User talk:Marcopolo47/SSBB

SO I HERD
CAPS LOCK IS CRUISE CONTROL FOR COOL 02:38, 17 MARCH 2008 (UTC)
 * I LIKE HEADERS TO BE IN CAPS LOCK.--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 02:40, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I'LL ADD MYSELF IN LATER WHEN I CHECK MY OWN FRIEND CODE. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> .cнаt^  04:50, 17 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I HERD HEADERS WIN? --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG]]-- (s)talkpage 17:27, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * THERE'S A CHANCE THAT I'M GETTING BRAWL TODAY, PROVIDED IT'S IN STOCK ANYWHERE. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 17:59, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd join, but I don't have a Wii, and I don't know if it's out in the UK RT 18:04, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * CAPS PLZ. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 18:05, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I shall not RT 18:06, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I was going to create something like this, but this is much easier. Plus more people visit MP's page than mine :P --Macros 18:39, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I'll be getting SSBB within the week :) However I won't post my FC for a while, until I have actually done some stuff in the game. (all chars, all stages, etc.) Cress Arvein(Talk) 18:57, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * All chars/stages is ridiculous easy in this game. And the event matches are pathetic now that you can set em to easy. After comparing, SSBM events are "Hard" equivalent.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]Entrea Sumatae  [Talk]  23:06, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * But unlocking stuff generally requires doing events on Hard mode. Not to mention, Cruel Melee is just stupidly hard; if one of the four starting foes decides to grab you at the start, a throw in any direction will generally result in a KO (no matter what your damage was at). Took about half an hour to manage five KOs in that mode, doing two-player; unfortunately, the unlock for getting five kills requires you to do it solo. (solo record is two kills.) --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> .cнаt^  02:26, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Use Ike, hop off the edge, turn around and use his up+b to grab the ledge, then drop and repeat ;) Even then, it's still hard, but it helps rack up damage. &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  (talk)  02:34, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, all the characters/stages only require easy mode things, so...[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]Entrea Sumatae  [Talk]  02:35, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Interesting that Femwick got a copy of Brawl in the UK, where it hasn't been released yet. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:40, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Maywicks code is invalid (Wii code much?). Also, the Ike/Aether strategy for cruel brawl works wonders. Once theyre at about 200% damage, land on the stage instead of regrabbing the ledge, and they'll probably die.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]Entrea Sumatae  [Talk]  16:46, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Ike works well on the edge, but if the alloys get a little spread out, they just punch you once and send you off the screen. I had to give up on that approach after a while, haven't found a better plan yet. -- Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  20:59, 18 March 2008 (UTC)
 * 
 * I got my Tabuu trophy. Yay. --Macros 22:02, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Rubes, every pro knows that Jigglypuff is the easiest way to beat Cruel Melee. I got 10 kills without too much trouble. Also, Subspace Emissary 100% competion is win. SSBM events as "Hard"? Nah...only difficult events in the old game was 51, 50 if you sucked. Everything else was just a matter of knowing how to use the characters. (T/C) 02:57, 20 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Jiggly's good, I used Ganondorf to reach 10 now. (turns out he can be pretty epic on the edge.) --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  02:51, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Brag. I just got all the boss trophies. Meta-Ridley is harder than Tabuu, he keeps accidentally dying and then you have to restart the longest level in the game.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]<font color="#4682b4">Entrea Sumatae  <font color="#4682b4">[Talk]  20:05, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I'll really be amazed if you did it without the stickers to boost trophy stand drops. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:36, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Cool people play...
SSBM. Misfate 18:54, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * You figure out a way to play SSBM online, and I'll take you on. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  18:57, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Awesome people play both :o --Macros 19:02, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Tournament?
Anyone else think we should have a series of 1 vs 1 games for a GuildWiki tournament? -- (Talk) (Contr.) 03:11, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Wait for me to get it. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 03:12, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * mmk, but how should we do the brackets? Random opponents?--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 03:14, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Sounds fun. So long as it's not that whole stupid "Fox, Final, No stuff" thing[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]<font color="#4682b4">Entrea Sumatae  <font color="#4682b4">[Talk]  03:14, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I suppose each opponent could agree on certain rules for each of their own matches.--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 03:18, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Now, WOLF only I can understand. Wolf is awesome. Fox just sucks. [[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]<font color="#4682b4">Entrea Sumatae  <font color="#4682b4">[Talk]  03:23, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Sounds like he is spitting up a hairball when he does side smash tbh. >.> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:21, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

