bug or did u ban me? I have a talk page if you happen to find this message Thank you for your time.
 * I got this one. :)  --Rainith 00:34, 23 November 2006 (CST)

GuildWiki Policy
I've messed with Policy. I don't know if you still bother with this sort of thing, but I'm warning all the admins so as to get everyone on board. :) &mdash;Tanaric 18:45, 5 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hey Tanaric, I do like to keep up with policy changes so thanks for letting me know!  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 05:53, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

Banning Question
Hey LordBiro why'd you ban me. I didnt do anything to unappease the gods. Grenth&#39;s Sword 22:56, 8 August 2006 (CDT)
 * In the logs, Lord Biro hasn't done a ban recently. Did you post on this page on the same connection on which you received the warning?  If so, then the fact that you can post now suggests that the ban message is likely a result of a known bug.  A false ban message is sometimes presented.  It most often impacts users who are not logged in (using an IP address) at the time that the error was generated.  :It could also be that you're using a dynamic IP address, and the random one to which you were assigned by your ISP just happenned to be a blocked one from some other user being banned. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 23:07, 8 August 2006 (CDT)

When i tried to make a change to one of my builds, it said id been blocked. then i posted that message on Lordbiro's page, and it allowed me to. Then i tried to make the edit to my build again, but that time it said i was blocked. yet you say Lord Biro hasnt blocked anyone lately. Rarrrrrrggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh!

Lol i tried to post the above message ^ on my user page, but it aid i was blocked. i logged on and didnt know i got a warning. i logged in then tried to make a build change, and the rest is above. Grenth&#39;s Sword
 * If you know your IP address, you can try sending me an email at spam.home@comcast.net and I can verify its ban status; but if you're able to post intermittently, it sounds like the bug to me. When you get the error, you can try going back to the prior screen then try posting again. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 23:24, 8 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hey Grenth's Sword, as Barek said I haven't carried out a ban for some time now, and even then I very rarely carry out bans other than for mass vandalism. I can't suggest any more than Barek has suggested. If you'd like my email address to discuss this off-wiki then just ask :)  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 03:36, 9 August 2006 (CDT)

Rit icon
i just ran into an interesting problem with the formatting of Unique items list (Factions), the Rt icon is too short and it's throwing off the table layout. since you're draft2 icons are undoubtedly going to be the next version, could you center the icons on a standard sized transparency to prevent this style of formatting wierdness? --Honorable Sarah 12:11, 16 August 2006 (CDT)


 * I've updated the icon. The only problem I foresee now is that, even if I pad every icon so that it meets 36x36, the Paragon icon is very wide and at the size in draft 2 it would be 46 pixels wide, including the shadow. I can trim a few pixels off that, but probably not 10. What do you think?  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 12:56, 16 August 2006 (CDT)


 * I think we should be able to standardize the profession icon size. I don't see any reason to limit ourselves to having that standard be 36x36, we could set our own standard to whatever size works; using a 36 height with a 46 width for all icons should work just as well, shouldn't it? --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 13:20, 16 August 2006 (CDT)
 * i don't think a square box matters so much, as long as it is the same box so they can be inserted uniformly. it's ANet's fault, stupid wrong-aspect-ness-ritualist-icon. --Honorable Sarah [[image:Honorable_Icon.gif]] 13:45, 16 August 2006 (CDT)


 * I think the problem with the paragon icon is that the current draft is too fat (I've already told you how much I love your work, I'm allowed a little criticism too, right? ;)). Methinks the (hexagon?) base shape is too wide and it wouldn't hurt to snip a good portion of it, bringing the total shape more towards a bird and less towards a Lego with wings. With my limited GIMP-skills, I've made something that slightly resembles what I mean, for reference: [[image:para36x36.png]]. All I did was cut out the center 5 pixels, crop and resize to 36x36. -- [[Image:Bishop_icon2.png]] Bishop [ rap|con ] 15:33, 16 August 2006 (CDT)


 * That's fair enough Bishop, but what about when you consider the flower cut-out as well? You lose some detail when you try and get that much detail in a 36x36 block.


 * Besides, I really wanted it to look like a hexagon with wings. Seriously. :P


 * If you want to continue playing with the shape Bishop then I would suggest that you presume that draft 2 of the Paragon icon is going to be used.  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 17:14, 16 August 2006 (CDT)


 * isn't it supposed to be a shield with wings? that seems like an ideal icon for a holy commander. --Honorable Sarah [[image:Honorable_Icon.gif]] 17:19, 16 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Initially I started working from that, but it looked very much like a Warrior icon with some wings shoved on it. And I didn't think that was good enough. So I thought, you know, a hexagon shape would be cool. So there you go!  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 17:26, 16 August 2006 (CDT)


 * i still think it looks like a shield, maybe one of those Ornate Shields. whatever. i like it.--Honorable Sarah [[image:Honorable_Icon.gif]] 17:35, 16 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Well, uh, I didn't work from the cutout shape because while I think it looks really great at the large size, it looks like someone shot a whole through the icon at the smaller sizes. In other words, it is detail overload -- there's just too much going on with the wings and the hole and the shape to fit into a small icon for the small purposes it needs to fill. -- [[Image:Bishop_icon2.png]] Bishop [ rap|con ] 02:53, 17 August 2006 (CDT)

I realise you can't make out the flower shape at the lower size, but I don't think it's to the detriment of the icon really. It does look simply like a hole in the logo, but I quite like that.  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 03:11, 17 August 2006 (CDT)

Background Question
I use IE while at work - I've read that IE has a problem interpreting .png transparent backgrounds correctly, so I've just accepted the constant gray background that I see. But, oddly, I noticed in the Rune article that the Dervish icon shows the background color in IE, not a gray box like all other icons on that page. Is there something formatted differently with that allows the transparent background to work, or is it a random fluke that in this one case IE was able to interpret it correctly? (note: it's only this size where it works - when I view the smaller icon, I get a gray background for those as well). --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 11:20, 17 August 2006 (CDT)


 * It is not that IE can't interpret transparent PNGs, as such, more that it can't interpret translucent PNGs. As you can see above the Dervish icon has been anti-aliased on to a white background and then the white pixels have been deleted, so on a light coloured background it looks fine. If this icon had a dropped shadow it would be noticeable even on light backgrounds.  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 11:38, 17 August 2006 (CDT)
 * Heh, I knew you were the right person to ask - always go to the expert! Thanks for explaining it!  --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 14:58, 17 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hehe, you are too kind Barek! And it's not a problem :)  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 15:57, 17 August 2006 (CDT)
 * Is there a setting in photoshop to change from using translucent PNGs to using full transparency? I find that even if I set the alpha channel to fully transparent in a typical PNG, it doesn't display correctly in IE. I was horrified when I first saw my user page which looked fine in Firefox but has the grey boxes in IE. --Thervold 15:55, 23 August 2006 (CDT)


 * My understanding is that it's a limitation of IE. If a miracle occurs, it may display correctly when IE 7 eventually comes out.  LordBiro likely has more accurate info though. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 15:59, 23 August 2006 (CDT)


