User talk:Dr ishmael/Archive 4

Lolpreview
Even though most of those edits are normal or human-bot-mode. But that's not the point ;) --- -- (s)talkpage  16:52, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Yay, new userboxes are always shiney! :D  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 17:47, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * And actually, I do use show preview somewhat often, but I usually don't bother with it on smaller edits ("What could I possibly have messed up with that little change?" >.>) or when using templates I think I'm familiar with. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 17:53, 16 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Glad you like it (even though you altered it to a little less blunt ;) ). I generally use Show Preview when I make an edit with a ton of links, cause I often flunk those >.> And when I use several indents, to make it look at least a little good (i.e., not one word on a new line, then starting a new paragraph. Looks blehh) ^^' --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  18:38, 16 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Less blunt and more accurate. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 19:48, 16 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Lies. All lies. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  19:57, 16 August 2008 (UTC)


 * LIES AND SLANDER! (with a hint of pie!) Jink 20:09, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * What about cake? Random Time  20:15, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The cake is a lie, of course. Duh. Jink 20:18, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Cake is fine with me. It's Pie that can control me...  I should not have said that.--[[Image:Gigathrash_sig_G.jpg]]ìğá†ħŕášħ  20:21, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Someone make a Pie MTG card --Gimmethegepgun 20:23, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Entrea pie card.jpg|100px]] Someone made one! YAY! --Gimmethegepgun 00:58, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Viper, I hate to disappoint you, but if you run your browser fullscreen, you should experiment with shrinking it to a window and playing with the width. Unless you are inside a block with a fixed width, preferably in em or ex, you can't predict how many words will be on that line for the next viewer. If you must avoid single word lines, don't use plain space between the last three words of a paragraph, use &amp;nbsp; instead.
 * --◄mendel► 21:01, 16 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I know that. I run windowed, cause I like the taskbar, so to say >.>
 * Still, as long as it's aesthetically pleasing to me, it's fine to me. However obvious you find that statement, I leave to you. Besides, remembering some obscure command is hard for lazy people ;) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  21:34, 16 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It's not obscure. & nbsp; = non-breaking space. The ampersand sets off the code, and the semi-colon ends it. &mdash; Powersurge360  21:53, 16 August 2008 (UTC)


 * & rarr; = Right Arrow (larr = Left Arrow etc). Which is logical. nbsp is just some string of letters to me. Oh, and somehow a part of my message above got left out O_o" I don't exactly recall what's missing, but it involved resolution (since that also matters). --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  08:39, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Why?
Doesn't harm anyone last time I checked... --- -- (s)talkpage  17:26, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Because Rose said I should. >.> I guess it does just clutter RC even more than I'm already doing, though.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 18:12, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Actually, she only is saying "I want (emphasis on want) it just in the Upload log, so I remove the Summary", not "It shouldn't show up on the page besides the log". --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  19:20, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Actually, I just like pinning the blame on other people. <.< &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 19:32, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Well, I've seen people get upset at other uploaders and myself for renaming their images without credit. And leaving the note in the Summary (which is placed automatically, unfortunately) is not right.  But, I guess, afterall, we can always slap them with "If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly or redistributed by others, do not submit it." So yeah, it's just a courtesy thing, nothing else. Like I said before, I try to do it for the "good" images that will likely be permanent, but usually don't bother with placeholders. RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 17:36, 19 August 2008 (UTC)


