Talk:Game updates/Archive9

bug that hasnt been fixed non existant update!!!!
anet still hasnt fixed the bug that causes random npcs to magically appear a few feet back and keep jumping a few feet in front,indefinetly.......can an admin or someone here plz put in a fix appeal,as many players are extremly annoyed by this.....


 * We are not affiliated with ANet, so having an admin here put in a support ticket is no different than having a player do so. Having said that, I believe the problem you are referring to is a simple Lag problem, not a bug. I know that happens a lot to me if I idle with Heroes or Henchmen for too long...I find that the best way to fix it is to use the /dance or some other repeating emote, and just sit there for awhile. I don't know why, but it seems to fix the problem...Entering a town usually works too. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 00:30, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

I know that problem, to fix it i minimize the game then maximize again. this mosty happens when i alt tab the game instead of using button for making the screen smaller.

Martanos

/report
/report doesn't work for me .. i don't see any new panel or anything.. am i doing something wrong ? --Kyrax 15:37, 28 September 2007 (UTC)


 * You need to type /report . If you did that: It is indeed broken. --Vipermagi 15:39, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I did that.. --Kyrax 16:02, 28 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Lol, ok... GG Anet, again? --Vipermagi 16:49, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm wondering if it might not be available yet.. maybe /report is an upcoming feature.. --Kyrax 17:58, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Maybe Anet can share how we're supposed to type Asian language characters on English keyboards. Sirocco 18:37, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Read the update notes -_- You can also target the player in question and then type /report without a name. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 19:34, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

There you go. They just made it available. You get a nice pannel with options.. i like that feature. --Kyrax 19:48, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Copy/Paste is your friend :P. Use the name from whisper if you can't see the character to click on. ~ [[Image:GeckoSprite.gif]] Pae 07:15, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Well the panel thing didn't pop up when I had the person selected. I'll try it again later. Sirocco 00:54, 29 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Can we try this then cancel the report just to test it ? TulipVorlax 01:45, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Just go to Bergen Hot Springs International District and test it there on those 55 monks.
 * It's not just bots there you know, I 55 there whenever I'm bored :P -Meridan 07:49, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Fair enough, but I bet you don't exit town by clicking on flag, stopping, then clicking outside the portal. -Ezekiel 09:03, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * No, I usually click on the flag, turn around 3 or 4 times, then exit. Usually I scrape the wall too.Nub 01:35, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The only way I could get this to work is by typing /report Hope that help folks  81.106.54.66 08:57, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I click the flag before exiting to make sure I'm going to the right place. It also helps me get to the door when I'm lagging.[[Image:Ereanorsign.jpg]]reanor 18:47, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Do you also hug the walls on your way up and occasionally run into said walls? I'm quite sure ANet bothers to check any reports anyway, so actual players don't get accidentally banned just for being in the same town. :P --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> .cнаt^  06:50, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

A player isn't repoorted until I click confirm in the Report window right?~MarioDX 21:59 October 2nd

Grr...people use the report system for revenge after loosing a pvp match! I got banned after I won an AB, and my cousin got banned for the same thing. A-net needs to improve the report system. Mando.
 * That shouldn't be possible, you can only report your own teammates for leeching, and the other /report offenses aren't tied into the Dishonorable Combat system. Only leaving matches or leeching reports flags you as dishonorable, the other functions of that command requires review by an ANet employee.  Unless you meant that you were banned from the game entirely (not from PvP via Dishonor), in which case whoever reviewed the report agreed with it.  If that's the case then it's your own darn fault, watch the language next time.  If you meant getting the Dishonor hex though, point your fingers straight at your own teammates, because they're culpable. -Gildan Bladeborn 21:09, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Another reason why I'm giving GW a very long break. Maybe they'll have the report feature smoothed out in a few months... and I'll be interested in the game again.--Dice 05:37, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Report wasn't working last night. :( It didn't bring up the report window or even say there was a problem with the command.  I was looking forward to reporting an annoying trade spammer.