 * IE6 can't interpret transparent PNGs in 24 BPP. But it CAN interpret this one: [[Image:Para36x36.png]] But its background is white all the time. But it's not grey anymore... I'll never understand Microsoft and their IE. I'll keep being a firefox user. --numma_cway 19:06, 25 August 2006 (CDT)




 * If someone is interested, this probelm isn't present at IE7. I just had to check. :P --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 19:33, 25 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Ha! I just did the same thing.  I  got the IE7 RC1 last night, but I couldn't get to guildwiki at the time.  I was just checking it now when I noticed your post Gem.  --Rainith 20:04, 25 August 2006 (CDT)

timing
so when can we see the draft π icons in production? the current icons look wierd resized. --Honorable Sarah 12:56, 20 August 2006 (CDT)
 * I'm pretty sure that they're already in. Try clearing your cache. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 13:15, 20 August 2006 (CDT)


 * The icons have been uploaded, but I guess Barek is right, your cache may be out of date. I was thinking that, in order to force people to see the correct image I could upload the icon under a different name and temporarily modify and  . After a week or so we could change back and that should be fine. What do you think?  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 13:32, 20 August 2006 (CDT)

Not sure where to put this
I can't quite fathom the above :o

Consider using a musical symbol for the paragon if the wings won't fit, they have all the chants, anthems and things. And another thing, would it be possible to blur the small mesmer icon a wee bit, it looks a bit jaggy! Great work btw ^^ &mdash; Skuld 11:32, 21 August 2006 (CDT)

For your consideration
If you would be so kind to take a look at GuildWiki talk:Don't immediately delete. Thanks. -Gares 12:48, 21 August 2006 (CDT)

Nightfall Guild Emblem Contest
just wanted to make sure you got your entry in, must be postmarked by tomarrow. i want a Greater Icon, not another beaver. Nightfall Guild Emblem Contest. --Honorable Sarah 10:09, 23 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hey Sarah, I doubt I'll be able to enter anything; my computer died yesterday. Equally this means I won't be able to do much/any work on the icons! :(  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 12:38, 23 August 2006 (CDT)
 * oh no! poor thing. i hope your baby feels better soon. ;) --Honorable Sarah [[image:Honorable_Icon.gif]] 14:42, 23 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hehe, I love that you called it my baby, that's what I call it too. Don't go telling people that though, I have a reputation to maintain :P  &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 15:13, 23 August 2006 (CDT)

Builds discussion re: site policies
You may already be aware of it, but if not can you take a look at the (long) discussion at GuildWiki_talk:Style_and_formatting/Builds and voice your opinion? I'm asking several of the currently active admins to take a look. The issue, to me, is one of interpretation of site policies and practices. I was involved in the discussions earlier, so I cannot consider myself totally unbiased in any attempt to resolve it myself. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 20:58, 23 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hi Barek, I was aware of the discussion but I wasn't aware of the recent change in opinion brought on by xas' comments. Thanks for the heads up! <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 13:10, 24 August 2006 (CDT)

Totally unimportant layout issue
It seems that your sig is messing up the table here. Any idea why? --Xeeron 04:29, 24 August 2006 (CDT)
 * I am still confused by your sig messing up that page: Take a look at the history please it randomly inserts semicolons (which I did definitly not edit in) when I move a new vote there. Confused. --Xeeron 04:49, 13 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Hey Xeeron, I have no idea why that's happening. I've altered my sig on that page to try to prevent it! <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:11, 13 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Looking at how the wikitext there is getting rendered as HTML, I'd say it's either someone else's HTML before that being messed up (perhaps unbalanced tags or improper nesting) or possibly just a bug. (MW has some fairly random bugs with its autoformatting combined with HTML in wikitext. MW can be set up to use tidy as a sort of crutch for this, but we're not using it here.) --Fyren 06:20, 13 September 2006 (CDT)

Skill quick reference layout
You have been taking part in the discussion earlier so I thought I might post to you among some others. I want this to be resolved pretty soon, so plese consider taking part in the discussion at GuildWiki_talk:Style_and_formatting/Skills. -- (talk) 20:01, 25 August 2006 (CDT)

Timestamp
You're trying to get a custom-formatted timestamp? If so, I changed User:LordBiro/Timestamp so it works, but it must be substituted and not included. produces 2006-08-25 03:58. (Apparently UTC.) --Fyren 22:58, 25 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Good stuff Fyren, this is exactly what I was after. I wasn't aware that you could use the tag inside template calls! <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 03:31, 26 August 2006 (CDT)

User:84.69.228.214
Isn't 1 week a bit short? I know I overlengthen sometimes but isn't that doing to the oposite? :P &mdash; Skuld 18:55, 26 August 2006 (CDT)


 * No, it's not too short. If he does the same again he'll no doubt be banned longer by anyone else who notices, and if I ban him again it will be for a month. I don't see the point in banning an IP address for a ridiculous amount of time when they'll probably not be back anyway. If they can't vandalize right now I imagine they'd lose interest after waiting even an hour or two. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 03:32, 27 August 2006 (CDT)
 * Doing a quick look at that IP address, it appears to be from some DSL user in the UK, I don't know about there but in Australia, if you're on DSL that chances are that your IP address changes regularly (Static IPs are only avaliable on some business plans or are an additional cost). So that person who did the vandalism gets a new IP in a few days time and someone else picks up 84.69.228.214 and finds they can't edit the GuildWiki. They also can't just create an account because it won't let them and probably couldn't be bothered working out how to email an admin and wait for the IP to be unblocked manually. So our anti-social vandal ends up winning again :( That's the big problem with banning an IP address, often a new person will get the address soon after. So I guess I agree with LordBiro there, if he/she comes back after a week doing the same thing, we can block for a longer period and with greater confidence that the IP "belongs" to that user. Shared IPs are another thing to think about though... --Xasxas256 05:58, 27 August 2006 (CDT)

Request for magic
Hi LordBiro. Can you work your magic on Image:RedExclaim.gif to make it look as pretty as Image:Quest-medium.png? I get a pixelated headache every time I see that red exclamation mark. Thanks in advance. 154.35.1.12 13:28, 28 August 2006 (CDT)


 * And that icon will be used a lot more really soon when the Nightfall PvE preview is here. We are lucky to have Biro on our team. All hail Biro! --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 13:46, 28 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Considering the way the icon is used I'd really like to try something a little more... interesting than just an exclamation mark. I'll post some ideas in a while :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 15:57, 28 August 2006 (CDT)


 * lol, what about something like this? [[Image:Warning_nightfall_128x128.png]] Maybe a little big, but it made me laugh :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 04:25, 29 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Good one. Put that in the c3 template. It will be a good reason to verifiy stuff in game after the game is kauched. ;) --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 05:54, 29 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Lol, done. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:06, 29 August 2006 (CDT)


