User talk:PanSola/Archive6

Mischevious redirects
Special:BrokenRedirects I can't make these go away, says you've already deleted them :/ Don't know if its a caching problem or because I don't have the fonts, see if you can do anything &mdash; Skuld  02:25, 6 July 2006 (CDT)
 * It's an issue with auto-capitalization. Because the unicode characters got all messed up and broken up inside the database (this happened at the beginning of the year or something), inside the database the article is essentially soemthing like "GuildWiki:asdf", and any attempt to do anything to it from the MediaWiki interface leads to the manipulation of "GuildWIki:Asdf", which doesn't actually exist.  We'll need to either make MediaWiki fully case-sensative so that GuildWiki:Asdf and GuildWiki:asdf are treated as diff articles, or go into the database directly and remove database entries. - 05:05, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

Dropped the ball there..
pfff... change it to PanFiction!! not FanFaction!! --Jamie  08:13, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

Contributions text
See here, looks like that should be linking to the page. I think it was you who changed it :) &mdash; Skuld  02:05, 7 July 2006 (CDT)
 * It's still usable, and make the Recentchanges have a link to the user contributions. Fixing it for the block log will cause there not to be a link to user contributions in the Recentchanges.  Thus I find this to be the lesser evil.  Feel free to experiment the contributions text and banning SolaPan for 2 hour durations as experiment (Rechange Changes message are generated on ban, and do not auto-update when you change the MediaWiki interface, so you have to reban SolaPan to see the effect on Recentchanges every time you change the MediaWiki interface). - 03:33, 7 July 2006 (CDT)

Special:Recentchanges notice
Hey Pan, I was thinking of asking either you are Skuld this. I noticed on Wikipedia the header informaation on Wikipedia:Special:Recentchanges has some different text on there. I know a lot of new editors are missing vital info like marking all posts as minor to help filter out the anons and non anons. I was thinking of writing a guide to further the basic editting guide we have. Well anyways, my point is if we were to do this, could you change the header on our Recent changes page to link to this? make it big and bold so it is noticable to people. This kind of thing doesn't belong on the main page, so I was thinking Recent changes is the best place. --Jamie  08:34, 10 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I never understood why Wikipedia has those things in Recentchanges... Shouldn't notices like that go elsewhere? - 08:43, 10 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Well I am not sure where editors look, but I doubt it would be in help... Recentchanges seems like the best place to catch the aspiring editor that doesn't quite have a full grasp for the ins and outs of the wiki. --Jamie [[Image:Jamie.jpg|24px|(Talk Page)]] 08:48, 10 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Fancy drafting something out? I'll look for the mediawiki page &mdash; Skuld  08:59, 10 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Well on the practical side of editing we need the following:
 * Marking minor edits and showing the user where to find the option to mark all edits as minor in preferences
 * But on the less practical but more requested front, how to make a custom signature.
 * More stuff can be added when people think of stuff, but we do need to address the issue of minor edits now and underlining signing of posts. --Jamie [[Image:Jamie.jpg|24px|(Talk Page)]] 09:04, 10 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Yeh, i'd like an always use edit summary policy too (MediaWiki:Recentchangestext) &mdash; Skuld  09:06, 10 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I disagree with the registered users should always mark as minor. I think if they make more than a simple edit that they should leave the minor edit box unchecked. Only if an edit will not need review should the minor box be checked. I see no reason for contributers to mark everything as minor to find anon edits easier. I also dont think we need a policy for edit summarys, maybe a guideline or a how-to, but policy would require action taken against someone who does not follow it. The how-to make a custom signature is already in Sign your comments.--Draygo Korvan (Yap) 09:39, 10 July 2006 (CDT)
 * My opinnion is the same as Draygos. --[[Image:Gem-icon-sm.png]] 13:53, 10 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Have a look at those articles in the GuildWiki space, how many times have they been viewed? Sign your comments has just under 250 views as of writing whereas here, PanSola's talk page has over 5000. Clearly they're not being used because nobody is looking at them, many are not linked to from anywhere useful and some are not categorised, there's no way of finding them.