So
I'll assume there's people more pr0 at SSB than me (which isn't exactly hard to be). --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 01:36, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Peach. Floating =win. so do turnips. amirite?
 * Zelda. Why does the computer use Nayru's Love so offensivly? Is it intelligent to do so? Also, Din's Fire = pwn. <3
 * Sheik. Her down-air. I personally like it better than her previous (except when I go rocketing down off the edge of the stage, but we'll pretend I'm less fail than that). Better, worse, why?
 * Lucario. I think he's too slow to make effective use of Aura, though if he does get some hits off at high percents he pwns face, but again, he's so slow.
 * Pit. As cool as he is, I cannot find out how to effectively use him. If he couldn't fly, I'd be embarrased to have him on the game if I were nintendo.
 * Btw, does Snake not fail somehow? --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 01:40, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Who wins Ness vs. Lucas? Does Pikachu have a ton of knock-back or is it me? Why do computers air-dodge when sent flying and nothing is near them? Does it reduce how far they get sent flying? --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 01:51, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I want SSBB soooooooooo bad. Lost-Blue 02:12, 25 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Alright, let's see if I've got opinions on this.
 * ...turns out I do. Here we go.


 * Peach. Floating is great for getting back on the stage; if you can stop falling in midair just before someone hits you, it makes for a nice dodge too. Be careful though, floating above someone's head just makes you a target. Don't like turnips that much, but Toad is pwnage.
 * Zelda. Nayru's Love has a bit more kickback then before, I think. It's also hard to land hits on someone as they use it. I've gotten out of a lot of punching-bag situations by mashing B... bouncing projectiles is also fun. Din's Fire is superpowered or something, too.
 * Sheik. They nerfed her aerial side-A move (used to knock-back across half the screen with little damage)... but her sex-kick is still nice, needles are always great for edge-guarding against Fox, etc, her side-B chain can grab edges, and up- and down-smash attacks are still nice and strong. Oh yeah, and she's still nearly as fast as Fox.
 * Lucario. I personally use him a lot; the speed isn't bad, I can still keep up with any other character in a fight. Force Palm grabs at close-range, which pwns face; Aura Sphere is decent, any projectile with damage like that is useful at the very least. His aerial down-A (Double Kick) is one of my favorite attacks... slows his decent by a ton, so you can use it to both dodge and punish anyone waiting below you with a attack. It also has a lot of knockback; if both hits connect, it sends the foe sideways instead of down, with a good amount of force. At high damage, it's a great finisher.
 * Pit. Reminds me a lot of Link; tons of utility moves (ranged and melee), but it's tough to say he's awesome at either one. The bow can ping nicely, and it's quick enough to use between attacks. In close-range, he's got nice quick attacks, side-B is a great rushing move as well (also bounces projectiles, iirc). And he's really nice in aerial combat (up-A is fun). But I have trouble finishing people off with him.
 * Snake. He's got strong normal A attacks, his smash attacks are a little hard to hit with (tiny bit slow) but they're practically instakills, and he's nasty as hell from a distance (grenades in particular, the missile is awesome if you can find a moment to fire it). He suffers against a faster foe I think, but if you can get the hang of his quicker attacks, he's strong. Mash A, knock the foe back, throw a grenade, smash side-A or up-A... if someone tries to step back to avoid stuff, you can throw more shit at them.
 * Lucas vs. Ness: Lucas wins. PK Fire is a little stronger, PK Lightning has knockback, PK Freeze... freezes people solid, and smash up-A throws people off the screen so hard they instantly die when the come back in (maybe not, but it's nasty anyway).
 * Pikachu. I think so actually, smash side-A seems to be pretty powerful. Pikachu can rack up damage fairly quickly as well, which helps.
 * Air Dodging. It might slow you down a bit, not sure. If you're knocked back and spinning, tapping R or an attack button is generally the best way to recover as well (better then using up a jump). Could be that's what they're doing.