 * That's a nice image, though I would recommend scaling it down by 15-20% or so. However it punts the issue of what to do about that ugly red exclamation mark image. If no one ever uses it again, though, I'm happy. Cf. . gr3g 07:25, 29 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Ha ha ha, I totally love it, Biro. By the way, if you find yourself feeling like doing something un-GW-related, I could use your help with a logo for a different project... ;) -- [[Image:Bishop_icon2.png]] Bishop [ rap|con ] 13:35, 30 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hey Bishop :) I've been having a look at the fansite kit that they provide. It should be fairly easy to do something there, I'll post any updates to that wiki directly ;) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 17:00, 30 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Thanks Biro, I knew I could count on you. You da man. :) --Bishop 05:17, 31 August 2006 (CDT)


 * I created a red exclamation mark. [[Image:RedExclaim.png]] Maybe it could be used. --numma_cway 15:10, 31 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hehe, that looks awfully familiar ;) Good work Numma cway! I'm sure it will come in handy somewhere :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 15:37, 31 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Is it possible to make image redirects? I don't want to break something ;) --numma_cway 14:02, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Yeah Numma cway, if you make sure the contents of an image article is like this: #REDIRECT Article name then whenever you click on that image you will be redirected to that article. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 14:12, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Is it possible to use these redirects even when using an image in a text? BTW: Don't you have other freetime activities than answering your user talk? I'm a little bit shocked. It's like instant messaging. ;) --numma_cway 17:49, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * You know, you can test out pretty much anything you like in the Sandbox. Some times it's easier to just try stuff and see what it does. :) --Bishop 18:13, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * It does not work. +100 EP --numma_cway 07:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I'm not sure what you want to do Numma cway. Looking at the sandbox at present, are you trying to replace an image based on a redirect? This is not how redirects work. Could you describe in more details the actions that you would like to see occur? <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 13:05, 3 September 2006 (CDT)


 * You're right. And I learned something. That's fine. :) --numma_cway 15:23, 4 September 2006 (CDT)

Here you go.
--Fyren 06:23, 29 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Hey! What's wrong with my aim Fyren? :P <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:35, 29 August 2006 (CDT)
 * Nothing. --Fyren 06:38, 29 August 2006 (CDT)


 * Shhhhhh! Or I'll start blanking in a minute! :P <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:42, 29 August 2006 (CDT)
 * ROFL. You guys crack me up hehe. --Xeeron 06:44, 29 August 2006 (CDT)


 * I am now wearing my badge of poor aim with pride! Thanks Fyren :P <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 07:11, 29 August 2006 (CDT)

Decision
I saw that you were concerned about User:Timir111. I banned him for the continuation of blanking pages, lastly being my user page. Somehow, he found out I was the one that deleted an old tagged build and had to blank my page in order to ask me why I needed to delete the build.

This user wasn't as naive as he lead on, I am guessing. How he knew enough to know the build was deleted, then sift through the delete logs to find out I was the one who deleted it, yet still does not have the knowledge to know not to blank or overwrite a whole article. Something didn't add up. -Gares 15:54, 30 August 2006 (CDT)


 * I've been monitoring his contributions recently and waiting for him to blank things again. Whether he is naive or not, he's blanked a lot of pages and I guess he's read the warning... since he blanked that too. He deserved to be banned and you did the right thing Gares :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 16:57, 30 August 2006 (CDT)

Small Ritualist icon
Loocks like the small icon for Ritualist got corrupted somehow:  Can you re-upload it please? --Rainith 04:03, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * It looks fine to me Rainith. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 04:46, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Try clearing your browser's cache? This is what I get:  The image “http://gw.gamewikis.org/images/a/a6/Ritualist-icon-small.png” cannot be displayed, because it contains errors.   --Rainith 04:49, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I've cleared the cache and still nothing, and visiting the direct url of the image and spamming ctrl+f5 hasn't done anything either. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 04:54, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * D'oh! Took my own advice and it seems that my cached image was corrupted.  Sorry.  :(  --Rainith 04:55, 2 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Hehe, no problem Rainith! It's an unusual problem to have, so I forgive you ;) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 04:56, 2 September 2006 (CDT)

Generic Res icon
I disgaree with the faded monk icon. I think many will assume it's a generic monk skill or something. May I suggest you used ONE of the hands reaching up in the skill Light of Dwayna and then fade that? I hand reaching up is a generic symbol of resurrection. Better than a profession icon that may signal (uninteiotnally) the exclusion of skills like Lively Was Naomi and Felsh of My Flesh. --Karlos 17:12, 3 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Yeah, I do see your point, and as I said myself on the discussion I didn't want it to come across as implying that you need to use a monk skill. I think that the accompanying text will make it clear that the icon refers to any resurrects. Rather than one of the hands, that I don't think really imply resurrection very much anyway, I was thinking of doing an outline similar to [[Image:Resurrect.jpg]] but from the front. The only difference is that I already have a monk symbol i can use, and I'll have to do the outline from scratch :P but I'll have a look at it anyway. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 17:22, 3 September 2006 (CDT)


 * how about this? [[Image:GenRes.jpg]] --Jamie [[Image:Jamie.jpg|24px|(Talk Page)]] 07:11, 23 November 2006 (CST)
 * Edit:I hope you do not mind but I'll edit User:LordBiro/Generic Resurrect as a page for comparing different icons. --Jamie [[Image:Jamie.jpg|24px|(Talk Page)]] 07:17, 23 November 2006 (CST)


 * Hey Jamie, it's a nice looking icon but I don't think it really says "this is a resurrection spell". It could equally be a firework :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 08:24, 23 November 2006 (CST)


 * Is it based on any other skill icon? I genuinely like the design of it. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 08:27, 23 November 2006 (CST)


 * Nature's Renewal, I did a spin on rebirth too [[Image:GenRes2.jpg]] (will upload) --Jamie [[Image:Jamie.jpg|24px|(Talk Page)]] 09:23, 23 November 2006 (CST)

I don't know about generic res. There is either rebirth/sunspear signet, chant or res signet, the rest suck and the aformentioned can't really be substituted with anything else &mdash; Skuld 10:04, 23 November 2006 (CST)


 * Yeah I just see a black and white Nature's Renewal when I loko at that. How about a white box with grey text that says "Rez"? I know that using text instead of an icon is against everything LordBiro stands for but you know it could work in this case :P (sorry couldn't resist!) If it helps you could always use some "iconic" text!! --Xasxas256 21:42, 23 November 2006 (CST)


 * Xasxas256 is right, I don't think any symbol (be it a slightly altered skill icon or profession icon) would work here, a plain and simple fancy text saying "Resurrect skill" would be a good idea. --Jamie [[Image:Jamie.jpg|24px|(Talk Page)]] 03:25, 24 November 2006 (CST)


 * Well I don't like the idea myself, so I'm going to have to put more thought into an image for the icon! :P If, in the mean time, you think an icon with text on it will work better than the current generic resurrect icon then feel free to upload it, but please make sure that the shade of grey used for the border and/or the text is the same as that used in the optional icon. I believe it is #808080, but it would be worth double checking :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:23, 24 November 2006 (CST)

Icons for Mission Complete Status
First of all let my say that i really love your work (i've been using your icons for nearly one year now for my Guild-Forum-Avatar) and now i found these big versions of the class icons on your Talk Page and i have to say that they look so cool, thank you for your work.