 * If that line of text is in the summary, you're giving them credit, right? Don't see why it isn't "right", but might just be me. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  17:50, 19 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Leaving it in the Summary isn't right, because the Summary should reflect the essence of the image, not who uploaded it. You're basically saying "This is an image that was originally uploaded by so-and-so."  This is NOT a good summary for an image.  The upload log is the only place that keeps track of who uploaded an image, and if it has the second uploader's name with the original uploader's name next to it, I think that's the proper way to do it, or don't do it at all.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 18:32, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The essence of the image is usually given in the form of a caption on pages it's used, explanation (talk pages) or it's so dead-obvious it's not necessary to have a summary saying "this is a pic of X doing Y" though. --Shadowcrest  18:44, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, in most cases, yes, it is dead-obvious, and there shouldn't be a summary at all. I don't see why a single enty to RC makes such a big difference.  Anyway, there's no point in discussing this so much, it's personal preference, and I will continue doing it, but others don't have to.  RoseOfKali [[Image:RoseOfKaliSIG.jpg]] 21:41, 19 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm not going to do it for the armor gallery reuploading so I don't kill RC. This way I only create two entries per image (delete/upload) instead of three (delete/upload/edit).  Both deletions and uploads are easy to skip over in RC because the line is formatted differently, doubly so if you use Enhanced RC, but single edits to many different articles aren't. &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dr ishmael (contribs).


 * I would have thought that fixing image naming would have better been done when that fabled update to mediawiki which allows image moving came along <_< Jennalee 23:03, 21 August 2008 (UTC)


 * We don't know when the next version of MediaWiki will be released (or even if said feature will make it into the final build), much less when Wikia will get around to implementing it. I saw no point waiting for something that might not even happen.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 23:29, 21 August 2008 (UTC)

Language links
I'd appreciate it if you could comment on the new developments/my suggestion at Suggestions/I18n_template and its talk page. --◄mendel► 16:20, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

We need...
A "Hide Dr ishmael's edits" button for RC :P --Gimmethegepgun 22:18, 21 August 2008 (UTC)


 * If you send him some pie in the mail, he'll make you some javascript that modifies your RC on the fly to hide these edits. ;-) --◄mendel► 22:42, 21 August 2008 (UTC)
 * No, pie is Giga's weakness. We don't know how it will affect Ishy.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  23:00, 21 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I will never reveal my weakness! >.>  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 23:28, 21 August 2008 (UTC)


 * A similar feature has been previously requested, but the Big Chicken decided we didn't have enough resources available to develop it. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 23:28, 21 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Hm, last time I switched to my bot account for the rest of that project (updating ULC-ed categories), dunno if that would be acceptable for this project, though. I couldn't delete the images, for one thing.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 01:16, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
 * And since you've already mentioned stuff about evil plans, we definitely can't give the bot the ABILITY to delete stuff :P --Gimmethegepgun 04:33, 22 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Meh, I'm not gonna worry about it. Of course, I've still got 9 professions to go, so if you people think it's annoying enough, you could always poke the Beercrat.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 04:55, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

Animated Hero Bug Category
I noticed you didn't talk the talk here - it's too late for that now, but I moved the whole diff dialogue to the talkpage anyhow.

Oh, and could you please comment on Category talk:Animated? Does your objection still stand? --◄mendel► 02:53, 24 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Short answer: "Animated" is a stupid name for a category. Wikia is frustrating me with its slow response times right now, so I don't feel like coming up with a better response on that issue.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 03:25, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

more about armor templates
Just wanted to say, first of all, that you're doing a great job with updating all the armor pages with templates and new crafting tables. I like that you changed the armor template to "align images by height" instead of width, but you forgot to do the same for headgear images, as can be seen on Ranger_Monument_armor, for example. I prefer to let you handle all this, since I haven't looked at exactly what you did with the code, and I don't want to mess stuff up. Thanks again for the great job you're doing. RoseOfKali 17:11, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * On that topic: Ranger armor has some red links, so to say... --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  17:34, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Every time I saw a gallery like that I thought, "I should go and make the headgear images fixed-height, too," but I never got around to it. I'll do that now.
 * And I am going to update all the armor index pages to use the correct images, I just had to go to a meeting, then to lunch, then actually do some work before getting back to the wiki. (I'm a major slacker when it comes to my real job, if you hadn't already figured that out. :P)  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 18:41, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay, head images changed to fixed-height. The current settings are x375px for full-body images and x125px for head images.  If anyone thinks these need to be changed for any reason, let me know.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 18:53, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