 * I am very sad what Anet has done. First, this is a game where we kill monsters and other people. You have to be 18 to purchase it, and it has filters if you don't want see "foul" language. Then why in the fucking hell, Anet is turning people into hall pass monitors and baby sitters? You don't like that someone called you a fag, put the person on ignore list. Why is this game enables people with low self-esteem with gestapo like powers. If two players call each other by their pet names, why do you need to report them? Put them on ignore list and be done it, don't deprive people of communication just because you find it offensive. Instead of report, please add commands like /ignoreall (name) or /noteamall or /noteamAR (name) and be done with that. This is game, part of it is gaining experience from how people interact, so by creating /report command you are creating generation of children who whine, and scream "mommy/ daddy he said a bad word!" Such reinforcement for this behavior is mode deplorable than if someone called someone a bad name. If we worships fictional deities, kill humans and animals alike and most importantly rewarded for it, it is very hypocritical to remove real, world language interactions that might come from it. In addition, what if someone is called "Ganinya" Is that okay? Or that means "Fuck your mom" in Chinese? Or Pushy Galore? Or Futter Buck? TheRapist Monk? As you can see, when you start censorship, where will it stop? Making fun of Christmas might be offensive to a Christian,someone been proud of being gay and finding the freedom to express that on line might be offensive to most uneducated people, etc, etc, etc. I understand that there are asshats and jerks in the game, but provide proper tools in dealing with those issues. Empower people to be take charge of their environment, not into making them into army of whiners. I stopped playing GW for few reasons, and with censorship being the biggest one. When, you ANET, changed my EULA, and I had no real recourse. Imagine buying a product that is constantly changes what it is, and you have no control of it. We can make numerous analogies, but I will stop here. In the end, reporting command as it is now, is a really bad idea. Provide tools that make the game as unrestrictive as possible, yet provide different level of protection to the end-user. Thank you. I will be looking forward to GW2, I hope this important issue will be resolved by then.
 * I agree with don't having to report foul language. There are filters if your tender ears can't take it. I usually turn of team chat so enemy teams can't bitch at me, and anyone who harasses me gets the ignore list. &mdash; ♥ Jedi ♥ Rogue ♥ 02:06, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Possible Hall of Monuments Dye Fix?
All my armor was previously displaying as default gray in the Hall of Monuments (all of which is either a mixture of old dye colors, or a mixture of new dye colors). After this update, however, they are displaying correctly. If anyone else experiences this 'fix' it should be added to the notes section.Silentvex 02:51, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
 * THey all display in the color of the armor you are wearing when you enter your HoM. - Yellow Monkey (T/C) 09:24, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Lies. My armor is definately not purple. Lord of all tyria 09:31, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
 * The armour is displayed with the colour of the chestpiece, regardless of the individual colouring of the rest of your armour Nazmazh 22:46, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I had full dyed black Elite Profane, and apparently it's orange. It was easily changed though, when I swapped the order of where the armours are placed they reverted... Maybe it happens with the default grey problem? 87.81.136.71 12:23, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Did anyone notice this?
the update on the 27th had this "Underworld Hall of Monuments trophy". does anyone know what that is all about? how to obtain it? what it does, if anything. Im surprised no one has mentioned anything about this anywhere in guildwiki.. 71.93.223.99 06:21, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Monument of Honor. "Eternal Conqueror of the Underworld". Been there for awhile. (T/C) 06:22, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

OMG!
Twice, I played today on Vizunah Square, and got entwined with another group. Once, french, and the other I dont know. I have screencaps (minus name of other group) but you can see by party roster, we didnt have the heros that were tehre. As soon as we got close to them, however, togo died and both parties got booted... Update glitch, or what? Ravien Coromana 20:21, 5 October 2007 (UTC) BTW, the french group had this happen twice as well. Dont have time to upload screencaps right now
 * You need to keep both Togo and Mhenlo alive, or you fail the mission... nothing new there. ~ [[Image:GeckoSprite.gif]] Pae 20:31, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * no.... you dont understand, pae. There was a seperate group, taht WASNT in our party that was fighting with us... us 8, and them 8 (most with heros) I'll post screencap soon Ravien Coromana 20:42, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * That's a two-party mission...[[Image:bunneh.jpg]]-The Bunny  20:45, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * That's not supposed to happen though.... Ravien Coromana 20:47, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Unless you don't know what a 2-party mission is, you're failing to explain the glitch part of this. [[Image:bunneh.jpg]]-The Bunny  20:49, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 *  Screencap 1... Tell me where in that mission statement does it say otehr players are supposed to be in the PvE mission with you, that arent in your party. Ravien Coromana 20:52, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * another, better screencap. http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w261/ravi999coromana/gw068.jpg
 * oh hai --romlado