Enough of brownnosing, lets come to the point.

On my website i have some kind of overview over the progress of my characters (look here to see what i mean). As you can see i have a need of the Prophecies- and Factions- Missions Icons like this one:. For the Prophecies Icons i just cut out the sword(s) and it looked fine. But for the Factions Icons i had to take a screenshots of different states from the map and try to outcut them and they look, as one can see, some kind of ugly.

So i wanted to ask you, if you would like to find the time to create icons of the different states of the missions in Prophecies and Factions as well, not just for my own need but for the Wiki, as it don't have (or i just couldn't find) a picture of a Factions Mission Icon.

85.212.156.149 13:58, 9 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Check the first bunch of images here. I wasn't the original uploader, though, I was just renaming them.  They're someone's screencaps of all the mission icon states.  --Fyren 15:51, 9 September 2006 (CDT)


 * The original uploader was User:Thervold. FYI --Vortexsam 17:24, 9 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Why asking for something that is already there? Thx a lot, thats just what i searched. 85.212.156.149 17:32, 9 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Last question: I'm not familiar with the Wiki System, is there any possibility to browse the uploaded images except using the Upload Log? That would help prevent such rash actions.


 * There's Special:Imagelist. --Fyren 18:15, 9 September 2006 (CDT)


 * It's nice to be helpful :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 04:12, 10 September 2006 (CDT)


 * You know LordB, you could always work you image magic and make your own version of the different mission icons... ;) --Rainith 04:14, 10 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Yeah, perhaps. I might give that a go some time, but I'm not in a huge rush. If there was a particular need for it on the wiki I might give it a higher priority, but at present I don't think it's really something that we can make a great deal of use from. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:06, 10 September 2006 (CDT)


 * And i do have what i wanted to, so just make them if you are really bored :P 85.212.164.19 09:03, 10 September 2006 (CDT)

Response to your comment on User talk:Gravewit
This is in response to this comment. I'm keeping this out of Gravewit's page as it's off topic there.

I'm not sure if you saw the full Stabber saga, but you are wrong about him not causing harm to the wiki. Long before his sockpuppetry was discovered he had already received several warnings (including an official arbitration) about his behavior on the wiki. Read what Tanaric wrote in the arbitration: he was fully in agreement with me about Stabber's behavior and contributions to the wiki. Stabber was more than a pain in the ass: he was actively harming the wiki with his drama. After his sockpuppetry was discovered, it was found that he had been using his socks to stage fights and dramatic exits without taking responsibility, and, in one instance, to double vote. His "Deldda Kcarc" identity was used almost solely to fight with Karlos and vandalize the wiki over a period of several days, leading to a series of blocks. All the while his "Stabber" persona kept up a demure front to attract sympathy. All this is well documented on the wiki. It's a completely unbelievable tale. You are maybe one of three people to still claim that his sockpuppetry was not proven. Also, if you read Xeeron's link, the community consensus about sock puppetry is clear. You are again a holdout here as nearly everyone wants socks banned on sight.

Now, I've heard it said several times that Stabber's negatives were balanced by his contributions to the wiki, but that is a ridiculous equivocation. I myself was initially of that opinion, but then I spent an entire day going through Stabber's edit history, and the only conclusion I could reach was that this user was far too big for his breeches and a net negative to the wiki. And this was before his sockpuppetry was exposed. I know that everyone now wants to make this issue about me, and that's fine, but please don't exalt Stabber in the same breath that you damn me. 64.78.164.226 (a.k.a. F G) 64.78.164.226 10:19, 20 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Thanks FG. I've read this all before, both in your posts, in other people's posts and in the arbitration.


 * I appreciate that I am very likely in the minority with my view on Stabber. I think that she was a positive influence on the wiki, for the most part, and of course you are welcome to disagree with me. That's not to say I was a fan of Stabber, we butted heads occasionally, but she argued her point reasonably and I believed (and still believe) that her intention was only ever to accurately document Guild Wars as she thought best.


 * I really don't want to further discuss this issue here. I am aware of the facts and also of the speculation and my mind is made up.


 * I am also aware that I am in the minority with regard to my view on sockpuppets, but I think my point of view is entirely reasonable. If you don't agree with me then that's fine. I posted my views on Gravewit's talk page to reiterate that I personally see no immediate need, at present, to ban sock puppets or open proxies. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 11:51, 20 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Just for the record, I want to reply to this sentence specifically: "I know that everyone now wants to make this issue about me, and that's fine, but please don't exalt Stabber in the same breath that you damn me." I don't know if this was aimed at me specifically, but when have I ever damned you? Or even spoken about you? I certainly don't want to make this issue "about you". <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 12:01, 20 September 2006 (CDT)

Be afraid...
Check out these animated GIFs... You are facing some serious competition, sir. :) --Karlos 00:42, 21 September 2006 (CDT)

Old image revisions
What do you think is best to do with this Image:Crystalline Sword.jpg? &mdash; Skuld 19:37, 21 September 2006 (CDT)
 * If someone uploads a completely new screenshot for something, the older things can go. If it's a modification of an older image, the older revisions should stay.  Ideally, people would say "I took this screenshot" on the image page so we know for sure that it's a "new" image.  --Fyren 20:36, 21 September 2006 (CDT)
 * Bare minimum, all the "reverted to an earlier revision" entries could be purged. --Rainith 21:25, 21 September 2006 (CDT)
 * I didn't see this conversation until after I deleted some of the images. I've purged all of the "Reverted to earlier" posts (other than the current one).  I've kept the original upload of the current image, as well as the original upload of prior images. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 22:52, 21 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I am opposed to deleting previous revisions of images because we have to be careful not to delete history, and because we cannot get images back if we delete them. Therefore I have a very "inclusionist" opinion on image retention, I think it's best to keep as much as possible.


 * The main reason we have for deleting images is to save on disk space. I'm not sure how much of a concern this is at the moment (I don't know if Gravewit has made any announcements) but I do think that focusing on unused images is a safer way of freeing up disk space.