 * For ages I've had some helpful tips on my user page but fairly recently I improved it so it's basically a How to Edit the GuildWiki Guide. If you want to use it as a basis for a new guide on how to get into GuildWiki editing, you're welcome to, taking a queue from Rainith, check out User:Xasxas256/Test (it's just the help guide bit from my talk page). You're welcome to butcher it however you like to turn it into something that we can direct new users to as a one stop shop on how to edit this site and have a link to it somewhere prominent (ie the Main Page, Recentchanges etc.) --Xasxas256 22:06, 10 July 2006 (CDT)


 * We need a link to these things on either the navigation or recentchanges. that space on recentchanges is valuable space though. We need to utilize it. --Jamie [[Image:Jamie.jpg|24px|(Talk Page)]] 01:57, 11 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Subtly linking to a few helpful pages would be fine, but please, please, don't put actual how-to information on the Recent Changes page itself! &mdash; 130.58 (talk) ( 02:05, 11 July 2006 (CDT) )
 * The problem with Sign your comments was that it wasnt linked to from any relevent pages. I just fixed that issue and hopefully new users will be able to find it more easily. Previously It was only reachable by going through an unsigned link. --Draygo Korvan (Yap) 12:16, 11 July 2006 (CDT)

Maybe consider modifying this: MediaWiki:Copyrightwarning. While technically it's copyright warning, it appears exactly when edits occure. - 02:27, 11 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Instead of the copyright message, I think that MediaWiki:Edittools would be a better location. From what I can see, it's intended to be used for this type of content.  The information would show immediately below the "Save page" button.
 * For reference, you can see the content placed into that space on Wikipedia. They use it mainly for insertion of various symbols and only list a link to policies and guideline for editing info on the last line, so we would probably have different priorities of what we include and in what order.  But that example does give the idea, and editing Wikipedia:Sandbox can demonstrate how it displays on an edit page. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 12:02, 11 July 2006 (CDT)
 * FYI: To propose a draft, I started by copying Wikipedia's article from Wikipedia:MediaWiki:Edittools into my sandbox at User:Barek/Sandbox. I was then going to remove most of the character inserts, just leaving the one for the signature and possibly some tags like  {{subst: ,  [[Category: ,  #Redirect , and maybe some templates like  {{1/4}} ,  {{1/2}} , and  {{3/4}} .
 * However, it appears that the tags   are not recognized on GuildWiki.  Any ideas on the problem?  I'm guessing that would be a Gravewit issue to add in some module or add-on, but a quick search hasn't turned up anything to point him towards as yet.
 * The block will still work for adding links to help documents, but I was hoping for a couple character insert items to simplify edits. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 14:37, 11 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Update: Found it in an archived discussion: Wikipedia:MediaWiki_talk:Edittools/Archive_02. Looks like a lot of effort; no point pursuing with Gravewit yet, need to first see if it's something the GuildWiki community decides it even wants to have available. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 14:45, 11 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I found this, might help &mdash; Skuld  14:49, 11 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Just wondering; should this thread be moved to GuildWiki_talk:Community_Portal?
 * FYI: I inserted some proposed content in MediaWiki talk:Edittools that doesn't use the tags  , as those are not currently working on GuildWiki.  --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 10:07, 12 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Feel free to move it whereever you think makes sense. Ideally it'd be soemthing more specific than Community Portal, but I can't htink of alternatives either. - 10:13, 12 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Ok, most new users are offered tips on their talk pages about using the preview button before the save button, and half still do not follow the advice. Sign your comments is collecting cobwebs and regular users are still taking their time to add the unsigned template. I don't see this making very much of an impact either. As to regular users making everything minor, I agree with Draygo Korvan way up there. If I create a new article I feel no need for it to be minor, because a new article is hardly a minor change. Either way, it is going to be up to the contributor whether they want to check that little box or not. -Gares 10:32, 12 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I'm hoping that placing the information directly on the edit screen will help the lack of sigs, etc. which is why I proposed some content for MediaWiki:Edittools on its talk page. I don't see anything ever eliminating the problem, but increasing visibility can help.  As for minor edits, that's a judgement call on the part of each editor.  For me, I have minor edits turned on by default, and usually only remove it when I feel as edit is more than a minor cleanup (although, I'll admit that I sometimes forget to remove it, just as others forget to add it).  I forgot to add a tip about using "Show preview" on the edit tools proposal, I'll add that now. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 10:50, 12 July 2006 (CDT)

