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how well does the dps on this stack up vs flare? irealise it probably will be less as the dmg is in 2 packets thus ignores certain skills88.106.131.8 11:50, 8 January 2007 (CST)

The dps vs the other spammable ele spells (flare, ice spear) are about on par, only real difference positive or negative comes vs what spells you might face. as the notes section indicates, this spell benefits vs reversal of fortune or damage, as well as vs prot spirit (it slips under the 10% of hp most of the time). but it does not fare so well vs shield of absorption, mantra of earth, union, healing hands, etc that get benefits per hit. against an undefended foe, i would guess the dps from flare and stone daggers to be about equal. —Damnreds.png 12:07, 8 January 2007 (CST)
Stone Daggers results in more damage packets per second but approximately equal total damage per second - higher frequency, lower amplitude. If they were graphed Damage vs Second, Stone Daggers would be nearly a straight line, while Flare would be more jagged up-and-down due to more time between damage packets. Therefore Stone Daggers is a lot like Health Degeneration whereas Flare is closer to a series of small damage spikes. This is even more true of Ice Spear, which has a higher dps than either spell but has the half-ranged drawback. In any case, Reds is right, the best spell is chosen by what buffs the target may have. Although Flare and Ice Spear both have more "utility" uses than Stone Daggers (Mark of Rodgort, Spinal Shivers, etc). Entropy 00:53, 24 January 2007 (CST)

At 16 Earth Magic with the recent buff, this does 70 damage. With 16 Water Magic, Ice Spear does 74 damage and has half range. Somehow, this seems better . . . --Son of Urza 12:40, 3 February 2007 (CST)

Shielding Hands --Kiiron 19:29, 15 February 2007 (CST)
Protective Spirit, Reversal of Fortune, etc etc. Due to the different number of packets these two skills (and Flare as well) behave rather differently in relation to many defensive skills, so I'd personally steer clear of comparing them. RossMM 21:07, 16 February 2007 (CST)

I added Shock Arrow because of the comparison of the 4 'basic' damage projectiles.

Anyone know the build of the machine gunner? I know it uses fast casting stone daggers and kinetic armor, but i don't know more then that.--Holylorgor 22:16, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

It's not really a single build, it's more of a build style, typically a Me/E with high fast casting but recently I've seen a similar E/Me build using Glyph of Swiftness for speed and not carrying Channeling (because the Attunements can be maintained). The typical bar is something like:
Stone Daggers.jpg Kinetic Armor.jpg Aura of Restoration.jpg Channeling.jpg Inspired Hex.jpg Ether Feast.jpg Earth Attunement.jpg Elemental Attunement.jpg

I don't know point distributions, but usage is cast attunements and Kinetic, maintain kinetic with Aura, spam stone daggers, and use mesmer skills as needed. Generally used with a +20% to enchant weapon and an energy focus. --Falseprophet 17:17, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Armor ?[]

Because this is two stones, is armor calculated against each separately? In effect, is the damage vastly less than Flare because each dagger alone is much smaller than the larger single hit of Flare?--Arcady 09:34, 29 November 2007 (UTC)

Yes it is. --Blue.rellik 10:15, 29 November 2007 (UTC)
Stone Daggers can only outdamage the other spammables when against things like Protective Spirit. Entropy Sig.jpg (T/C) 00:31, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
Well, it outdamages Ice Spear (which they SOMEHOW forgot tobuff when they buffed Flare, so its a half range spell that's JUST as powerful as it, rather than slightly more powerful like it used to be, as justification) up through rank 7, and ties with it until 10, after which it does more damage than this. With flare, it does the same at 10, 12, and 14, and beats it out at 13 and 15 and above --Gimmethegepgun 00:36, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
If armor halves the damage done, then 33+33/2 is still more than 65/2. Armor doesn't lower damage by a fixed amount, but rather by a percentage, so it really doesn't matter if you hit someone once for X damage or twice for X/2. For skills like Shielding Hands it would matter, because it reduces the damage by a fixed amount (so it would reduce the damage twice for Stone Daggers) 08:18, 4 December 2007 (UTC)


My gods, this thing triggers backfire twice, I just learned that the hard way!

Maybe a warning is in order! Piggyboy 09:29, 11 May 2008 (UTC)
Are you sure that it triggers twice? It sounds kind of weird...
It shouldn't trigger twice, considering it's one single spell being cast (with multiple projectiles). Silver Sunlight SSunlight.jpg 18:20, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
It doesn't. --- Ohaider!-- (s)talkpage 21:12, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Sparring Elements[]

... doesn't give this skill, as far as I can tell, or maybe I just bugged out? I have certainly done that quest (I have firestorm) with my factions character, but I don't have stone daggers. I switched my secondary to elementalist (primary mesmer) using Cembrien instead of Senji or the NF profession changer. -- Hadrian Farseeker (talk) 23:11, 15 July 2009 (UTC)