 * In the instance of Image:Crystalline Sword.jpg I would not be opposed to deleting revisions if they did not have any relevance to the final image, but equally if it were left up to me I would not delete them. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 05:37, 22 September 2006 (CDT)


 * My opinnion is that all reverts should be deleted, but one copy of each different version of the image should be kept. Ie, if there is some reverting between 2-3 different versions, keep one one of each version and delete the rest. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 07:11, 22 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I think that's a difficult situation to get yourself into though. Sometimes it's not always clear which images you should remove. For example, Image:Dervish-icon.png has several versions before the final version, but I would certainly not advocate any of them being removed because they did play a part in the current design. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 08:10, 22 September 2006 (CDT)
 * But why keep the rest? My screenshot are always the best ;)  Signet of better image resolution &mdash; ├ A  ratak  ┤  09:11, 22 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Biro you didn't understand me. I ment that we should delete all EXACT copies of an image version. If 2 users go into a revert war, only keep both versions once, not a million times. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 16:05, 22 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Yeah, in that case I would not be opposed. But I think a situation where users perpetually re-upload images must be rare, unless you know otherwise :P <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 16:11, 22 September 2006 (CDT)


 * It has happened on a few occasions. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 16:13, 22 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Well certainly in any instance where there are identical revisions of a file I would not see the harm in deleting some of them, provided care was taken. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 16:14, 22 September 2006 (CDT)
 * In the case of Image:Crystalline Sword.jpg, the image had several original uploads of the image (all of which I left in the history), but the history also contained six or seven tagged as "Reverted to earlier version" (or text along those lines) that were just caused by someone switching to an earlier revision, then back to a different revision. I deleted all of these from the history to clean it up; but left the original upload of each version in the history logs.
 * In the future, I can leave these reversions in the record history - those I really don't care about. But, as long as we have sufficient disk space, I believe that all original copies of each upload should be kept in history (not including vandalism / image abuse). --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 16:20, 22 September 2006 (CDT)
 * Note: Someone has since also deleted an unused image that was a cropped version of one of the originally uploaded versions. Not sure who; but as the uncropped version was retained, that doesn't really concern me either.  --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 16:22, 22 September 2006 (CDT)


 * That's fine Barek, as Gem says, there's no point in having loads of items in the history that are identical copies. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 16:40, 22 September 2006 (CDT)

One more tiny little icon
Just wondering if you could create a new icon for Image:NA-icon-small.png. It's used in the same tables as the small profession icons, so should be resized to the same 25x20; but as long as we're doing that, I though it would be good to redo it to have the same shadow effect as the profession icons as well to keep it style-consistent. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 16:58, 26 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Done :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 05:46, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

Icon shadows
Some of the icons look really off-center. Did you center them around the icon or the icon and shadow? --Fyren 05:41, 27 September 2006 (CDT)


 * All of the profession icons are centered on the icon including the shadow. I could pad them so that they are centered on the icon only, but that would mean the icons would take up slightly more space. I don't think I could reduce the shadow any more and have it still noticeable.


 * Do you have any example pages where this stands out? <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 05:46, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

In skills where the "related skills" section has more than one profession. Example to the left.

To my eye, it seems weird that the first six share the same icon-center positioning (or close enough for my liking, heh) but the last four are off. It could be alleviated by removing the bullets as in the second column, but it still bugs me, at least. --Fyren 06:06, 27 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I'm not sure I see it myself. It looks fine to me! But if you really think there's a problem I could pad every image with an additional pixel at the top? <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:16, 27 September 2006 (CDT)


 * The center column is a screenshot of the left column with a 2px wide line down the center of the warrior icon (not including the shadow). --Fyren 06:21, 27 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I didn't realise you were referring to horizontal center, sorry, I thought we were discussing vertical center for some reason! Anyway, I understand what you are saying now, but the layers are all aligned properly (I just double checked my photoshop files). I think if I were to offset any of the icons by a pixel in either direction they would look even more misaligned. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:25, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

Does this look better? <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 06:39, 27 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Hrm, maybe just move the ritualist icon to the right by one. The elementalist icon is sort of "right-heavy" so it might be better to call the center of it the center of the circle that's the core of the flame.  Monk and paragon have odd widths so they'll always seem off by one.  The circle for the elementalist icon looks about 6px, so it's sort of the same.  Also, it's a little late, but maybe a single wing for paragon?  Or double wings in profile (as opposed to spread).  Hope you don't mind the table floatiness; I'm trying to not make your talk page huge vertically.  --Fyren 06:59, 27 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I've moved the ritualist icon to the right by one. The others all look ok to me. I'll consider revising the Paragon icon, but I really want it to be as similar as possible to the original sized paragon icon, and I'd rather not remove a wing from either. I might upload a draft if it looks good though :P <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 07:29, 27 September 2006 (CDT)


 * For the paragon, I meant just a wing (or two) with no shield/hexagon. The ranger icon's already pretty far off from the game's icon, anyway.  Or maybe just a white/gold hexagon.  I probably should have complained more about the width when it was being discussed before, heh.  --Fyren 07:35, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

Gem icon
Hi. Is it possible to get a really high res version so that I could print it on the back of a t-shirt? That would really make my day. :) (Btw, your talk page is in need of archiving) -- (talk) 17:05, 29 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I'll see what I can do Gem :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 17:14, 29 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Thank you very much. :) It's coming on a black t-shirt if you need to know. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 17:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)


 * What resolution would you like it in Gem? <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 18:21, 29 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Ok, I'm going to bed, let me know what resolution you'd like and you'll get it in the morning. Oh... you'll get it alright... Mwuhahahaha... <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 18:51, 29 September 2006 (CDT)


 * Hmmm... I think the image will be 15cm high on the t-shirt. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 00:28, 30 September 2006 (CDT)


 * I've made an SVG version of the file and it's available from my blog. I'm guessing you'll want a bitmap version of the image (i.e. PNG or JPEG) which I'd rather send via email than post somewhere on the net. If you send me a wiki-email with your email address in I will email it there :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 13:25, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

More icons?
I was looking at Category:Weapon upgrades and it struck me how useless it was. The tables in weapon upgrade are pretty ugly, but I'm not sure how to make them suck less. Rather than headers like "axe grip" I think a weapon icon would be best. Combined with the red X icon we have and maybe a green check icon (I have no clue if we have something like that already), a lot of the columns could be slimmed to the width of the icons used. Any thoughts or willingness or iconify? --Fyren 23:17, 8 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Hey Fyren, I'm not 100% sure what you envisage. I think it would be quite straightforward to produce some icons for each weapon, as for each upgrade that might be a little trickier. Looking at weapon upgrade, every upgrade is sectioned off into prefix and suffix, which would make things a lot easier. You could have one "axe icon" in prefix and one identical "axe icon" in suffix.


 * I'll give it some thought Fyren and see if I can sort out some pretty weapon icons. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 05:46, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * The point is to remove a ton of the empty space and make them prettier and to pave the way for redirection of articles like Of Enchanting and Axe Grip to weapon upgrade. Just icons for weapons, not each upgrade, would be needed since the data is already split into a prefix table and a suffix table.  So "axe grip" and "axe haft" would get replaced by an axe icon.  All the data in those columns are either "x" or " " to denote whether such an upgrade exists, so [[Image:NA-icon-small.png]] and a checkmark could replace them.  --Fyren 06:04, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * I'm not really sure what style to go for at this point, but I've uploaded a kind of first draft.




 * What do you think? Are they all distinguishable? <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 15:43, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Me likes. :) The only problem I see is with the spear and the staff. Maybe make the spear head a little larger and lose the head of the staff altogether (as in Bo Staff, plainest staff possible)? Other than that I would make the daggers a little smaller and would remove the spike from the head of the hammer, but that's just me. :) --<font color="midnightblue">84-175 (talk) 15:52, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * I don't think it's a good idea to base the staff on the Bo Staff. It's basically just a rectangle :/ I based it on the Holy Staff. If that's not apparent then I should maybe alter it a bit, but I thought that the Holy Staff is the most easily distinguishable of all the staves that I've seen. When I see it I think "staff".