The mish has NPCs, but no 2nd party... or at least its not supposed to. Ravien Coromana 20:54, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes it is. &mdash; Skakid9090 20:54, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * It's made pretty clear in the walkthrough, actually, most notably the part that says "The mission begins with the Canthans starting from Vizunah Square (Local Quarter), getting a head start into the first courtyard area. The foreign team begins from Vizunah Square (Foreign Quarter). It is important for both teams to group up as soon as possible, while keeping their NPCs alive." - Auron 20:56, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I want to know then, why we instantly died when we met up, when both important NPC's were at full ehalth... *sigh*... togo just died out of nowhere...


 * Afflicted Soul Explosion Spike + Boss nuke? --[[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG]] -- (s)talkpage 21:08, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * You failed to protect him. Fail. End of story. Sirocco 21:36, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Togo has an affinity for getting owned. Zefir 21:49, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
 * There is 2 missions named Vizunah square, one local (for canthan born chars) and foreign (for chars born not in cantha) and those 2 teams meat up at "vizunah square" ... no glitch there Falafel 22:44, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

^ Did anyone else find this absolutely hilarious? Tain 02:57, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I thought it was cute. ~  Gold [[Image:DeanIcon.png]] Dean   - 02:59, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
 * In a sad sort of way...75.61.44.130 05:34, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
 * It is possible that the OP has never done the missions before. Or, it could be that they did them in the past with the opposing team entirely made of Henchmen... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:37, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Once Nightfall came out, it became pretty much impossible to see another team in this mission... when I first got Factions, NF wasn't released yet, and plenty of Prophecies characters were still migrating over. So the mission almost always had two full teams.
 * ...then Nightfall came out, most everyone jumped across to there, and traffic died down severely in the mission. Even on the foreign side, it's not rare to have the local side be entirely henchmen. Anyone who didn't have the chance to play the mission when there was more traffic probably never knew - and might not ever know - that it's a two-party mission. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> .cнаt^  06:14, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
 * And it's generally better that way IMO, I have had my fair share of LAME parties who are like lv2 Azns and crap like that >.> Although I did get Masters on Vizunah only because the other guy was also an MM... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 06:17, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Dual-PUG for the win/loss. It's generally an easy mission, you just need to randomly get teams that can either protect their NPC, or kill foes fast enough that it doesn't matter. At the time, if you didn't have a MM in every group, then something was wrong with the game; more often then not, you'd have to draw straws to see which MM in a group had to switch to a different Necro build. "Aw crap, what do you mean I can't MM too?! I don't even know what my other skills do!" --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> .cнаt^  06:33, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I dont want to put oil on the fire but, in second screeny he has post, we can easilly see that his group left Mhenlo behind (green triangle). So, maybe it's Mhenlo who has diyed.
 * Still, i understand him be surprised to have to do a mission with another group. I was the first time. TulipVorlax 06:50, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

Huge Bug... plz someone help me tell anet about that
After a recent update I experienced that HUGE problem. Ok everyone, look at the pictures... it tells everything... When i want to cats a spell it tells me very often not enough energy... On first picture, I have full energy (with an item in my hands). That is 33 energy and I tried to cast Recuperation Spirit. The message appeared and told me "Not enough Energy". For picture 2, the same thing happened but I wanted to cast Resilient Weapon(10 energy) when I had 13 energy, Recuperation was recharging. This is a MAJOR BUG... how do you want to heal when half of my spells don't work. It is very frustrating. I don't know how to tell ANet about this. This problem happens all game longand it has been going on for like 1 week or 2. Big Bow 20:32, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

This is a known bug with Item Spells that has been going on since...well...forever I think. See Talk:Unyielding Aura for example. Although, it does not happen all the time, since I personally haven't experienced it on my Rt. No one really knows how or why or what to do for a fix. (T/C) 21:52, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

Ok, it 's funny tho, I have been using my Rit for almost a year now and I experienced that only from 1 week or 2. Big Bow 22:02, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