 * There you go. Opinions. I'm not really pr0, but I'd like to think that I sound like I am. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  06:34, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Air dodging is used to prevent tumbling. If you hit the ground while tumbling, you'll land on your face or back. You then have to, you know... get up. Which takes time. Air dodging or attacking makes you land on your feet, and you can go about your business instantly. --Macros 15:36, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * The best part about air dodging in Brawl is that it no longer makes you helpless (like it did in Melee). You are able to attack and jump after you do it. They did this to offer consolation for removing wavedashing. --Macros 15:38, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * High level computer Peach is a vicious bitchosaur. She floats along the ground and slaps you with her crown, and that move does mucho damage. I don't know if she could do that in Melee, I was so nub in that game it's rediculous. Toad is pwn. Did they increase Toad's damage/knockback? He seems a lot better than in melee, but then, in that game, I was almost always Zelda/Sheik. When would using Vanish (Sheik's up-B) be better than tethering with her chain? Vanish has so much lag. Did they change anything about Peach's parasol? It seems to hit farther than it did last time. --<font face="vivaldi" size="3" color="Steelblue">Shadowcrest 17:10, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * In Melee, Toad was just a reflector. So yeah, Toad is waaaay better.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]<font color="#4682b4">Entrea Sumatae  <font color="#4682b4">[Talk]  20:03, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Sheik's up-B is great for getting back to the stage, because you can aim it anywhere; jump to the edge and edge-hog, hit a guy trying to spike you, etc. But the chain lets you avoid someone that's edge-guarding, which seems like a more likely scenario for a 1v1 brawl. I don't really have practice with the chain yet, but I'm planning to work on it. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  21:22, 25 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Peach. Sucks. Compared to the last game. Her floating powers are the same but her actual jump was much reduced. And the Turnips lost a lot of their former power. At least they didn't remove the Frankenvegetable. Peach also lost her "up-to-80%-in-one-smash" Down smash, which is sad. Peach Bomber is stronger now and actually worth using; the Parasol can be opened and closed as needed while falling, which is great, and I think you fall slower too. Peach's midair attacks...the forward one is worse (formerly it was Smash-powerful), the others are the same or better. Peach's Up A on the ground is better. Running attack got worse, it used to be pretty good to spam.
 * Zelda. 100% better than the last game. Lightning Kick is harder to connect with, Up Aerial is a bit smaller ranged, Transform takes forever now, Nayru's Love is slightly smaller ranged. EVERYthing else got a huge buff, though. Especially Din's Fire. It is ridiculously powerful now...thank goodness the range is a bit less. And she got a SECOND Lightning Kick, Down Aerial. That is just crazy. Hell, they even increased her running speed. >.>
 * Sheik. Less changed than Zelda. You can now charge Needle Storm and walk around (finally), and her Down Aerial is like ZSS; it's better for comboing than previous, and actually sends people down now, but you could argue it both ways. The Chain is also much easier to control, and can be used as a Tether Recovery (iirc), so that's another nice thing.
 * Lucario. If you are a master defensive player - the kind who focuses on not getting KO'd rather than actively fighting - Lucario works well. You can save up Aura for when it really counts - the final few stock. Lucario has a Counter-type move, infinite wall recovery, decent air and ground attacks (not sucky, not great either). He's not ridiculously slow like Ike and he can actually recover, so I wouldn't say he's useless. Works well when you get Metal status; take damage without flinching and make good use of it.
 * Pit. Play like Sheik. Most of his attacks have some type of multi-hit/combo ability with low damage. So, you pester them with arrows, rush in and quickly slash 'em up, then wait for a good opportunity to Smash. It's a lot like playing as Meta Knight; although you don't have his superior flying ability, you've got a few different techniques. The Mirror Shield is an unbreakable one-direction Reflector, and we all know how godly useful that is. Wings of Icarus gives Pit extremely good recovery in conjunction with his multiple jumps; I believe he can return safely from just about any bottom of any stage. You can also attack once out of it. The Arrows are difficult to master, but very effective once you learn how to aim them anywhere. (Try playing against some high-level CPU Pit's - their aim is incredible) Use it frequently - when opponents are at low damage, when they're high in the air (aim up), when they're coming back from recovery and you probably can't KO them right away (~50%). You can also fairly easily killsteal with it. By the way, in Team Battles, B Side works wonders if you can get someone else to hold 'em with a Grab or other incapacitating move.