House
Wow. Congrats :> I hope the moving over goes well! --- -- (s)talkpage  14:26, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Where will you be living? [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 14:30, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * We're moving from Little Rock up to Conway, AR. It's a really nice city of just over 50,000, and it's where we both went to college, at Hendrix College (we met there, but we didn't start dating each other until after we'd graduated).  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 18:26, 27 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Ah, the good old days... (you asked for it ^^) Ignoring the fact I probably wasn't aware America existed back then. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  18:48, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It didn't exist back then, Viper. You're forgetting how old Ish is. [[Image:Felix_Omni_Signature.png]] 21:08, 27 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Oh, right, because the college was floating in the middle of the sea, unsupported whatsoever, and Ish and his wife miraculously appeared there in a puff of logic, and studied. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:24, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Considering the other feats documented in my biography, that actually sounds pretty plausible. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 14:43, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Now it is such a bizarrely improbable coincidence that anything so mind-bogglingly useful could have evolved purely by chance that some thinkers have chosen to see it as a final and clinching proof of the non-existence of God. The argument follows:  "I refuse to prove that I exist," says God, "for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing."  "But," says Man, "the Babel fish is a dead giveaway, isn't it?  It could not have evolved by chance, thus proving that you exist, therefore by your own arguements, you don't.  QED."  "Oh, dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic. -- D. Adams
 * Stop stealing phrases from my userpage without at least referencing the author, Viper. :> Also, GL in your new/old home, Doc! [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:49, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * /pout, you caught me. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:51, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Actually I floated in on a large scallop shell towed by dire trilobites. Jink 19:19, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

random halp
User:Entropy/NFT - why so many skillbars show up with "No icon for this skill" when that's clearly not the case? Too many of them on the page? (T/C) 15:10, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Yep, that's it. I saw the same thing when I was on the build redlinks crusade - people would have 20 or so build articles all smashed together in one userpage (HATE HATE HATE), and the latter half of the page would have hardly any icons in the skill bars.  It's probably something to do with the high number of #ifexist calls, even though it's not enough to trigger the warning message.
 * We could make an alternative skill bar template without the #ifexist's, to be used only in cases where you know that the skill and matching icon actually exist. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 15:16, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, wait - the "too many #ifexist calls" warning only shows up when you edit the page (similar to the "this page is too long" warning, which that page also gets), it says you have 235 on there. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 15:20, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Hrm...well I can't think of a fix without making a new template, because there is no other clean and pretty way to display skills while saving excessive scrolling. Strangely, the page didn't used to break. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:24, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I think, before we got bought by Wikia, the #ifexist limit was 500 (I've seen comments implying that on talk pages somewhere), but here on Wikia it's only 100. Maybe we just need to bug Kyle to get them to raise the limit back to 500.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 15:32, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * pvx:User:Entropy/NFT imo :P I don't think PvXcode has a limit, it'll just take a long time to load and the bbcode doesn't start working until everything's loaded. You could also try just putting the builds the enemies use on a different page, which would help some. Maye several different pages :(  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 16:51, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Just bug Kyle. Less effort. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  16:56, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

gw2w
have you had a peak at gw2w? Your name has come up in talks about sysops and I think you're ability to like organize and clean stuff up would be especially helpful over there in setting up something new. &mdash;♥ Jedi ♥ Rogue ♥ 02:06, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Seconded.--[[Image:Marcopolo47 signature new.jpg]] (Talk) (Contr.) 02:14, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
 * That makes me laugh slightly. It hardly seems like they have enough stuff there to warrant talk about sysops. Heck, the whole wiki is just a consolidation of the GW2 related lore from other sources. All the same, if they feel they need another admin, Ishy's a good choice.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:20, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I sort of share Entrea's feelings - I hadn't given much thought to GW2W since the game is still at least a year away from release. Also, there's still so much to do here, that I didn't want to get involved somewhere else just yet.  But if y'all want me along for the ride, just point me in the right direction - i.e., where are these talks you mentioned?  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 04:55, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

relinking Throne Of Secrets
I didn't see a section on GuildWiki talk:Bot_tasks/Relinking_moved_pages for actually relinking pages that have already been moved, so I thought I'd request that one here (feel free to move this thataway). has been moved to Throne Of Secrets in December 2006, so it'd be a good idea to check if Anet hasn't actually fixed the name in the meantime. --◄mendel► 13:06, 29 August 2008 (UTC)