October 12, 2007

 * To release "customization" from the mini pets in the Hall of Monuments you must go there and view the monument.
 * Hard Mode has been added for GWEN.
 * Hidden Treasures can appear on the first floor of a dungeon. (Screen pending. bloody dialup)
 * These hidden treasure drop less gold ( I got 38g from on in cath first floor).
 * Lightbringer's Gaze does not work in the exile anymore. --[[Image:Warrior's_Endurance.jpg|18px]] numma_cway 20:47, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Someone removed the Hard Mode Note! -- [[Image:Elisa Angelstine sig.png|25px]]Elisa Angelstine (talk) 20:49, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Put it in the correct page, please Cress Arvein 20:50, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Sorry, my bad, didn't realise.. EN HM!!! YAAAY!! -- [[Image:Elisa Angelstine sig.png|25px]]Elisa Angelstine (talk) 20:54, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Nerfed half of all skills I use!!! NOOOO!! 78.156.195.25 22:20, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Searing Flames did not need a buff...lol@Anet for buffing the most overused Fire Elite -66.167.214.151 22:50, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

I want to thank anet for completly destroying the para. My para have managed to dodge most updates but this last one was really heavy. I wonder what ppl at Anet think when they decides what skills to change, it must be something like this: I dont mind the nerfs aslong as they buff or creates new synergies with other skills but they way they are going on only nefing never buffing para skills its makes paragons not fun to play anymore.-- ( √ iktor ) 23:01, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * -Are ppl still playing the paragon?
 * -Afraid so...
 * -Wasnt the last nerf enough?
 * -No ppl are still playing "Go for the Eyes!" and "Watch yourself!" with Agressive Refrain seems to be the ongoing theme
 * -Ok, lets nerf them and buff all other classes
 * -Yeah
 * -Why did we make the paragon class to begin with?
 * -We had to make one class that was worse than all the others so ppl always can say, "atleast my class is better than the paragon"
 * -Ah thank you for refreshing my memory.
 * Heh, Paragons have now been completely nerfed. There is basicly no reason to use a para any more.--<font color="Green">Teh Uber Pwnzer 23:19, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * What they clearly "wanted" to do was add Spears as another warrior attribute instead of making half-assed new classes. Two more skills taken out of the game. Hooray. -- JadeWarrior 23:30, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Don't you people know Anets intention for paragons was for them to stand there and yell at everyone. When people started diverting from their plans and actually doing a mediocre job in combat something had to be done!--<font color="Black">Sefre  [[Image:Sefresig.jpg|15px|]] Talk*Cont. 23:34, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
 * What they should have done is just named the profession "Bard". At least that would have been more in line with their intentions, and then people wouldn't be as angry when the profession's combat skills are nerfed.  Shadowlance 01:26, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * They should have named it cheerleader.

Heh, they made Droks runs a little easier for my assassin. And "charge" has a 33% speed buff.24.4.196.143 01:33, 13 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Another, another update, same batch of complains. They said the skills changed was in testing phase guys. TulipVorlax 01:50, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * And? Most of the time when they do this thing they wind up keeping them the same when they permanently apply the update, if you stay quiet they'll think every thing is alright and accepted. 68.204.126.178 02:33, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I want to rape and mutilate everyone that says 'paragons suck'. They're still one of the best professions to have, they're team wide defense is nigh unmatchable --Blue.rellik 03:16, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed, I'll take a good def para over a prot monk any day. -Malcheior Sveth 03:42, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The buff to SF's burning is a big buff to ToF, too. Still, WY! was nice as an armor boost - not JUST energy management. Tain 04:11, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Freaking cracked armor being reapplied constantly is killing the energy of my h/h monks.75.61.44.130 21:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Gasp, I might actually need to think about bringing Aggressive Refrain! I can always use other adrenaline boosters if I need to. I think Izzy should change the CrAr condition to a simple -20AR while it's active though, reapplying the condition over and over is rather annoying. Just give me the armor debuff already. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  23:54, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

It appears as though Lightbringer's Gaze isn't working in the Domain of Anguish anymore.. was this part of this update or did I miss it in a previous one? I haven't been there in a while but was shocked this weekend to see that gaze didn't work on the elite Margonites! --Pooder 15:23, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Memory Leak
anyone noticed a higher usage of their system memory in GW? i have a gig of memory but at some stage GW was using up to 480mb of my system memory. Has anyone also noticed a drop in performance? i am running a GeForce 7900gt which up till recently was more then enough for GW - but now my frame rate seems to be a bit random - dropping to 10 or so out in open areas for no reason. --XistdedOne 00:49, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I thought it was just me, lately performance has been quite choppy and nothing else has changed. Guild Wars is the only title having framerate issues, and it used to run quite smoothly. -Gildan Bladeborn 18:07, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