 * I can appreciate you wanting the daggers smaller, I just made them the same size as the others because it fit the icon. I'm not sure what you mean by removing the spikes from the hammer... Could you be a bit more specific? <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 16:58, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Good draft, I like them too! Just more opinions here from someone with little to no icon-making tallents of his own:
 * It looks like the current spear design is based on the sun spear; I think the brass or crenellated are simpler spear designs that would be more easilly recognised in sillouette. I agree that a holy staff is the more recognisable staff design.
 * For the daggers, the current crossed design reminds me a lot of the crossed sword design for prophecy mission/bonus. I think that uncrossing them and making them smaller, as well as removing or shrinking the bar above the handle, would make them more recognisable.  --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 17:05, 9 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Great stuff again! The daggers could be smaller and the spearhead a bit larger, but I like the current staff version. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 08:45, 10 October 2006 (CDT)


 * These look nice, I would recommend three things:
 * 1) Make two versions of each icon, each version highlights a different "end" of the weapon. I know that the tables are separate, but it would not hurt to have both graphics on. i.e. a version with the axe haft bright and grip dark and vice versa.
 * 2) The spear is fine, the staff should be changed to something like a Jeweled Staff (the lower art) that is more easily distinguishable from a spear.
 * 3) Daggers hould be made smaller, also perhapd make them pointing down and make the angle less than 90 degrees bewteen them.
 * --Karlos 09:16, 10 October 2006 (CDT)


 * I meant the top end of the hammer's handle that's sticking out of the hammer's head. It's just a little visual thing and I don't think it matters much. I understand that the daggers should match the other icons in size. I find Barek's idea of uncrossing them very good. How about two daggers side by side, diagonally (like so: //)? That way the daggers could be smaller while keeping the overall size of the icon. My point with using the Bo staff is: There should be only one icon that resembels "a long stick that's slightly thicker at one end". The snake headed Jeweled Staff, as suggested by Karlos, would be a good alternative. --<font color="midnightblue">84-175 (talk) 16:02, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

Sorry it's taken me a while to reply to this. Unfortunately I've been busy with some other things recently. Regarding the daggers, I have no problem making them smaller. I'll experiment with some different positions, but I do quite like having them crossed.


 * I suggest to model the dagger icon after Sai or Kris Daggers, maybe Korambits. They all have typical and unique dagger shapes and might not be easily confused with other weapon types. I'd say you could leave the dagger icon size as it is, because the relation of handle size to blade size should make it clear that the icon depicts a short-bladed weapon. I would also leave them crossed, because that mirrors the assassin's profession icon.


 * Regarding the axe: I would make the curving of the blade more pronounced, because of the small size it could be confused with a hammer at a passing glance. Or maybe take an axe with asymmetrical head, like Crude Axe or Gothic Axe

I'm not sure that having a light and dark section makes sense. If I was making an icon for the axe blade, would the blade be light or dark? I think an opaque/translucent combination would be better, but even then, this would not work very well. You would not easily be able to notice if I made the bow string translucent, or even transparent. What part of the staff would I make opaque to indicate "staff wrapping"? Just everything other than the head? Does that accurately describe what the wrapping is? Would making the dagger handles transparent be noticeable? I don't think that trying to highlight different sections of the weapon would be well communicated through an icon of this size.

The hammer is based on the Foehammer. I think the little bit at the top looks fine. If a lot of people agree that it's out of place I'll move it.

I don't think the Bo Staff is interesting enough (it's just a stick) and I don't think the Jeweled Staff is staff-like enough. The double head makes it look very unusual, and personally if I were to see the outline of the staff I would not think "that's a staff", I would think "what the hell is that?". It looks like some sort of deformed fork :P If anyone has another suggestion for a staff I would consider it, but personally I think that the Holy Staff is one of the most recognisable (and staff-like) staffs in the game. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 17:11, 13 October 2006 (CDT)


 * I like the hammer and staff as they are. Like you said, highlighting the parts would not work well on some of the icons. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 02:51, 14 October 2006 (CDT)

Web design?
Not sure who to ask, but at least you apparently have some interest in the tangentally related field of graphic design. Do much web design? I'm trying to move all the appearance-related aspects of the skill boxes out out of the templates (and out of the old HTML attributes) and into a stylesheet. I have no idea if the way I'm applying classes and defining them in the CSS is good or not. At best, I'm doing what makes sense to me and results in stuff looking like they did already. The CSS is at User:Fyren/monobook.css (put it in your user space, gamewikis.css if that's the skin you use) and some examples of things using it at GuildWiki talk:Sandbox/Skill box ias and Sandbox/Symbiosis, if you're willing and able to help. --Fyren 08:54, 16 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Nesting tables is often messy, and CSS for tables is always going to be equally messy, but looking through what you've done so far it all makes sense. One thing that I've noticed (although I think this is just how all skill articles have worked for some time, and I hadn't noticed) is that there is no h2 in the template. I guess this is because of the way MediaWiki treats headlines in the TOC? Anyway, other than that it all looks good so far. There are a lot of rules in your CSS, but that's generally unavoidable when you have nested tables. I'll have another look later tonight if I'm a bit less busy and let you know if I can see anything that could be improved. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 10:49, 16 October 2006 (CDT)


 * The header is fake (see div.fakeh2 in the CSS) since a real one would add a section edit link that would end up showing people the template source. That's probably bad and unexpected.  Currently, there's a link that looks the same as a section edit, but people complained about it not being obvious how to edit skills details, so I moved it down to closer to the skill box and made the text "edit skill details" instead (and out of the fakeh2 div and into the skill box table).  I was thinking about rewriting it to use divs instead of tables, but I didn't think it would make the CSS much different.  --Fyren 11:00, 16 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Yeah, I had a look at the CSS but I didn't realise it was because the edit link would go to the template. It makes sense I suppose. Overall I think that tables are used more than necessary on the GuildWiki. The progression table, however, is definitely not an instance of this.


 * You could reformat the quick reference as an unordered list but, in honesty, I'm not sure if that would be worthwhile. It would make the wiki code look a lot cleaner, but you would have to use a lot of CSS in order to have it look like it does now. Maybe that means we should use a different layout, but I don't really think that that would be a straightforward change. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 14:12, 16 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Hi, you can see an example of what we can do with a CSS moding: http://www.gwiki.fr/wiki/index.php?title=Forme_de_brume, (sorry it's a french wiki, and sorry for my english ^^), I can give the source to make this, if you want to copy or modify the look. My skill template looks messy but I'm working on an Mediawiki extension to make it easy to edit (with forms). --Ouroboros 16:59, 16 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Hey Ouroboros, that looks pretty cool, although I do have to say that I prefer the simplicity of our skill box design. I can't view the wiki source on your wiki because of the permissions, but looking at the HTML source I can see that you use divs for the skill box which is really what I'd like to see us doing more of.