 * The official wiki still has it at GWW:Throne of Secrets, but in the Gw.dat files, the name is Throne Of Secrets. If I had more time, I'd take a character through Abaddon's Gate and get 100% screenshot proof, but I don't.  I might have time to run AWB on that later today, or it might have to wait until tomorrow.  (And I'd say you can use Bot tasks/Relinking moved pages for pages that have been moved at any time.)  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 14:28, 29 August 2008 (UTC)

Sorry but...
I'm new to this and I been trying to set up my userpage. I tried that character template which you linked to for your credits, but when I fill it out, the link is red and directs me to the page where it says something like: "The page you clicked is removed/non existant." Any ideas of how to avoid that? Also how exactly do you make/get those userboxes? (Sorry if I mess this up too by the way.) Kennenth 17:18, 1 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Nobody asks for wikicode assistance on Request assistance - I wonder why that is? Anyhow, I'm going to have a look - I'll be right over. --◄mendel► 17:30, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

HALP!
Happen to have any level 20 toons with The Villainy of Galrath active? I need the modified instance to clear the vanq H/H way. You don't even have to do anything, just go AFK and get a free vanq, lol. &mdash; Powersurge360  00:40, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I've got a few. I'm heading out right now for an hour or so, if you can wait until I get back.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 00:57, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Special:Wantedpages
I thought tehre was a move to get rid of the build redlinks from wanted pages by a bot or some such thing? I went over to look at it to see how much red-linkage we were looking at for the MOX stuff and it was all cluttery with build links still. Am I crazy or could you just refresh me on whatever we were doing with this? &mdash;♥ Jedi ♥ Rogue ♥ 13:57, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Dammit, I thought I was done with that... where the hell did all those come from? I'll just blame it on Wikia... I'm sure it's their fault somehow. >.>  I don't care enough anymore to worry about relinking any of them to PvX, I'm just going to obliterate the links with AWB; unfortunately, I can't run AWB at work because of our stupid company-wide firewall.  Blarg.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 14:46, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Can't even get around a firewell? :p [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 14:59, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I remember some Wikia thing where the list of wanted pages or something won't show you the full list beyond a certain number of pages until you fix all those. Maybe that was the problem. Or perhaps you didn't fix links like this: SS Nuker which get renamed within the link? I dunno...Anyway, so you are just going to remove the sets of brackets , correct? Later on, when there is no more pressing project, I suppose another bot round could take all those text and link them to PvX. [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 15:04, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I checked a few of 'em, and they're mostly in the userspace.. You did run over them, so I checked some out from [1]. The DeletedLink templates are registered as wantedpages? --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  15:14, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I hope this doesn't require someone versed in the ways of the Mediawiki. What we have is the reverse situation that Iran into when DPL-ing the non-orphaned artciles: then, links would register when I first did them, only to disappear later; here, they disappeared, only to unfortunately reappear. My suggestion: make all missing build pages redirects to a page that says, in essence: "this build has been deleted in the , go look for it on, please." --◄mendel► 17:14, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * No. We don't need to create 100+ worthless redirect pages just to deal with these stupid build links, they simply need to be removed (we actually had a discussion about this before, can't remember where).  If DeletedLink isn't working right (which totally defeats its purpose), I'll just have to delink them completely.  I doubt very many people even look at these pages anymore in any case - if I went totally bonkers and deleted all of the userspace build archives, I bet I'd get maybe 1 or 2 complaints.