Mission Briefings
Shouldn't those go with the NPC article and not the location articles? --Rainith 11:17, 11 July 2006 (CDT)
 * We put quest dialugues with quests and not NPCs, I fully feel the same way for Missions. Besides, some NPCs brief multiple missions and it'll result in major clutter in the NPC articles. - 19:40, 11 July 2006 (CDT)
 * In that case shouldn't it go on the (Mission) page, not the (Location) page, otherwise the locations would be full of the quest dialogues. --Rainith 20:43, 11 July 2006 (CDT)


 * I would agree the briefing would be more useful (And more sought) in the mission article. --Karlos 00:27, 12 July 2006 (CDT)


 * then how aoubht the henchmen availability and levels? how about how to access the mission?  Should we simply merge the mission outpost articles with the mission objective/walkthrough articles?  I am actually fine with the mission location article being filled with dialogue (there's only one briefing per mission location anyways (er, maybe two versions depends on character campaign), which makes it different from the NPC scenario), because it is the mission location.  I am also not opposed to merging the two. - 00:30, 12 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Merging the two is a different topic, and one that I would be against. Just a simple issue of separating the how to from the basic town info. The mission dialog is part of the how to, that's why I am in favor of moving it to the mission walkthrough article. --Karlos 04:36, 12 July 2006 (CDT)


 * I see the mission briefing as more relavent to the lore and background, and is only read by the same people who reads those outpost descriptions on the world map. It does provides a little insight into what you will see in the mission, but in general the bullet point mission objectives are more clear, concise, and useful.  In other words, for people who hate (or is bored by) the PvE story and simply want to do the mission, there is no reason for them to read the briefings.  I would argue henchmen information to be more relavent in terms of "how-to" info.  Should henchie info be duplicated in both the mission location article and the mission walkthrough article? - 05:55, 12 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Your comment does not seem to include missions in Cantha. Challenge missions and competitive missions have very important instructions on how to win the mission. --Karlos 06:06, 12 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I see... I'll take a look at Dragon's Throat, sleep on it, and get back to you. - 06:09, 12 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Alliance Battles too. --Karlos 17:46, 12 July 2006 (CDT)

Traps bugged?
I noticed you changing a lot of trap skills to say weird things. Is this a bug introduced in the new update? &mdash; 130.58 (talk) ( 13:30, 14 July 2006 (CDT) )
 * Most likely an old problem that has never been addressed, considering Dust Trap was bugged for ages. - 13:33, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

Block on User:66.218.226.213
I was just wondering if it was really necessary to block this guy? After looking through his edits it seems to me he was only correcting his previous posts, and the "Auron Bushi" seems to be a signature added before his own posts. &mdash; Galil  10:21, 16 July 2006 (CDT)


 * I figured that out and unblocked him before you note. I only noticed he's editing his prior post until later.  It was all very confusiong, I apologize. - 10:22, 16 July 2006 (CDT)


 * No problem. Mistakes are humane. ;) &mdash; Galil  10:23, 16 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Crap, I wanted to be an inhumane admin!!! - 10:25, 16 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Sorry, I think Karlos and I are fighting over that one. :P  --Rainith 18:19, 16 July 2006 (CDT)