 * Ideally I'd like to see a situation where the skill box is a div, the progression table is a table and the quick reference is an unordered list since this would make the most sense from a semantics POV. But as far as the amount of work involved in achieving this goes I really wouldn't feel comfortable saying "this is the way it should be done", because I think that the quick reference in particular would be a nightmare to style.


 * I'll give it some more thought but, in honesty, I think the way we are doing things at the moment is adequate, and the changes Fyren is putting through are good. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 19:45, 16 October 2006 (CDT)

gamewikis.org index
I've been pretty frustrated with the current gamewikis.org index so I decided to make a new one. It caches the number of articles in each wiki seperately for 1 hour, so if it's not 100% accurate right now try it again a bit later :)

Let me know what you think. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 15:47, 23 October 2006 (CDT)
 * I like it, the original had annoyed me for some time, but I usually bypass it, so kept forgetting to bring it up anywhere. Good job!  I know that someone else (I think Tanaric) was working on a new gamewikis portal, using a wiki-styled layout.  You might want to point him over to look at this as well. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 16:12, 23 October 2006 (CDT)


 * I talk to Tanaric occasionally over jabber/google talk and I think he's quite pleased with it. I thought Tanaric was more working on a meta wiki for gamewikis? I'm in favour of that as well! :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 16:34, 23 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Aye. I love it. And, yes, I am working on a metawiki... hopefully we'll get it sometime soon. &mdash;Tanaric 16:51, 23 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Looks VERY nice. Good show, old bean. :) --Karlos 10:13, 24 October 2006 (CDT)
 * I just noticed, you have the forums link, but no blog link. Any particular reason? --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 10:20, 24 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Probably because the blog is 1) totally unwiki and 2) rarely updated. But that's just a guess. &mdash;Tanaric 12:53, 24 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Well, I didn't mean to be too political by leaving off a link to the blog ;) But I was having trouble thinking of an icon that would be particularly blog-ish, and then I had a look at the blog to see if there was any inspiration there. I didn't find any :)


 * I think for a site that isn't almost entirely community run a blog would be suitable. Since we are almost entirely community run I don't think a blog is necessary; the forum does the job of propagating gamewikis information very well. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 17:53, 24 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Very nice. Do it! &mdash; Skuld 10:23, 24 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Would it be possible to decrease the box/icon size so you don't have to scroll down? In Firefox if you've got a few tabs open there's a scroll bar in 1280x960. It'd be nice if even you didn't have to scroll, even in 1024x768. If you didn't want to decrease the box/icon size you could perhaps lay them out in two columns or maybe layed out like 2,1,2. ie:
 * GW OW
 * HW
 * NW Fo
 * I dunno, just a thought, you know more about this stuff than me. --Xasxas256 04:48, 25 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Don't put yourself down Xasxas! I tested it in 800x600 where the scroll bar is always there. I decided on a design that was big and friendly, so that's why I went with such big boxes and big text.


 * One thing to bear in mind is that the page is dynamic. If another wiki is added then another box will appear (above the forum box) and the boxes will be sorted based on which wiki has the most articles. If I was to create a more rigid design that would allow the boxes to all display on 1024x768 (at present) then it would no doubt still overflow if we were to include a new wiki. That's why I don't think the 2,1,2 would necessarily solve the problem.


 * That's my thinking at present anyway. :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 09:02, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

Blocked?
I'm trying to edit my build, but when I try to save it, it says it's been blocked. Is it just a bug, or is it really blocked? I don't think I've done anything T_T LavaEdge324 19:49, 24 October 2006 (CDT) There is a bug. -- Gem
 * You could post here so you aren't blocked. :) --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 23:33, 24 October 2006 (CDT)


 * You're not blocked but we are onto you...nah just kidding it must be a bug as Gem says. --Xasxas256 00:10, 25 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Lol Xasxas, that's harsh :P


 * LavaEdge, there is a known bug as both Gem and Xasxas have said. Have a look at that article for more info :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 04:27, 25 October 2006 (CDT)


 * Guys, you are both lying. I never mentioned a bug. ;) --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 13:08, 25 October 2006 (CDT)
 * Very true - it was implied, but never said! --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 13:12, 25 October 2006 (CDT)


 * I just read between the lines :P <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 15:00, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

Reusing Icons?
Hey LordBiro,

Your Profession Icons are fantastic! They have definitely set an ultimate in standards for representing our character classes. I am building a database driven PHP based Alliance Roster system for my alliance (with intention of making it open source for the community) and was wondering if I could use your icons in my roster system... What sort of a disclaimer/copyright notice would I need to add to the site to reference to your graphics?

Thanks! Nightshade 00:33, 26 October 2006 (CDT) Nightshade


 * Hey Nightsade, I'm glad you like them :) They are released under the Creative Commons attribution share-alike license so anything which makes this clear and which points back to my home page would be great :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 03:57, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Icon expert wanted - Apply within
I'd like to request your input on some stuff if you have time. I'm working on making userboxes for in game titles that people can use on their userpages (see User:Rainith/Test). I've got a couple done, and have ideas for others, but I'd appreciate the input from someone who obviously has an eye for these sort of things. Also if you see any that you think to yourself, "I have the perfect idea for an icon for that one!" Feel free to work your magic. ;) --Rainith 20:47, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Signatures
How did you make your signature tiny like that? I have a need for smallness in the latter half of my signature...

Thanks!

BlastedtSee my main character! Basher Of The You! 16:53, 11 November 2006 (CST)


 * Blaestedt, could you please remove your main characters advertisement from your sig. If someone cares, they can find the link from your userpage. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 03:05, 12 November 2006 (CST)

Late Congrats
I'm very late on this one yet I still seem to be the first! Congrats mate, you're very much so deserving of it ;) --Xasxas256 07:21, 25 November 2006 (CST)


 * Thanks Xasxas, although as I'm sure you can appreciate I wish that the circumstances were different. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 08:04, 25 November 2006 (CST)


 * Yes you're probably right there but it'll be interesting to see how you do, you strike me as quite different to your predecessor. Tanaric had lots of good qualities and I had plenty of respect for him but I think he'd rubbed a few feathers the wrong way. On the other hand I'd say you're one of the most well liked people on the GuildWiki. That said it's not an easy role you're stepping into and like I'd imagine Tanaric probably found, you're may be called upon to give an opinion on something and whatever you choose is going to annoy someone. Nature of a tough job I guess but I think you'll do it well ;) --Xasxas256 08:21, 25 November 2006 (CST)
 * Hmmm rerereading my post it sounds a bit like I'm saying Tanaric wasn't well liked which isn't at all what I was trying to say. You guys just seem a bit different is all, he's probably a bit more direct than you are LordBiro is all I was saying.