 * No issues here in Holland. My shitty pc is not shittier than before. It might be the rep weekend screwing you over, many people online these days. --[[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG]] -- (s)talkpage 18:10, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


 * I've been having issues ever since GW:EN came out, but never thought much of it Zefir 19:27, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Hmmm i dunno - just annoys me when im out farming and i die cause my frame rate becomes non-existant - i would agree that since GWEN was released it started - i thought it could have been my video drivers but im runing the NVidia release just b4 the current beta drivers.... ahh who knows - might be another issue with my damn card--XistdedOne 00:01, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Seeing it here too, although not just in the last update. I'm not sure when the problem first started, but just the other day GW was running slowly so I minimized it and opened Task Manager.  GW was taking up about 500Mb and the memory usage number was steadily climbing.  Shadowlance 15:57, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Resurrection SAND!?!
Perhaps my understanding of things is inaccurate, but regarding "Moved the first Resurrection Shrine in Vulture Drifts to the side of the portal into Dunes of Despair" from the 12 Oct 2007 Update. I read this to mean that just outside of the zone gate from the Dunes of Despair there is now a rez shrine. Unless I've encountered a weird bug, no shrine exists there. Mind you, I purposefully died and was resurrected on the patch of sand next to the ruined building. Right where the collector Uderit Ignis is standing (until I got rezzed - and then poof he's gone), but no shrine. -- Sabardeyn 01:23, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Must be a bug. ANet doesn't usually move rez shrines... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:32, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * It's in body of the update notes... Maybe it just isn't "fully" implemented (i.e. with graphics) yet. &mdash; [[Image:Fin_sig.gif|User:Kyrasantae]] <font color=#000080>kyrasantae   04:42, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * What I meant was that this is the first time I remember ANet ever doing such a change, ie moving a rez shrine. They have changed the activation radius before, sure, but not moved an entire shrine. So maybe this is a new thing and they didn't get it quite right. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:44, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * FYI there was no shrine outside Dunes of Despair before. If you died, you where resed in the middle of the portal to that location (I guess that was a safety measure). &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 06:46, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Adding's still different than moving >.> [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 07:19, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes it is. My comment was just some general Trivia :P &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 09:58, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Lightbringer and DOA
anyone noticed if lightbringer is working or not in DOA. I read on guru that it wasnt anymore - and i noticed after a gloom run that i didnt do anywhere near the normal dmg to the monsters with LB on.--XistdedOne 10:34, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

yes I noticed that as well. lb gaze doesn't work on any creatures in DoA anymore. It makes no sense to me as they are Margonites. Removing lb gaze from affecting the stone summit in Slaver's Exile I can understand, but this is the kind of place/creatures lb was made for, isn't it? --Pooder 14:39, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