 * A good compromise might be to delink all build links, as I plan to do anyway, then post a notice at the top of the page similar to what mendel suggested. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 18:04, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I suggest keeping on using DeletedLink, the advantage is that you can edit that now to not link at all any more, and thus fix the immediate problem in one fell swoop. --◄mendel► 21:29, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Is there someway we can have the entire namespace point to a single page? Also, if they are categories, just outright delete the reference. &mdash;♥ Jedi ♥ Rogue ♥ 21:32, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Categories -> delete, check. How about templates (Template:Build archive, etc.), delete them too?  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 21:50, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Move the templates into obsolete templates cat? I don't see why redirect pages are "worthless", they preserve integrity of sorts for external links, creating a redirect page takes less resources than editing a wiki page, and it doesn't actually load the server in a noticeable way, certainly less than a DeletedLink call does. It's a solution. Click away on the wantedpages, copy&paste the redirect to the warning page, and I can have these manually botted fast and efficiently. Or make a page list from Wantedpages, filter by build: namespace, and have AWB do it. It works, it is efficient, it has the benefit of keeping links elsewhere from the intarweb not pointing into space. --◄mendel► 22:22, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * What would happen if Template:DeletedLink rewrote the link to use a http: style URL? Do these still redlink? If they don't, the functionality is not too bad, because a reader can click and doesn't notice when the page exists and gets a 404 when the page doesn't. Can we customize our mediwiki message for nonexisting pages (do you wnat to create this page?) so that it discourages creatingthat page if it starts with build: ? --◄mendel► 22:28, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd say either do the redirect (Maybe to GW:BUILD?) or just change Deletedlink to remove the #ifexists function altogether. If you just have the template always link to the deletion log, problem solved. It seems like that function was always kind of pointless, since the template should (in theory) only be used on redlinks.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  22:30, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * We've used it on some talkpages to avoid redlinking for pages we proposed creating, if memory serves. --◄mendel► 23:22, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Mendel, you don't know the history of this issue. Back in April, Warwick started doing exactly what you are proposing to do - and she was stopped, and the pages re-deleted, because literally everyone else argued against it.  So to fix the issue, I proposed writing a bot script that would take the links and rewrite them, either with a link to PvX (based on a build correspondence list drawn up by Wizardboy777) or with a DeletedLink.  I wish we'd know back then that DeletedLink doesn't really work, then I could've just de-linked everything from the beginning.  Which I still say is the best solution now.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 23:37, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
 * That list only had ones with 10+ links, if memory serves. Might've been 5. But I definitely didn't get all of them.  &not; Wizårdbõÿ777  ( talk ) 02:56, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * It was 10+, and I think that was enough - don't do any more unless you want to. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 03:52, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Just redirect the rest to a Mending Frenzy Healsig Warrior with description "This build was so bad it never made it into the mainstream" [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 04:18, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Heh, that's what probably 50% of them were anyway - and taking the present state of the game, most of the rest would be too, due to all the skill updates since then. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 04:57, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Sabway
I've been doing some research on popular builds like sabway, imbagon, etc. and considering the current state of a lot of the skills I frnakly cannot see how they are so good. Meh. Skuld's Para build still ownz though. (T/C) 05:01, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Sabway is awesome because you have a great defense and good damage with only 3 heroes used (less proficient in 4 man areas, you will need some alterations :P ). Soul Reaping gives them all the Energy they need to perform well. I fondly recall running 3 or 4 MMs + Sabway with Prog and rolling through Tyria like a.. Idk what, but it's fast. It's great to see a monster targetted by most Minions and Barbs, then just laying dead moments later. I ramble on too much. Sorry :) --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  14:52, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I guess I will have to try it. I just don't understand how it could work...where do you get enough bodies for 4 MMs anyway? [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:40, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * 4 MMs? o_O Not in the Sabway I know.  Sabway is 1 MM, 1 SS, and 1 Restoration healer.  The rest of the party slots should be damage-dealers, although at least 1 additional heal or prot monk is usually advised.