 * Snake. Is win and awesome. He's my first main and the only character I feel truly comfortable and at ease playing with. It is like playing with Marth in Melee - I am in control, and the opponent is going to lose. Let's list the awesome things...
 * Side Smash is POWERFUL, with good range (for a close-range move). You just need to learn to time it.
 * Spam the Up Smash. The Mortar is awesome for self-defense and shoots a lot higher than you'd expect when fully charged. You can get a two-hit (or more) combo by using it when the opponent is right next to you - the actual mortar will send them up as you slam it down, and then the projectile will explode.
 * Down Smash, Claymore Mines...these are great. Not only does the CPU tend to run away when you're setting them, but (from my experience) it is not at all hard to sucker people into triggering them. They send you straight upwards and deal huge damage - something like 20% - and they can very, very easily kill you. Although you can only have one at once, they are quite formidable, and it's one of my preferred killing moves.
 * Regular A Attacks - great. Up and Down have good range and pretty strong power + knockback. Side A is a two-hit combo attack, and also strong. Neutral A is a three-hit combo with far knockback for a "weak" attack. And running A? Snake has pretty much the best running attack in the game, imho. Huge range, it's even faster than actually running, it's powerful. I use it as a defensive move (rather than a side dodge or roll) quite frequently.
 * Aerial A Attacks - pretty good. Neutral aerial is a 4-hit combo that's pretty strong, but not useless if you don't get all hits. Back aerial is a powerful kick with good range that can kill pretty easily at decent percentage, and has a nice sweet spot too. Up aerial is similar. Forward aerial is a spike move, but it has a delay so it's hard to pull off. Also need to hit them in the sweet spot. If it does connect, though, it's a pretty likely kill, and fairly strong. Down aerial is kind of weak, the first three hits do little damage and don't cause much at all, and they usually won't "trap" opponents either. The fourth hit is very powerful for some reason; I've killed people with it at low percentages like ~50%. Oddly, it sends people sideways rather than up or down.
 * Grenades. These things are surprisingly strong and versatile. You can simply spam throwing them, which will usually hit someone in a 4-man fight. You can take one out, Shield to drop it, then pick it up again and throw it like a normal projectile (useful when you want to throw it vertically). It takes a bit of practice to learn the timing, as they don't explode immediately...wait about 2.5 seconds for best effect. However, if someone attacks a grenade with a strong enough move (or Fire), they will tend to explode. Useful when they're using a move that cannot be stopped or hits repeatedly, like a Fire Flower or Hammer. Did I mention they are great to toss when you're in midair and/or coming back to the edge?
 * Cypher (B Up). Very nice recovery move, for such a large and relatively heavy character Snake can make some truly incredible recoveries with this. You get partial invulnerability to knockback too. Cypher is also useful as a general move for setting up aerials because you can stop it at any time and attack out of it.
 * Guided Missile. Excellent edge guarding move. The missile also nullifies all projectiles and some attacks - try shooting it, nothing happens! Unlike Samus' Missiles, the Guided Missile does not detonate when hit unless it was a strong hit (or perhaps Fire, not sure on this). It will stop and fall straight if you Shield, so try shooting it above someone and then canceling. Although it is slow initially, it speeds up if you let it fly straight in any direction. You can surprise foes by pulling this out unexpectedly, such as when they are straight above you. Also a great counter to foes who charge with a running attack - they'll never expect this. It's pretty strong too, damage-and-knockback-wise.
 * C-4 (B Down). Wonderful move. It will stay on the stage until you die, except in a few rare cases (some certain attacks and environmental effects will detonate it early). Deals quite a bit of damage and vertical knockback, and it is quite hard to see it in the middle of a fight. Hide it early on a place people are likely to step (platforms, central crossings, edges, etc.) and wait...when they least expect it and probably have some damage on, boom! Players tend to forget where you laid the C-4, same for the Claymore Mines. You can even combine the two and set to the same spot, and then use the C-4 to also trigger the Mine. Very strong combo if both hit. Also, if you are lucky enough to use C-4 at touch range, then you basically got a free, stronger Gummy Bomb. Just watch out that they don't pass it back onto you! When this occurs you basically control that player's life, you can kill them at any time once their percent is high enough. This is also useful as an air-to-ground defense for people straight under you - drop it and use Cypher, then detonate it while you're in the air.
 * Final Smash. Takes a bit of getting used to, but pretty good. Even if you don't kill anyone you get total invincibility for ~15 seconds. It has moderate killing power, working best in 4-man where there are more people to hit. All shots will send the opponent upwards, so shoot and then shoot a bit higher. One note of caution - when you come back from the helicopter, people like Pit can tap you once and it's an off-the-stage kill since you are so high up. Recommended to immediately air-dodge and/or use Cypher (though this could also kill you if you're on a short stage).
 * Taunts. The cardboard box can KO people. That is just awesome. He also gets codecs on Shadow Moses Island which are cool.
 * Grabs. He strangles people. Which is win and awesome.

