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Talk:Realm of Torment

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:I also find the muddling of the Vortex and the Shadow Nexus into "possible" gates to be VERY weak. The Vortes is NOT a gate in Torment, read the discription of the Gate of Torment, it IS the Gate to the real world and the Vortex is IN the Gate of Torment, not a separate site. I also find the fact that they chose NOT to name them as "gates" actually a CLEAR argument for the opposite.
:On a side note, anyone noticed that all the gates on the RIGHT are "good" gates that were either erected by the five gods or mark important landmarks for the "good guys" and all the ones on the left mark things significant for Abaddon? --[[User:Karlos|Karlos]] 19:58, 27 November 2006 (CST)
 
::Karlos: You edited the trivia note in several respects, and I disagree, in two respects:
::1) The '''order''' of gates (and the number of zones).
::That hell has only ''one'' zone with ''seven'' entrance gates (i.e. the gates are in ''parallel'' order) is the Islamic version based on the Koran. But in ''other'' classic sources hell is clearly divided into more than one zone, and the gates/sections are often in ''sequential'' order. We shouldn't disregard these sources. To remain neutral we shouldn't state the order in the trivia note at all. The [[:Image:Realm of Torment structure.jpg|order of gates in the Realm of Torment]] is neither strictly sequential nor strictly parallel, so it doesn't match either sources anyway. But that doesn't mean that ANet wasn't influenced by the sources. As usual ArenaNet didn't try to emulate their source of inspiration but rather used it as a starting point and derived their own fiction from there.
::2) The '''number''' of gates (seven or nine)
::GuildWiki isn't the place to judge about Dante's validity or inspiration. He mixed non-Abrahamic Greek mythology influences (Virgil's description of Hades - this is where the number nine came from) with sources from the Old Testament. Dante isn't a prophet, his work isn't part of the Canon. Nevertheless you cannot possibly deny or ignore Dante's influence. His "Inferno" is probably ''THE'' main source of inspiration for modern day images of Hell in the western world. That includes ANet. In no case will I accept that this source is removed! Or, if it is, then we might as well delete the trivia note alltogether!
::The number of gates in the Realm of Torment isn't quite clear as you make it sound. Yes, 7 locations are labeled "Gate", but two of these stand out: The Gate of Nightfallen Lands (which isn't one of the "locks" of the Five Gods), and the Gate of Torment (which is the gate to the mortal world). On the other hand I insists that the Vortex and the Shadow Nexus may be counted as gates as well, even though they are not labeled as such. On top of that, I wouldn't be surprised if there was another gate in the [[Domain of Anguish]]. So that makes the number of gates anything between 5 and 9 or even and 10, depending how you count.
::But again, just like the ''order'' I don't think the ''number'' really matters. The structure of the Realm of Torment does not match the structure of hell as described in the Koran, Divina Comedia, Book of Enoch, Aeneid, nor any other classic source. It differs from '''all''' of them in one respect or another. Yet '''all''' of them may have been used for inspiration, and we should either list them '''all''' in the trivia note, or none at all.
::I will edit the trivia note again, trying to come up with a version that is as neutral as possible, but I will put the references to the Divina Comedia and the Aeneid back in, as they are ''definetly'' relevant here. --[[Image:TurningL sml.gif|Tetris L]] 09:39, 29 November 2006 (CST)
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