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 01:43, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I am just thinking that if you ran a solid Curses SS and a solid Restoration Rit, it would be more effective. MMs usually don't use all eight skill slots so I can see there being room for spare utility...especially on a Bomber. I've never ran a serious build using primary and secondary profession skills, unless it was for something unlinked like Wild Blow or very gud like Mending Touch (or something OP like Scythe Sin)... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 01:56, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * You might want to look at this build on PvX, then, it's exactly what you're saying: Curses SS, Resto N/Rit, and a Minion Bomber that has half a bar for utility skills. And that's what I've always known as Sabway.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 02:01, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Whuu? I was under the impression that Sabway and Triple Necro Vanquish were identical things. That's what I always see in-game too. PvX and Viper seem to say otherwise... [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:07, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I suk. Nevermind. We should put a tag on this whole subheader. :L [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:09, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Trip Nec Vanquish and Sabway are thesame :) PvX just refrains from referring to a build-creator in PvE builds. It's fine in PvP builds though, for some reason. As I said above, I ran 3 or 4 MMs in addition to Sabway. There were enough corpses because the only Minionspells we had were Bone Minions and Flesh Golems, thus using corpses to full efficiency ;) And Rt/N's cannot hold more than 7 Minions or something close to that. Maybe 8, not sure about the Death Magic stuff. Also, you forgot to close the fail tag, now everything below is fail too! Onoz~ --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG|Ohaider!]]-- (s)talkpage  12:27, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * D'oh, I missed that part of your comment too, otherwise I could've clarified everything for Entropy a lot sooner. /facepalm Giga's the one who added the fail tag, and it is closed - right after Entropy's comment about adding the fail tag in the first place.  But now, since I failed too, I'm going to move it to right after this comment, just to confuse you. :P  Anyway, 4 MM's + Sabway sounds like a lot of fun... too bad my wife doesn't like Hard mode and won't vanquish with me. >.>  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 13:40, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Userboxes question
How do you get those userboxes? I'm gonna try to make my user page uber cool, but I don't know how to get all that cool stuff on there. could someone let me know how?75.45.245.244 01:06, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Just click any of the "[edit]" links on my userpage to look at the code, then copy whatever you want and modify it to use on your userpage. You'll have to register an account in order to have a userpage, of course.  Userboxes, specifically, usually use the  template - look at the documentation there to learn how to use it.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 01:10, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Tyvm, and sry about the IP address, I forgot to sign in lol :O Fire Drake 01:12, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Fixed your fail link, ishy.[[Image:Entrea Sumatae.png|Entrea Sumatae]] Entrea   [Talk]  02:43, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I always forget to remove the pipe when I initially type a wiki-link and then have to replace it with a standard link. &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 02:45, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Too much working with templates does that. :) [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 02:48, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Pipes, pipes, everywhere! And not a plumber in sight!  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 02:52, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Hehe :p I'll give you another point if you can tell me the real-life city where Mario comes from. Also: "God doesn't exist. And just try to find a plumber on weekends!" [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 05:35, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Brooklyn? That's where they lived in The Super Mario Bros. Super Show!, but I don't know if they were supposed to have been born there.  Also: Woody Allen = pwnage.  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 13:47, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You win two points. :> But you won't know this. "Two rights don't make a wrong, they make an airplane." [[Image:Entropy Sig.jpg]] (T/C) 21:17, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

wah!
Dammit, why do the updates always happen while I'm eating dinner?! >:( /fistshake  &mdash;Dr Ishmael  01:31, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * So that I get to increase my editcount instead of you :P --Gimmethegepgun 01:31, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I've always known Anet was against me - constantly nerfing farming runs the day after I get the right character to the right place with the right skills - now they're nerfing my editcount farming! Curses!  &mdash;Dr Ishmael [[Image:Diablo_the_chicken.gif]] 01:35, 11 September 2008 (UTC)