I wasn't done yet.


 * Ness, Lucas. Lucas has a ton of extremely strong moves. His Up smash, fully charged, does 30% or so. It is a real killer, but it has a slight delay. Down smash is 4 hits, good if they shield on the first or so. Neutral aerial is a multi-hit attack which should remind you of MewTwo, it's strong...Actually, all his aerials are pretty strong. Although Ness' "lightning kick" is a bit stronger. Final Smashes are nearly the same, with Lucas' being a bit harder to dodge and doing a little less damage. Side smash is...a stick. Kinda weaker than Ness' bat (which got nerfed, lol). Down A is pretty much the same as Ness' spammable kick, Side A is quicker but not necessarily stronger, Up A is stronger (or at least it seems so), running A has a delay and I personally prefer Ness' for ease of use. PK Thunder is equal, although very different. PK Freeze I personally prefer for being faster and easier to aim. I also like Lucas' PK Fire better because most people aren't stupid enough to stand in Ness' repeated burning fire. PK Magnet...Lucas can only absorb in the front, but when the move ends he does some damage to those touching the bubble. Meh. I'd generally say Lucas wins, but it all depends on the circumstances really.
 * Pikachu is great, probably even better than in Melee or the first game even. His Thunder now has ridiculous knockback when it hits a foe on the ground. His Side Smash does 20% uncharged, pretty strong.
 * Air Dodging - It is nice that you can do it repeatedly, but I made heavy use of directional air-dodging as part of my overall defense and even recovery. If you're almost at the edge, a side dodge and fast fall+roll are better than grabbing the edge or using a recovery move, since those are predictable. No, I did not wavedash, but I am really used to the old way, and simply continuing to fall in the same direction feels like helpless status.

If you have any more questions to answer, or want opinions on something, I have lots more to say.

(T/C) 05:08, 27 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Less text, more signing.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]<font color="#4682b4">Entrea Sumatae  <font color="#4682b4">[Talk]  04:39, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
 * After reading (ow my head) I agree, Snake is just win. He's the opposite of Sonic, almost all his moves can be used as finishers. Heavy ordinance FTW.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]<font color="#4682b4">Entrea Sumatae  <font color="#4682b4">[Talk]  04:46, 27 March 2008 (UTC)


 * A few notes on Zelda/Sheik... Transform takes friggin' forever now, BUT, it makes you completely invincible once it starts. Nice way to annoy people or get players to switch targets in multi-man brawls. As for Sheik's needles; upside is it only takes one button press to charge now, but it takes two presses to shoot, as opposed to the original. Also, Sheik could charge and move back in Melee too, you just need to move or dodge when she gets fully charged (starts flashing). I used to keep that saved up and use it from aerial over edges when people tried to recover.
 * They nerfed her forward-A aerial move by quite a bit since Melee; it used to have super-high knockback with no damage whatsoever, and was one of the main reasons Sheik was top-tier back then. But not a huge loss; up-smash is still nasty if you get under someone, down-smash still clears out anyone nearby, and the speed is all there just as before. Side-smash is just as it was too as far as I can tell; still works, but still not your first choice for hitting someone (especially when you could do her running-A instead). --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  06:41, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

One thing I find amusing: DeDeDe's Waddle Dee toss tosses Waddle Dee's most of the time, Waddle Doo's every 5 Dee's or so, Gordo's rarely, and in extremely rare cases... a random item! I got killed once because I tossed a Warp Star at my opponent, who then picked it up and nailed me with it. Another time I tossed an item capsule... which happened to explode on impact! Best KO ever. --Macros 15:53, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd only noticed that in Adventure mode... In any case, it's always a capsule when it's an "item" thown, its just the capsule bursts on impact into a random item.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]<font color="#4682b4">Entrea Sumatae  <font color="#4682b4">[Talk]  23:33, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Never mind, turns out it's NOT always a capsule. It can be a whole lot of other things too. No items? too bad, I throw a smash ball instead of a waddle dee.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]]<font color="#4682b4">Entrea Sumatae  <font color="#4682b4">[Talk]  23:37, 27 March 2008 (UTC)