Arborstone Blood Drinkers
I noticed you added Blood Drinker as a boss in the Arborstone (Explorable) article. Unfortunately that goes to the skill, not the monster (which is Blood Drinker (Monster)), and I was unaware there was a boss with the same name, so that would probably best go under Blood Drinker (Boss). --Rainith 18:19, 16 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Blah actually it's not a boss. It looked red to be but it's a necro and it didn't give me moral boost. - 18:30, 16 July 2006 (CDT)

of candy cane blades and edit conflicts
use the preview button! 3 edit conflicts in a row attempting to add one line on my own user talk ;p --Honorable Sarah  17:51, 17 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I wasn't cocrecting typos. Additional ideas came to me after I saved the prev version, so preview wouldn't really work. d-: - 17:56, 17 July 2006 (CDT)

Arborstone mission
Have you done that? If you want some help I'll do it as soon as I stop getting err013 and it will let me on &mdash; Skuld  17:34, 19 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I want some help *skipping* the mission by heading straight for Altrumm Ruins (Location), for the sake of proof of concept. If the concept is proven, that would be the absolute way to prevent wasting factions (too late for my account anyways).  For the mission itself, my mesmer got through with henchies, and I'm not in a hurry with my monk or warrior d-: - 17:39, 19 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Shame :p This err 013 is bugging me, says try in a few mins on all 12 chars ~_~ &mdash; Skuld  17:41, 19 July 2006 (CDT)

Shield Guardian icon
Hey Pan, the FSK has this icon wrong. Someone at some point found some icons we were missing on one of the official Asian GW sites. As I don't know any Chinese/Japanese/Korean (or any Asian language for that matter) I'm having no luck looking for an official replacement for this icon. Any chance you could poke around and see if you can find it? --Rainith 02:09, 25 July 2006 (CDT)


 * The Factions FSK has actually been released silently. I took a look, and found MANY icons to be overly huge in file size -- essentially JPG minus the JPG compression.  If we are to use the new FSK icons, I would suggest we edit them to save them in compressed format. - 09:38, 25 July 2006 (CDT)


 * Um, you mean released on the US site? If so, then yes, those are what we are using and where the problem is.  They mixed up the icon for Shield Guardian and instead put in the icon for Stonesoul Strike.  IIRC someone found the icons for Healing Signet and SoC on one of the Asian sites, but as I said, I had no luck poking around those sites as, unfortunately, I can't understand the languages.  --Rainith 11:05, 25 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Oh opps, I didn't know we are already using the FSK from the US site. - 18:02, 25 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Ok, the Taiwanese website used a screenshot icon for Shield Guardian, just like what we are doing. The Japanese website uses Stonesoul Strike's icon just like what is provided in the FSK.  I don't read Korean so you'll have as much luck with it as I do.  I guess all the websites got the same set of FSK though. - 18:07, 25 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Darn. Ok, thanks for looking, I'll put together an email and send it off to Gaile, maybe she'll get them to fix it.  --Rainith 20:01, 25 July 2006 (CDT)

Sub-category sort key method
Hi! Can you please check this and comment? Thanks. -- 04:26, 26 July 2006 (CDT)

Skill Box templates
help! i'm drowning in wikicode! attempting to write User:Honorable Sarah/IAS skills quick reference based on your templates from Interrupt skills quick reference but template:skill box ias doesn't exist and i can't figure out A) where to put the data on the skill templates and b) how to make the template:skill box ias read it properly. save me!--Honorable Sarah 12:33, 26 July 2006 (CDT)
 * You need to specify the ias vis the skill's own template, such as Template:Berserker Stance. The only thing that gets passed from the quick reference to the template is teh notes (which, if you have no other use for it, can be used to pass the ias).


