Talk:The False Gods

Explanation: 1) Abbot Ramoth is passing by, so that tower is obviously not "his" 2) This quest is trivial, it can be done with 4-5 people, no need to tie it with Galrath's quest. --Karlos 22:56, 30 Sep 2005 (EST)
 * 1) That's true.
 * 2) I agree there is no need to tie it with Galrath's quest, but it is often convenient to do so. As I wrote, it is just a short detour and it is a nice "warm-up". This is how I've successfully done it 4 times in the past: Form a party for Temple of the Ages and Galrath at Bergen Hot Springs > run to the Temple > increase party size from 6 to 8 and pick up False Gods quest from Mizar > do False Gods quest > do Galrath quest. --Tetris L 23:40, 30 Sep 2005 (EST)


 * Well, I have never done it that way. But again, think of this objectively, not personally.. Would you advise anyone doing this quest, that can be done quickly, with no more than 5 henches.. Would you advise them to wait in ToA begging for a Galrath party? I believe your advice is faulty. The quest does not NEED the bigger party, and those doing Galrath might actually tell you NO we won't go do it. --Karlos 00:21, 1 Oct 2005 (EST)


 * You assume that Galrath parties start from the Temple. I found that most of the time a party going for Galrath will originally start from Lion's Arch (where the quest is given) or Bergen. From here the party will first go to the Temple, but only for a short stop (to "unlock" it for maps travel and to increase party size). This means the majority of such a party enters the Temple for the first time, and has not done the False Gods quest yet. And even if one or two of them have done the quest, I have never had a case where somebody minded to do it again, because it's so quick and easy.
 * Oh, and gimme a break already about that "objectivity" you keep claiming for yourself. It's getting old, and I think the fact alone that we have to argue about so many things is proof enough that most things are infact a matter of taste, interpretation, personal experience, whatever. If you'd strip all subjective content from GuildWiki and leave only the FACTS then there wouldn't be much left. For sure most quest walkthroughs would be gone, because those are typically full of subjective tips. For example, see your own note: On one hand you say this quest is "trivial". On the other hand you find it necessary to warn people about Ramoth's healing. Now this is something that *I* find pretty trivial. Kill healers first is a basic principle that we shouldn't have to mention in every quest. --Tetris L 01:10, 1 Oct 2005 (EST)


 * No disrespect, the only people I've seen start from Lion's Arch are noobs. Why on earth would anyone start it from there? Double the distance, double the trouble! Why not start the quest from Divinity Coast or Fishermen's Haven?! If you don't know the optimal ways of doing a quest, are you certain you are qualified to give tips about it?
 * The walkthrough section is not a complete sea of subjectivity and innuendo as you paint it. It is to help readers do the quest, opitmally if possible. That is the criteria I enforce at least. If I see notes that do not help, or notes that help but offer a way inferior to what is already suggested, I remove them to prevent the walkthroughs from becoming that sea of subjectivity you are referring to.
 * With regards to the note, I put it in Villainy where it makes a lot more sense. But to put it here is overkill. Sorry, you don't like it. Call it subjective if you like. You seem to be taking all of this too personally. --Karlos 01:32, 1 Oct 2005 (EST)
 * You start from Bergen because at one point you have to go to the Temple for the first time anyway. Let's assume you don't want to do this run solo or with henchies, but with a party of humans. If you look for a party to go to the Temple you might as well look for a party to do Galrath, cos that's killing two birds with one stone. For me, the trip to the temple is the "test" whether the party is capable to do Galrath. If they don't manage to reach the temple, they sure as hell won't manage to complete Galrath. But if they do, then there is a good chance.
 * Having said that, I agree most of the people LFP for Galrath in Lion's Arch are newbies who have just picked up the quest for the first time and think it's a quest like all the others that can be done with a group of level 12 humans and a few henchies. But Bergen, that's a little different matter.
 * About the note: I'm still not happy with it being added to the Galrath quest. That it makes a lot more sense there is just your opinion. It was meant as a little heads-up for people who plan to do Falls Gods, and I don't see any harm done by it. The picture that you're painting about a poor newbie sitting in the Temple forever waiting for a party to do both Galrath and False Gods really isn't going to happen. Sorry, you don't like it. I'm putting the note back in (slightly re-worded). --Tetris L 02:17, 1 Oct 2005 (EST)


 * Are you saying: "If you are doing this quest, do Villainy also" or "If you are doing Villany, do this quest also"? If you are sying the first one, then that is ridiculous! If you are saying the latter, I put your note there, where it belongs. If you want to play a childish game with the articles of this wiki, I would advise you against that. --Karlos 02:46, 1 Oct 2005 (EST)


 * I'm saying do both together. Does it really matter which one is first? The note affects both quests, so why put it only in one of the two? That's not logical and not objective. That it "belongs" to the Galrath quest is just your very personal opinion. You edit my note, we discuss, we disagree, I revert edit. You keep saying that I have to live with your edits. Now live with mine. If that's a "childish game" then I have to ask you who started it. And I don't think any of us is in the position to "advise" the other one. Now get off my back. Thanks. --Tetris L 03:19, 1 Oct 2005 (EST)


 * And we finally reach the heart of the problem... I did not remove YOU note. This is not YOUR article. And I am certainly not sitting on your back. This is the Wiki's article. You put a lame note about this quest being done with Galrath. This quest is too trivial to be tied with Galrath. Rainith believes the same (see below). Is Rainith on your back too?
 * Saying "Do Both together" is lame advice. It's like saying if you're going to be doing Passage through the Dark river, might as well pickup Defend Denravi on your way.
 * You're convinced that this is all about you and that people editing your articles are after you but it's not. You are a creative contributor to this wiki, but if you cannot accept that others found a note you put not worthy of mention then you're going to have a lot of problems here and not just with me. --Karlos 08:52, 1 Oct 2005 (EST)

My opinion is that The False Gods is an easier quest than Galrath. The quest is even easier than getting to the Temple the first time. Saying to do this quest at the same time as Galrath is ok, if you were on your way to do Galrath. Saying to do Galrath if you were only intending to do this quest doesn't make sense to me, personaly. Just my $0.02, I don't want to get in the middle of your contest here, 'cause I don't want to get wet. :P --Rainith 03:27, 1 Oct 2005 (EST)

I added my own, objective form of Tetris L's comment. I think it's worthwhile information (I actually did the quests together too, though I started from ToA), but I agree with Karlos and Rainith that the original wording was a bit too subjective. &mdash;Tanaric 04:14, 6 Oct 2005 (EST)