/in new update they nerfed
they just killed the assasin skill deadly paradox by changing it to 33% anyone else completly pissed?
 * It was stronger than Mantra of Recovery and was non-elite. Tell me, exactly, HOW that was balanced? --Kale Ironfist 00:26, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The builds using it were far too strong. It needed to be nerfed. Zefir 00:34, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Doesnt realy change much - i tested it with some builds i run - makes u have to react faster is all ^^--XistdedOne 01:00, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * It was only to prevent perma-shadowformers without re-nerfing arcane echo. I doubt ANet cares as much about the deadly arts sins as all the people griefing in arenas and having super hax farming builds and such. 69.40.249.50 01:10, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm almost positive it was because of me! User:JediRogue/Nerf Shadow Form. &mdash; ♥ Jedi ♥ Rogue ♥ 01:17, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * You can still use Shadow Form to great effect in farming and running; the few uses I can think of for Shadow Form in farming is Solo Green A/E, which does not use a perma-SF, so it's a moot point. Oh noes, I've got to wait a little bit longer in a completely safe position while SF recharges. The other use is Elemental Sword farming, which is essentially the same build as the Solo Green farmer, and also doesn't use perma-SF.
 * In running, perma-SF isn't a great tactic; I've run Droks before with a build like that, and it doesn't help me at all. Granted, the nerf to Chilibans (sp?) means I've got no more weaknesses aside from AoE damage, but hell, I'm not planning to sit in a mob for an hour anyway. I can deal with a few more seconds of downtime; I was planning ahead for a downtime anyway.
 * The one thing this hit hard was Deadly Arts 'Sins. They still work, of course, but not quite as fast. They're, what's the word, balanced now? In my opinion, at least. I'm hoping this nerf is a permanent one, because that means we've got a better chance of seeing buffs to a lot of other skills. Other skills which generally came with the comment "yes, I know it's underpowered in it's current form, but if we reduce the recharge, it'll be broken with Deadly Paradox."
 * ...that reminds me, I need to get back on my 'Sin for some farming again. I'm low on gold. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  03:27, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * They still need to do something about Deadly Haste. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 10:22, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * No reason to fix what's not broken. Deadly Haste is just fine. Critical Strikes is a primary attribute.87.174.231.9 10:54, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * ...that has no half ranged spells and isn't a desirable caster attribute since every other skill [is / needs / does something upon] an attack. The lack of half-ranged spells in general aside. &mdash; Poki#3 [[Image:Poki.jpg|19px|My Talk Page :o]], 01:45, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * A/E Water Trident spammer! -Ezekiel 02:16, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I can't believe they nerfed chilblains. After seeing the shadowformers in AB (and the noobs wasting time trying to kill them) I was about to start running chilblains for laughs, but Anet nerfed it before I could do that :(.
 * Yes, it's true, many of the skills you wouldn't normally see in a match, but some are extremely viable options. Besides, its worth bringing one just to watch him/her crap their pants when you do.  I wish ANET would stop nerfing things just because everyone has to use their cookie cutter builds.  I bet SOMEONE on your team could find good use out of something below:
 * Interrupt the cast (easier to interrupt the Arcane Echo) - Signet of Disruption, Leech Signet, Shove, Grapple, Signet of Judgment
 * Remove it - Rending touch (actually quite popular on W/D), Expunge Enchantments, Grenths Aura, Winds of Dis, Signet of Disenchantment.
 * Disable it - Signet of Humility, Blackout
 * Rend touch is a spell, so it won't work against shadow form. --Kale Ironfist 22:23, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * doh, good call - thought it was a touch skill like a bites. And that was one of my biggest selling points as I see it a lot in R/TA.  Hey let the annoying touch ranger steal his health.  They can go fight in the corner :) --Phoenix

Perma Shadow Form Still Not Nerfed
Muhahahaha. Still works fine.--<font color="Green">Teh Uber Pwnzer 01:25, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * So long as it's harder to do, I think ANet did what they meant. :D And as a small aside, people should run Expunge Enchantments and Signet of Disenchantment more often. Assassins generally don't mind losing their self-heal for a few seconds, and it rips off multiple enchants, right through Shadow Form, Spell Breaker, and Obsidian Flesh... Signet of Disenchantment makes you lose all your energy, but on a Mesmer, you've got at least ten ways to gain that back, and as a Warrior/Paragon, you generally don't need the energy to begin with. Dervishes can also bring Rending Touch, which is better then you might expect, as is Winds of Disenchantment. WoD is particularly useful for ripping off stuff like Aegis, providing you've got enough enchantments on yourself. And Grenth's Aura is pretty nasty with Pious Fury. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  06:56, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Its just as easy, all you have to do is relearn your timing. It in no way affected how perma shadow form works. The new timing on the skills is actually easier imo. And btw, rending touch = spell, so it doesn't work vs. shadow form.--<font color="Green">Teh Uber Pwnzer 22:32, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Ah right, I was thinking Touch = hit. Still stuck in Touch = Expertise mode. :P But Expunge still stands as a hugely underused enchantment removal skill, especially on a class that has big trouble with blocking enchantments ("oh noes, my lead attack missed! I'll just sit here for five minutes while it recharges"). You know what's fun? Recall 'Sin vs. Expunge 'Sin. Make sure to have the /wave emote all ready to go. --[[image:GEO-logo.png]]<font color="#237d00"> Jïörüjï Ðērākō.> <font color="#237d00">.cнаt^  02:32, 19 October 2007 (UTC)