 * In summary, the quick reference page calls individual skill templates (such as Template:Berserker Stance), passing the variables as "ias" and  as whatever you put in for the notes, then Template:Berserker Stance calls Template:skill box ias (because  = "ias"), passing in all the data stored in the skill template, including the notes that came from quick reference. - 12:57, 26 July 2006 (CDT)


 * I already made a mockup at Template talk:Skill box ias for Sarah. I guess the table could look a little prettier.  --68.142.14.19 13:08, 26 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Incidentally, shouldn't the "notes" be linked to the particular type of QR the skill is used in? In the case where a skill ends up in two different references, it might have different notes for each.  --68.142.14.19 13:10, 26 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Notes should always be passed in from the quick reference page that calls the skill template, so it's not an issue. - 15:27, 26 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Would you prefer the IAS value and duration go in the QR page then instead of the skill template? Since that's how I made my example and where Sarah ended up putting the data.  --68.142.14.19 21:39, 26 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I think IAS value can go in the skill template. However, a skill may have multipe effects with different durations, so it's best to put duration as note. - 21:59, 26 July 2006 (CDT)
 * I named the field iasdur in the template. Such a conflict is why I thought to name the notes iasnotes, heh.  --68.142.14.19 22:01, 26 July 2006 (CDT)

Dwayna is a nice lady
Okay, I've converted all the links that were relevant, except for talk pages. Mind checking my work and, if you agree it is accurat, please remove the disambig and instate Avatar of Dwayna (Skill) as Avatar of Dwayna? I'd do it myself, but I think that might come across as a little arrogant, so I'll leave the decision up to you. :) -- Bishop [ rap|con ] 23:36, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

Done for Avatar of Grenth as well (that one had only a few links before the update). -- Bishop [ rap|con ] 23:46, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

ChinaJoy report on 17173.com
Hey mate, could you browse around the 17173.com website a bit more for their report of the ChinaJoy expo? They may have some previously unpublished info on Nightfall, along with this video. See Talk:Guild Wars Nightfall. Thanks! -- 02:16, 31 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Hehe I've already read their site. I hate simplified Chinese characters though, they give me a headache (just imagine if every phrase in English turn into acronynms and every word in English that has 4 or more letters get replaced by abbreviations, using a non-systematic method of making abbreviations).  Not much is new really, it's supposedly going to be more focued on Roleplaying. - 02:35, 31 July 2006 (CDT)
 * Do they say anything about whether the trailer video was shown "behind closed doors"? --[[Image:TurningL sml.gif|Tetris L]] 02:43, 31 July 2006 (CDT)
 * None-revealing-to-outside. Didn't specifically mention a door d-: - 03:06, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

Another ChinaJoy related page for you to check for previously unpublished info: http://gw.the9.com/news/main/41036.shtml -- 02:19, 1 August 2006 (CDT)

Skill template issue
Please check Talk:skill box again. --68.142.14.19 09:09, 31 July 2006 (CDT)
 * don't you mean Template talk:Skill box??[[Image:ST47logo.jpg|User:ST47|50px]] (talk) 09:10, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

Chinese GW wiki
please check it agagin, I need some advice--heach 11:31, 2 August 2006 (CDT)

There's a Chinese Guildwiki? Can someone clue me in please? By the way, hllo PanSola! Yeah, that's all. Silk Weaker 10:50, 10 August 2006 (CDT)
 * right here, Chinese GW wiki--heach 11:14, 10 August 2006 (CDT)


 * It's a GuildWars wiki in Chinese, it's not the Chinese GuildWiki (which is still being seeded and tested, and is not public yet), just for clarification. - 16:42, 10 August 2006 (CDT)

GuildWiki Policy
You might be interested in what I did to Policy. &mdash;Tanaric 18:12, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

Clarity
I feel as though I need to apologise as the "all the edits on blah blah blah are either done by admins" and "all done by admins plus Stabber" lines were both written by myself. I feel very bad about it, I mean really bad. I have a strange relationship with templates I think and if you read further down you'll see I soften my stance. I do also believe as you said that you'd have made those edits regardless of you sysop status and made some of those edits before you were promoted anyway. As I said my stance has changed and that's the whole point of having a discussion, to have a bit of a think about it. I don't believe any more that major templates should only be the domain of admins.