 * Hehe, I know what you mean. I speak to Tanaric quite often and I think that while we have different approaches we generally have similar opinions. I think Tanaric's talk page is a testament to how well liked he is. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 08:43, 25 November 2006 (CST)


 * Heh heh I'm glad you know what I mean, we've had a couple of departures recently which is unfortunate but I'm curious to see how you go. I'm thinking it'll be something like an action movie blurb, ...a man with an unknown past, as old as time itself is out to avenge his friend. In his new role with more firepower than ever before, somebodies sure to get hurt. With an eye for icons and the other for destruction this cold hearted robot known to his enemies as The Birobot is out to strike a massive blow for the little guy against the powers that be. The Lord of Devastation is out for revenge, with an arsenal this massive who needs good aim? You can't run, you can't hide from Lord Biro, bureaucracy has never been this explosive! Coming this fall to a quality wiki near you... OK when I start writing posts like this it's probably time for me to go to bed! I'll catch you on the GWiki tomorrow mate, as long as it's still standing! And there's no need to tell me I'm crazy, I already know it, I consider it a good thing! ;) --Xasxas256 09:27, 25 November 2006 (CST)


 * Biro has absolutely no obligation to act as I did on the wiki. I wouldn't ask anybody to do that. As you've surmised, it's often a thankless job. &mdash;Tanaric 15:19, 25 November 2006 (CST)

Categorising prof icons
You beat me to half of them :p - you left the wrong comment though "redirecting" where actually you placed them into categories. (p.s. nice icons) — Biscuits (talk contribs) 13:01, 26 November 2006 (CST)


 * Hey Biscuits :) I didn't add any comment, I think MediaWiki just added those in by itself. <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 13:20, 26 November 2006 (CST)
 * Oh, OK ^ ^ — Biscuits (talk [[Image:Biscuit.png]] contribs) 13:25, 26 November 2006 (CST)

Deleting unused images
I've been submitting lists of images needing deletion to Skuld earlier, but I just realised that currently there are 1197 unused images in the wiki and it would be a pain to go through them AND list the onews needing deletion for someone else to delete. Could we agree on a time some day this week when you temporarily make me an admin so I can use the deletion ability myself when I go through the list? Then you could demote me again after I'm ready with the task.

On a side note: You might want to archive this talk page. ;) -- (talk) 11:38, 27 November 2006 (CST)


 * Hey Gem :) I'll get round to archiving this at some point.


 * I am a little hesitant to give temporary sysop powers. There are two reasons for this. I'm not aware of this being done before on the GuildWiki and I think that granting you temporary sysop priveleges sets a precedent that would be undemocratic (harking back to the time before GW:RFA when Gravewit decided who the sysops would be).


 * I would rather discuss the second reason with you off-wiki before I post it here, as I might not have all the facts.


 * I would appreciate any other contributors input on the subject of temporary sysop privileges. :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 18:54, 27 November 2006 (CST)
 * If Gem have it, I want it to. ;)  I think the reason you gave about precedent is a good one and I don't see the need for more reason not to give people temporary Sysop.  Why grant it to one and not the other would be a pain to choose too.&mdash; ├ A  ratak  ┤  19:12, 27 November 2006 (CST)
 * Agreed. Although, I have no problem with someone starting a GW:RFA for Gem to put in place the framework to eventually grant him permanent access when it's decided more admins are needed. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 19:19, 27 November 2006 (CST)
 * The category will be cleaned out before next Sunday. I have to ask, though, where Biro found the original of the Image:Warrior-pink.gif, considering I lack the mental capacity to figure out how to change it's color. I can remember the transitive closure procedure, but I can't change pink to black (sad really). &mdash; Gares 20:42, 27 November 2006 (CST)

Deleting unused images
I've been submitting lists of images needing deletion to Skuld earlier, but I just realised that currently there are 1197 unused images in the wiki and it would be a pain to go through them AND list the onews needing deletion for someone else to delete. Could we agree on a time some day this week when you temporarily make me an admin so I can use the deletion ability myself when I go through the list? Then you could demote me again after I'm ready with the task.

On a side note: You might want to archive this talk page. ;) -- (talk) 11:38, 27 November 2006 (CST)


 * Hey Gem :) I'll get round to archiving this at some point.


 * I am a little hesitant to give temporary sysop powers. There are two reasons for this. I'm not aware of this being done before on the GuildWiki and I think that granting you temporary sysop priveleges sets a precedent that would be undemocratic (harking back to the time before GW:RFA when Gravewit decided who the sysops would be).


 * I would rather discuss the second reason with you off-wiki before I post it here, as I might not have all the facts.


 * I would appreciate any other contributors input on the subject of temporary sysop privileges. :) <span style="font-family: Georgia, serif"> &lt;LordBiro&gt;/&lt;Talk&gt; 18:54, 27 November 2006 (CST)
 * If Gem have it, I want it to. ;)  I think the reason you gave about precedent is a good one and I don't see the need for more reason not to give people temporary Sysop.  Why grant it to one and not the other would be a pain to choose too.&mdash; ├ A  ratak  ┤  19:12, 27 November 2006 (CST)
 * Agreed. Although, I have no problem with someone starting a GW:RFA for Gem to put in place the framework to eventually grant him permanent access when it's decided more admins are needed. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 19:19, 27 November 2006 (CST)
 * The category will be cleaned out before next Sunday. I have to ask, though, where Biro found the original of the Image:Warrior-pink.gif, considering I lack the mental capacity to figure out how to change it's color. I can remember the transitive closure procedure, but I can't change pink to black (sad really). &mdash; Gares 20:42, 27 November 2006 (CST)


 * No problem then if someone else is going to do the job. Honestly I'm really impressed that you took it like you did LordBiro, just as I had imagined. :) What comes to an RFA for me, I don't think I'm a suitable person to be an admin by the current guidelines (atleast now that I'm not too active) and I would probably reject the nomination. The only reason why I even dared to ask was the reason that I don't see adminship as any kind of status thing but only as a bunch of extra tools. (which I have really often hoped for as they would have eased my work here a lot)
 * Gares: I'll be checking the category on Sunday. ;) Please don't remove anything which might be usefull later on. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 02:19, 28 November 2006 (CST)


 * Gah! I knew that you were "back" Gem and I actually had everything ready to go to nominate you but got called out of the office and when I came back you'd written this. I think you'd make a great admin, maybe next time I see you online I'll bring it up.


 * On a related note, our list of active admins has taken a bit of a hit of late. Eightyfour-onesevenfive's contributions have been a bit sporadic over the last month, PanSola doesn't have as much time for the GWiki as previously and Tanaric has retired recently. With Xeeron also calling it quits not long ago I figured that it'd be the perfect time to nominate Gem. It'd be nice to have someone else join me in limbo! --Xasxas256 03:21, 28 November 2006 (CST)


 * Well, feel free to nominate me if you think I'm worth it, but you better convince me too. :) I really would like the admin tools so I could better help the wiki, but I fear I would also get more responsibility on stuf that I don't like to interfere with. I need to think about it more if someone really nominates me at some point. Untill that I'll just keep cotributing as usual. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] (talk) 12:16, 28 November 2006 (CST)