If you were online in game at the moment I would chat to you about it. I don't want to think that you'd resign as an admin due to a comment by me. PanSola, I don't for a second think that you given a standoffish impression that you're the admin and we're the lowly users. I respect you because you don't act like that, you act like any other good contributor and never wield a big "I'm an admin" stick. Basically the only obvious way to tell that you're an admin is every so often you perform some administrative task that can be seen in Recent Changes, none of your edits give that impression except in the extremely rare occasion, say once a month where you step into some topic in the role of an admin and you clearly state this.

I hate the idea that something I said in any way contributes to you leaving your position because you feel an "us and them" thing. Out of all the current admins you achieve the goal of being a "valuable contributors who just happens to be an admin" better than anyone else. I firmly believe that. The fact that the "us and them" concept worries you is probably proof that you strive hard to accomplish that goal but I don't think you need to worry.

The "us and them" line I used was applicable to Tanaric and Tanaric only. I very much so believe that Tanaric's heart is in the right place, he wants the wiki ideals of everybody having a say in the wiki's running. That’s all well and good but hopefully this analogy can convey what I’m trying to say, because he no longer makes many normal contributions and just comments on policy these days he’s kind of like a boss. A boss who cares about his workers. You’re more akin to a normal worker who also cares about worker’s rights but you’re still working with us plebs every day and are therefore far more in touch, despite being a spokesperson for us. You juggle the normal everyday contribution stuff with the admin stuff you have to do so well I don’t believe you think about it too much, you’re just a user with a few more rights than normal in my mind.

Sorry for the long message but this is important to me, you can blame Tanaric for starting a long post trend! I'm probably a little more emotional than normal because I'm full of cold medication at the moment so I hope that I have managed to convey my feelings better here. I will finish by saying that irrespective of what sysop status you do or don't have, your posts here will always be respected. Despite English apparently not being your native language, you are one of, if not the most eloquent writers here. The thought and consideration you give to your posts are what gives them weight, not any adminship. --Xasxas256 05:32, 9 August 2006 (CDT)


 * I fully agree with everything Xasxas has posted here, and very much appreciate his effort to clarify his remarks. His notion that I'm more like a boss has been confirmed by my recent appointment to bureaucrat, which makes me more akin to Gravewit or Nunix than the rest of the administrative team now. &mdash;Tanaric 12:28, 13 August 2006 (CDT)

ParserFunctions
Did you or anyone else ever have Gravewit try installing ParserFunctions to replace some of the current logical template usage? It's been around since April and been live on WP since the middle of April, so it's probably stable-ish. --68.142.14.39 15:20, 11 August 2006 (CDT)
 * I believe I hvae told him about it. - 18:20, 12 August 2006 (CDT)
 * Did he say anything about it? The progression templates could also be mostly replaced with math done with PF.  --68.142.14.42 00:15, 16 August 2006 (CDT)

Categories: "tree" vs. "sort key" method
Hi PanSola, just a quick heads-up that you might want to comment on GuildWiki talk:Style and formatting. -- 05:09, 15 August 2006 (CDT)

Policy deleted
FYI: As you made a recent edit to Don't immediately delete, I wanted to point out the discussion in GuildWiki talk:Don't immediately delete. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 09:35, 21 August 2006 (CDT)

Builds discussion re: site policies
You may already be aware of it, but if not can you take a look at the (long) discussion at GuildWiki_talk:Style_and_formatting/Builds and voice your opinion? I'm asking several of the currently active admins to take a look. The issue, to me, is one of interpretation of site policies and practices. I was involved in the discussions earlier, so I cannot consider myself totally unbiased in any attempt to resolve it myself. --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 20:57, 23 August 2006 (CDT)